GT40 NA

[Ron Earp]

http://www.gt40na.com/

This is what the NZ company has or is turning into. Nice site, but not a lot of info yet.

R

[Fran Hall RCR]

Ron,
I do not want to speak out of turn but I have it on very good information that the NZ(New Zealand) side of this company no longer has any interest in the NA(North America) side of the company.
I would hope that someone closer to the heart of the issue can shed more light on the situation.
Car looks nice ,though not a traditional replica but a modern interpretation of a GT40 supercar.... from pictures I have seen "sneak peak pictures"
http://members19.clubphoto.com/alain...ner-44bd.phtml

[Alain Vanhollebeke]

Hi Ron & everyone,
since I was the first "dealer" in the USA for GT40NZ, perhaps I can help with some of the confusion/questions about them.

I do know that there are currently 4 GT40NZ "kits" being assembled in the USA.
Scott in San FranCisco, Neal in Seattle, Denis in New England, and I have one myself.

I was really impressed with the kit and spent about 8 months working out a deal with the folks in New Zealand, to become a dealer for them.
I spent many hours with Dave and Richard in NZ, figuring/planning on what a good "kit" package should include,,,and what parts could be left for the builder to obtain from "off the shelf" sources.
During that time, we also worked out alot of little improvements to the original design, in order to get more legroom, safer fuel fillers etc.

I was really excited about getting started, and ordered 4 kits in addition to my first one.

Shortly after that, Denis (in New England) had agreed to be the dealer for his area and also ordered two kits.

Things were looking good, except were having delays from NZ and it was becoming apparent that they would not be able to finish the kits on schedule, (as they were used to producing them one at a time).

By now, Bob Hantcher(sorry if I misspelled it), had also contacted NZ to see what he could do to get involved.
Bob, is a big fan of the GT40 (as the rest of us are), and happens to have a background in professional auto racing.
Initially, the guys from NZ came to the USA and met with everyone, then agreed to send unfinished chassis to Bob & associates (GT40NA) in Indianapolis for final assembly.
I would then take delivery of my cars from GT40NA in Indianapolis, so that I could take car of retail sales, maintenaince,service, and any warranty work at my shop.

Eventually, it was decided that the entire car could be assembled in Indianapolis, on a more timely basis, and using the highest quality/caliber construction methods available.

The GT40NZ kits are no longer available in the USA, and I believe that the NZ folks are no longer producing kits.

This leaves us with the GT40NA car, which is only available in a turn-key form.
I have been to the factory in Indianapolis twice now and believe me, these are more like "street legal rocketships" they are building than just replicas.

The guys at GT40NA have taken a more "modern" approach to some aspects of the car like an updated interior.
I hope more info gets posted on the website about the team at GT40NA, because they are all trying to build the highest caliber supercars possible.

The chief engineer on the project is Andrew Broadley (again, sorry if my spelling is wrong). Those who have read anything at all about the original GT40s, know that Eric Broadley, Andrew's father was the designer of the original Lola GT.
When I met Andrew, he showed me the pieces he had designed for the gearbox and shifter assembly for the cars. It is almost a shame to install the pieces on the car, because each one is artwork on it's own.

The cars are being assembled in an Indy car race shop, by Indy car techs and engineers. The standard body is a carbon fiber composite, along with carbon fiber inner panelling where you would other wise find aluminum.
The first 5 cars from GT40NA were "updated" versions of GT40NZ chassis cars, which I currently have #4.

Andrew and team are currently finishing the totally redesigned chassis, which will be inproduction soon.

I do hope all interested, go to the GT40NA site and look it over....especially the "news" section, as most of the press releases & history is there.

I do have a finished GT40NA (car #4) at my shop right now.
It has a 351 engine in it and has the leather interior with the GT40NA insignia embroidered into the headrests. I picked it up a little early, so I am buttoning up a few things on it myself at the shop. Anyone can stop in and see it in person during shop hours, or I can arrange to show it after hours also.
Test drives are reserved for serious inquiries at this point. Let me assure you that it will go faster than you would want to on any public road, in a matter of a few seconds!

