MEMBERS READ CAREFULLY!

Justice · 04-26-03, 01:19 AM

Ref GTD Supercars

Disclaimer 25.04.2003

Following recent comments made by some individual members of this forum, we have been forced to issue this disclaimer to protect our reputation and standing. Whilst we have been aware that the forum did contain items concerning us, which to a certain extent, was only to be expected following the demise of GTD.
However in the past few days it has been discovered that the site contained some highly libellous, untrue and defamatory material directed at us, these allegations are without substance and are highly offensive. Clearly some individuals are completely unaware of the potential legal ramifications and to ensure that these members involved are aware of the consequences of their comments I have contacted them, to offer them the chance to retract their comments and offer a full apology to us. Additionally, we have provided the following statement to clarify the position regarding GTD Supercars (GTD).

GTD Supercars (GTD)

GTD has been liquidated. The voluntary liquidation was brought about due to financial difficulties. Prior to liquidation we endeavoured to satisfy as many customers as we could. The vast majority of customers had their orders completed without problem. Of course it wouldn't be expected of customers who were satisfied to come onto the forum and sing the companies praises. GTD has been through strict liquidation procedures and consequently individuals should contact the liquidators if they have any on going claim against GTD.
Specific problems with customers have been dealt with on an individual basis only, it is then up to those customers whether they wish to use this forum as a platform for airing grievances, on factual basis only and without directly naming individuals. These and other forum members’ comments regarding GTD will be validated for accuracy and we reserve our position to proceed against any individual who makes incorrect, libellous or defamatory comments against either GTD Supercars (GTD) or former directors of.
Make no mistake we are disappointed that GTD had to be liquidated, over the years a substantial investment in terms of time and money was made. Sadly this has now been lost.

Spencer Marsh.

I would now like to refer to one of the allegations contained on the forum regarding me (Spencer Marsh). I am a professional racing driver, this is how I earn my living. I am well respected by organisations such as the BARC the BRDC and TOCA. It was suggested by a forum member that customers money was used to fund my racing, this is totally untrue. This can of course be substantiated by the liquidator and my sponsors. Last year I was sponsored by a large pharmaceutical company in the BTCC. My interests are looked after by a professional management company where I am viewed as their investment. My management is now aware of the defamatory and libellous comments that have been written on this site. They are highly protective and will not tolerate any tampering with my reputation in this way and will take all actions necessary to maintain my status in motorsport.
The forum member responsible for stating that GTD funds were used to support my racing has since retracted unreservedly all allegations.
I hope that this statement and disclaimer clarifies the position regarding both GTD its former directors and specifically my job as a motor racing driver.
Please be aware that you are directly responsible for what you write on an internet forum, it is advisable that members refer to an entity and avoid naming people directly unless you can fully substantiate the comments made.

This document must not be reproduced or copied.

CC Legal Team

Hershal Byrd · 04-26-03, 12:59 PM

Marsh,
You had to go back a ways to dredge up this forgotten issue. If someone on this board attacked you verbally then you contact that person and have a word with him, then you can take approprate action. I don't like the idea that you come in here and start up old news because you feel it has damaged your reputation. If that be the case then seek a good attorney and go for it. I've been in law enforcement my whole life. I have read more legal depositions,court room documents, and supeonas than you have laps in a race car.
The point here is that your posting here is laughable.
I would have appreciated it if you would have pointed out the "highly libellous, untrue and defamatory material" that you referred to. Contacting the parties involved and adivising them was all you needed to do. Coming into this board served you no purpose but to try and get a one up or to start more controversy.
So what's with the legal terms and subliminal threats regarding attornies as " CC legal team? You don't come on a forum and settle legal disputes.
Marsh Quote...
"My interests are looked after by a professional management company where I am viewed as their investment. My management is now aware of the defamatory and libellous comments that have been written on this site. They are highly protective and will not tolerate any tampering with my reputation in this way and will take all actions necessary to maintain my status in motorsport. "
Now that's a hoot ! Any organization worth their salt wouldn't allow a client to come onto a public forum and make such a statement. The only tampering with your reputation is by you coming in here with an attitude.
Might I suggest that if you don't want this post of yours reproduced or copied then use the edit function and delete it.
I got my copy in case I'm hauled into court. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]
Marsh, don't go away mad, just go away !
[img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

I, Hershal Byrd am totally responsible for the content of this message and take full credit for it's content. This forum has no responsibility for my words.

Hersh [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

PS...Sorry Ron, that's how I feel about this rubbish

Mark Worthington · 04-26-03, 02:35 PM

What Hershal said.

Mr. Marsh, regardless what you believe your reputation as a racecar driver to be, I can assure you that your abysmal reputation within the GT40 community was not helped one bit by your post here. All I can add is that this time last year I was considering purchasing a GTD from the entity that used to be your company, and that I am extremely grateful that I did not do any business with you.

Finally, your post was pathetic, particularly the weak-nut legal threats and the mandate not to copy your post. FWIW, I've archived this thread to my hard drive just for giggles.

Have a good day. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Bill Bayard · 04-26-03, 03:53 PM

To whom it may concern,

If Mr.M. wants to clear up his
"tarnished reputation", here on the Forum, the why doesn't he enlighten us to all the facts. The demise of XXX was never an issue. Businesses do go under, a sad fact,
especially in the case of a GTXX builder,
however, the conduct of said business owners,
is certainly an issue for those directly involved with said defunct business.
The true facts,surrounding the loss/recovery of monies by customers,should be the topic of Mr.M's post(s), not a veiled threat, or an attempt to force a change of opinion about this matter, based on less than those facts.
How about it Mr.M.? Where's the beef?
Either come clean, or go away! Or come clean, and then go away!
The above is the opinion of it's author, and hence, this forum, and it's other members should be held harmless.

Mr. B.

cc: The Dream Team

Torn40 · 04-26-03, 04:16 PM

This has no place here. A Forum is a place to air a point of view or offer an opinion and perhaps information. I think a lawyer would be very hard pushed to prove that someone actually wrote something on this forum. My personal rule of thumb is 'don't believe everything you read on the internet' as it not checked or validated by a credible source. Furthermore, I feel that talking in such a manner on this forum is somewhat offensive to others. This is not a court of law and I am not under oath.

In my view you are making a statement to clear YOUR reputation and absolve blame using bully boy tactics by including the threat of legal action. Perhaps it is time for some self-reflection. In my experience when someone makes a comment about your behaviour...they usually have a point. [img]images/icons/mad.gif[/img]

Howard Jones · 04-26-03, 04:19 PM

Marsh, If you are paying for your legal advice then I think I have a ruff idea of your management skills. If you are racing cars with these same skills, please be careful.

MK -IV J6 · 04-26-03, 05:45 PM

Mr Marsh
Please be advised of the following. There is a document kept safe under argon gas in Washington DC. that people who IMHO are a lot braver than you gave their lives protecting. How dare your pathatic attempt at restricting ANYONES opionion. We pushed your ancestors back accross the sea once for trying to deny us the right to our opinions and freedoms and as the world has recently seen we'll do it again.
James M. Glickenhaus

Brett James-McCall · 04-26-03, 07:48 PM

My best suggestion if anyone wants to make a 'suggestion' would to be to preclude such a statement with a sentance such as this:

"I the undersigned present the following words as my own opinion, which has been concluded from facts that have been presented to me and I beleive to be true. If such information is not true then I hold the right to be able to retract such a statement upon such evidence that would be able to recide such a statement that has been verified by independent witnesses or via a legal system."

... either that or we could all grow up! How many times must we go through this! I totally respect Ron and Hershal for the work they do with this forum by bringing us all together. I consider this a place for meeting like minded people who enjoy sharing information, a love of the GT and where permittable a beer or two ( or three or four.....)

This is no place for threats! If there has been an infraction of someones rights then take it to the right place and if found to be correct then a proper apology should be place on this forum in the suitable manner. We are all adults and not in a playground anymore.

BTW on slightly pedantic note... JUSTICE please could you forward the programme to all the forum memebers that will alow the Temorary Internet file of this page to be deleted, to comply with your request of the information not to be copied. In addition, please could you contact all the ISPs involved to ensure that such information that you are obviously considering to be proprietory to be deleted from their caches...

(sorry everbody else for the rant, I object to my ability to communicate and express myself freely being suppressed)

MK -IV J6 · 04-26-03, 09:49 PM

Bandit is of course right.The people I'm talking about is ANYONE including Americans who would attempt to abridge the rights and freedoms that are gaurenteed by the constitution and the bill of rights. Since 1812 we've managed to get along quite well with our Cousins from accross the pond.

[ April 26, 2003: Message edited by: MK -IV J6 ]

Bigend · 04-27-03, 01:55 AM

Well done Hersh!

Canuk40 · 04-27-03, 01:56 AM

GT40 enthusiasts are very fortunate to have an on line forum like this, however Flame Wars serve no purpose.

Members certainly have the right to express thier opinions and make others aware of firms not holding up thier end of the bargain.