Well, there's the story in about as condensed a form as I can put it.
The bad news is that you can not buy a GT40NZ "kit" anymore,,,,unless someone wishes to make an offer for mine,,,,as I would prefer to sell it and buy a GT40NA for myself at this point. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

The good news is, if you want a high end, turnkey, no excuses GT40, I happen to have one in stock,,,,ready for delivery......with more available. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Also, I apologize, for I am not very computer saavy,,,,but if you would like to see some pictures of car #4,go to the club photo link under my signiture.
I hope this helps clear things up a bit.
Alain

[Hershal Byrd]

Hi Alain,
The pictures on the site look good. I was wondering who is supplying your body parts. Did you purchase the molds from GT40NZ. Are the guys from New Zealand still involved with GT40NA in some capacity? What about the fiberglass tub? Have you redesigned that in carbonfiber or are you paneling that area in aluminum?

Hersh [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[BuzzClarke]

Alain,

Nice response. At least you've eliminated any confusion which can't be said for what was going on with the CAV situation.

Regards, Buzz

[DENIS]

OK, So heres my take on the situation. I worked with GT40NZ to establish a northeast dealership. I bought 2 kits right off.One I am building,the other went to Bob Hancher in Indi.That's when things went to @#$@.I had
plenty of potential buyers for the GT40NZ kits. Then Bob took charge. That's when I was told that the kit deal was no longer a priority and that everything would be going thru Indy and that they only wanted to sell completed turn key's.I spent alot of time with potential buyers that wanted various stages of GT's. That was all wasted time from then on. I just received my last back-orderded parts last week. Dave at GT40NZ has been doing his best to supply me with what I needed.It is my opinion that GT 40 NZ would have been better off selling the product that they sold me and many more, than get into bed with the outfit in Indi.They had what was to be one of the best GT40 kits available to you and me.Unfortunately that's how it goes.I will finish my GT and enjoy it anyway.As for GT40NA, Best wishes. Denis

[Alain Vanhollebeke]

The bodies are being made in Indianapolis, along with the new chassis.
The factory at Indy has the capabilities of fabricating their own molds, own chassis,and the latest high tech equipment to make about anything they need.
Heck, when I was given a tour of the assembly shop, I asked what the building was adjacent to the main one & was told,,,,,
"oh, that's the wind tunnel building!"
These guys build 200 plus mph Indy cars in this facility.....

The chassis "table" jig, alone looks like nothing I have ever seen before. You aren't going to find hardware store sheet metal screws and duct tape in this place.
I hope they put some pics of the assembly area and the fabrication capabilities on the site soon, as it is truly state of the art.

The inside flooring & tub of the car is now a combination of steel and aluminum.





In answer to the question about the guys from New Zealand still being involved in any capacity.

NO, it is my understanding that New Zealand is no longer involved.

This is a "sensitive" area, as Dave in New Zealand was not delivering what he had promissed.
I had believed in Dave and his people engough to put a deposit on four kits,(in April of 2002) which he never delivered to me,,,after countless delays and excuses.

He did manage to deliver two kits to Denis, which I am certain were cars I had paid for, and a couple of chassis to the folks in Indianapolis.

The folks in Indy made a substancial investment with Dave and also never recieved anything near what they were sold.

Bob and the folks in Indy have made the best of a bad situation, and they have honored Dave's original commitment with me,,,,,,which they were not obligated to do.

I have found Bob to be an honest man of his word,,,,,,which is much more than I can say about Dave in new Zealand.

I would like to try and keep my comments about Dave and company in New Zealand,to a minimum, as I now no longer have any reasons to deal with them myself.


I will say that the issues with New Zealand, have in no way hurt the determination of the folks in Indy to build an excellent car.

[Lola T70]

As a result of recent posts I have felt you all deserve our perspective.

First I must say that it is rather unfortunate that Alain and Denis consider that they have had less than excellent service from GT40 NZ. I will be calling Alain and Denis soon to apologise for this.

Second, Alain and Denis go a long way to explain the history of this situation and there is little that I can add apart from:

1) Denis is absolutely right by saying that it may have been better for us not to have entered into a deal with GT40NA (this is not to be construed as any criticism of GT40 NA).

2) Alain was not aware of all the details in the contract between GT40NA and GT40 NZ, as he was not a party to the contract. The contract stated that GT40 NZ would not supply Alain with the cars and that these cars would be sent to GT40 NA who in turn would supply them to Alain as he opted to deal directly with GT40 NA. That is precisely what happened. Denis preferred to be supplied by GT40 NZ. There was no financial disadvantage to Alain in any way.