Is there merit to the idea that if a topic turns nasty the moderators should be able to post a message stating that an issue invloving these parties has been taken off line and the individuals asked to resolve it between themselves?

Headings like Manufacturers News and Consumer Watch serve important purposes however they shouldn't be hijacked to promote an unobjective or biased view point!

Obviously, if a company has gone out of business or constistantly turns out substandard products or service the facts should remain (pending responce of the company involved).

I love reading about and seeing pics of who's cars just been completed or solutions offered to challenges faced by kit builders or about all the new parts becoming available to super detail the GT40 replicas.

Lets keep cool heads here and not waste this valuable resource.

I don't know of another car that turns heads or breaks hearts like the GT40, we are truly a lucky bunch, so hug your wife, kiss your babies and thank God you have the bucks to enjoy this hobby!

Ian Clark
President
CAV Canada MotoSports Inc.

Peter D · 04-27-03, 06:47 AM

Howard - well said, its the "Put-Down Of The Decade" !

Peter D. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

6 trains · 04-30-03, 07:04 AM

To All Concerned.
Had we not have had to wait 12 months on our parts from GTD Supercars and all contact stopped on their part our problem would neverhave been aired on the Forum. If it wasn't for the efforts of some people on the Forum and others included we would possibly have neverachieved the resolution. We were totally unsatisfied with the promises that weren't delivered on.
Paying half deposit in January 2002 (quoting from email If you can send us a 50% deposit then we will proceed with your order. We can have your parts on the way within 16 days)Final payment was made on 1st March 2002. Lots of emails to and fro in the meantime questioning and prompting the whereabouts of our parts and when to expect them etc., Last contact questioning our parts (quoting from email-25th October 2002 [i]your parts have departed, they are in the hands of our parcel courier so they are on the way. I will contact you on Tuesday regarding consignment details so you can trace your parcel)Needless to say that Tuesday never came nor did any consignment details...to this day! Finally parts are in NZ on January 19th 2003.We had no bill of lading which caused major headaches, not to count the daily calls to freight company and further afield. On 11 February 2003 we were allowed to uplift them after having REPAIDthe shipping freight, which HADalready been paid to GTD Supercars. Most disheartning of all was once the crate was opened to find only three quarters of our parts included. Plus paying GST (VAT) on the whole total of parts, can only be refunded if we produce a signed document by GTD Supercars saying that those parts were not in the crate! Once again I quote from email all of which are on file (all your parts will be included)
So our question to you Spencer is this why back in January 2002 on a promise of a 16day delivery and after receiving 50% payment IN GOOD FAITH, then the final balance on 1st March 2002,IN GOOD FAITH,did we find ourselves on the 11th February 2003 13 months later having to now pay MORE money, only to find you hadn't even fulfulled the order that was placed? Surely this can't have anythiing to do with GTD Supercars going into liquidation in November 2002?? Did you ever have any intention of completing the order?? I hate to think what would have happened if we didn't have some friends in the UK start to look into our problem late 2002. Hopefully this will be the last the Forum will hear from us until our car is rebuilt and back on the road. Our heartfelt thanks to those once again who helped us.
Clyde and Suzanne Thompson. New Zealand.

charles · 04-30-03, 11:07 AM

Spencer, IF any or all of Clyde's remarks in this posting are "highly libellous", "untrue" or "defamatory" you MUST take further advice from your "Legal Team" and if necessary, take matters further.

Such allegations could be construed as highly damaging to the reputations of the directors of GTD.

Of course, a petition for libel will only be successful if the allegations are false...

In the meantime, Clyde, you have my sincerest sympathy. Having a 40 is expensive enough as it is, even without all of this. I really wish you the best with your build.

Please keep us up to date.

Charles

meat · 05-04-03, 10:11 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Justice:
Ref GTD Supercars

Disclaimer 25.04.2003

Following recent comments made by some individual members of this forum, we have been forced to issue this disclaimer to protect our reputation and standing. Whilst we have been aware that the forum did contain items concerning us, which to a certain extent, was only to be expected following the demise of GTD.
However in the past few days it has been discovered that the site contained some highly libellous, untrue and defamatory material directed at us, these allegations are without substance and are highly offensive. Clearly some individuals are completely unaware of the potential legal ramifications and to ensure that these members involved are aware of the consequences of their comments I have contacted them, to offer them the chance to retract their comments and offer a full apology to us. Additionally, we have provided the following statement to clarify the position regarding GTD Supercars (GTD).

GTD Supercars (GTD)

GTD has been liquidated. The voluntary liquidation was brought about due to financial difficulties. Prior to liquidation we endeavoured to satisfy as many customers as we could. The vast majority of customers had their orders completed without problem. Of course it wouldn't be expected of customers who were satisfied to come onto the forum and sing the companies praises. GTD has been through strict liquidation procedures and consequently individuals should contact the liquidators if they have any on going claim against GTD.
Specific problems with customers have been dealt with on an individual basis only, it is then up to those customers whether they wish to use this forum as a platform for airing grievances, on factual basis only and without directly naming individuals. These and other forum members’ comments regarding GTD will be validated for accuracy and we reserve our position to proceed against any individual who makes incorrect, libellous or defamatory comments against either GTD Supercars (GTD) or former directors of.
Make no mistake we are disappointed that GTD had to be liquidated, over the years a substantial investment in terms of time and money was made. Sadly this has now been lost.

Spencer Marsh.

I would now like to refer to one of the allegations contained on the forum regarding me (Spencer Marsh). I am a professional racing driver, this is how I earn my living. I am well respected by organisations such as the BARC the BRDC and TOCA. It was suggested by a forum member that customers money was used to fund my racing, this is totally untrue. This can of course be substantiated by the liquidator and my sponsors. Last year I was sponsored by a large pharmaceutical company in the BTCC. My interests are looked after by a professional management company where I am viewed as their investment. My management is now aware of the defamatory and libellous comments that have been written on this site. They are highly protective and will not tolerate any tampering with my reputation in this way and will take all actions necessary to maintain my status in motorsport.
The forum member responsible for stating that GTD funds were used to support my racing has since retracted unreservedly all allegations.
I hope that this statement and disclaimer clarifies the position regarding both GTD its former directors and specifically my job as a motor racing driver.
Please be aware that you are directly responsible for what you write on an internet forum, it is advisable that members refer to an entity and avoid naming people directly unless you can fully substantiate the comments made.

This document must not be reproduced or copied.

CC Legal Team<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The American Civil Liberties Union protects the freedoms of all people. To quote a bit, the Internet may be the most perfect embodiment of the American ideals of free speech, open communication, and the "marketplace of ideas" that has ever existed. As the Supreme Court has written, online "any person with a phone line can become a town crier with a voice that resonates farther than it could from any soapbox."

If you choose to file sue for libel (which would be the correct thing to do; lots of people threaten to sue for slander), and you seek to have those voices silenced or remove content from a website, that is tantamount to censorship, and the ACLU will vigorously defend any and all attacks like that ... either by you or by your legal team. And they will do so at no cost to the person you are attempting to silence.

Also, because this site is part of the internet, and does cross state as well as country lines, they will sue in every state where this website reaches. Which means you will be forced to defend yourself in all fifty states, and in whichever countries the remaining parties wish to sue you in, assuming that you cannot prove libel has occurred.

Please also note that you posted on a forum where no copyright notice is placed. This forum is owned by Ron Earp, not "Justice" or "Spencer Marsh." Because you have posted this way, and have published no notice of copyright on your document, the post may be freely reproduced and copied, unless and until such time as Ron Earp says that it cannot.

I did have some questions for you, however. I do have the contact numbers for BARC, BRDC and TOCA. But I do not have the name or address of your professional management company. If you could post that, I'd appreciated it. I'd like to forward on along the questions I have, as well as all of the threads on the different boards I read about you to see if they are aware of them.

Thanks in advance for your cooperation.

Your pal,
Meat.

P.S. it's been 40 days.

Robert Logan · 05-05-03, 02:22 AM

Meat,

Good to see you back on the FORUM. Has it been 40 days and 40 nights since we last read your words of wisdom.

I must support you on this isue. It is this lack of responsibility and accountability that has tarnished the kit car industry that we all love so much. It is also these people that used my GOOD name in VEIN to try and start a GT40 series in Europe.

GTD were an excellent car company with Ray Christopher at the helm and it was the quality that they set as the market leaders that I aspired to. There is a total void of a GOOD manufacturer in the UK in particular and in Europe in general and this is a real shame. I just hope that the GT40 family in the UK can embrace a new manufacturer when one appears and are not soiled by the lack of service of the current GTD owners.

Best wishes to all (especially Meat ),

Robert

imsa · 05-05-03, 04:14 AM

Now this is an amusing thread. It looks like someone is under the mistaken impression that the best defense is a good offence. After reading the various replies it looks as though someone is sadly mistaken [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img]. Hershal, love the color of you GT40 and the Mustang hood locks are a great idea. MK-IV J6, I’ve never seen so much money in one driveway before as in the pictures you’ve posted on the Ferrari board. Hope all is well with everyone.

IMSA [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]