The only minor incorrect point in what has been said so far is that we no longer produce GT40 kits. We do and it is business as usual.

The truth is that both GT40 NZ and GT40NA grossly underestimated the logistics and complexities of re-designing the car while at the same time ramping up monthly production by a factor of 4 in the short timeframe we gave ourselves. It was a mistake, and one that we both paid dearly for. But such is life, and past mistakes only make you stronger if you can learn the lessons. We have learned. GT40NA has decided to go its own way and we understand that.

We have also decided to pursue our direction with some interesting new developments to be announced in the very near future. Suffice to say that we have finished re-designing the chassis to make it lighter, cheaper while at the same time stronger. Very soon we will publish the results (and the price).

In the meantime, we have one complete rolling GT40 chassis with body available for immediate delivery at a reduced price to clear old stock. If you are genuinely interested drop me a line.

Best wishes for all,

Dave Harvey

[Alain Vanhollebeke]

" Alain was not aware of all the details in the contract between GT40NA and GT40 NZ, as he was not a party to the contract."

Dave is absolutely right on this one. I was NOT aware of the details between GT40NZ and GT40NA. Of course, I already had an existing agreement with GT40NZ, and had been waiting for my first four kits for months with constant delays and excuses (as to why they weren't ready), before Dave even mentioned to me that he was working on a deal with the folks at GT40NA.

The agreement I had with GT40NZ obligated me to send a 50 percent deposit on my orders, and I had to commit to a minimum of 8 kits per year. I lived up to my end of the agreement and immediately order four kits & wired my deposit.
GT40NZ was supposed to have my order ready in three months, so I waited patiently. 3 months passed, then 4, then 5,6 and so on,yet no kits were sent to me.
I did keep in continuous contact with Dave?GT40NZ during that time via e-mail (which I have saved many) and telephone.
He always was eager to tell me of new changes, new improvements,and it was "just a few weeks away from being ready".
I was becoming increasingly concerned, when one day, Dave calls me to tell me he has, "great news".
This is when he told me of his intention of suppyling chassis and bodies to GT40NA, and GT40NA would be the US distributor to all of the dealer network in the USA.

"The contract stated that GT40 NZ would not supply Alain with the cars and that these cars would be sent to GT40 NA who in turn would supply them to Alain as he opted to deal directly with GT40 NA."

This brings us to October of 2003 when Dave came to visit me at my shop. He showed me, myDad and a couple of my customers CAD/drawing of this new super cool monocoque and fed me a big salespitch about how they were going to build these monocoques in NZ, send them to GT40NA, where GT40NA would install their carbon fiber bodies and finish the cars.

Dave then "offered" me the choice of either,

#1:shipping me the original four kits I had ordered, but no longer supplying me with anything as he now would be exclusively supplying chassis to GT40NA.

(I passed on this option, as Dave had already had my money now, for over 7 months (I have copies of the cheques),,,,and had yet to deliver anything....
I knoew he did not have four finished cars to send me, and at thispoint did not trust him to actually send four completed kits as promised.

option #2:he offered to send me two kits that were supposedly nearly ready to ship, since I had already paid for half and order of four kits. Again, after all of the excuses and delays, I knew the chances were real slim that the kits would arrive "complete".

option #3: I could agree to have my deposit "balance" transferred towards a car from GT40NA, and Dave would reimburse me a percentage of what I had originally deposited.

I opted for option 3, as I figured this was my best chance of recouperating my inivestment and still be able to be involved in GT40 replicas. Seeing the Denis ,"just last week" finally got the rest of his back ordered parts, I know I made the right decision.
Also, the folks at GT40NA have shown outstanding character, in doing everything they can to make the best of this situation. They are dedicated to producing a great GT40 replica,and are doing so as we speak. I know I can drive to Indiana anytime, visit the factory, and actually SEE cars being built!!!! and being built by craftsmen who assemble full on racing cars everyday! I know I made the right choice, because the foks in Indiana don't give me excuses or delays,,,,,they are focused on building cars.

"There was no financial disadvantage to Alain in any way. "
You have got to be kidding, right?
How about the fact that I sent you payment for two kits (1/2 deposit for 4 of them actually) and saw nothing from it until March of this year, when I picked up my completed car at GT40NA.
....how about the fact that I sent you my deposit, and was promised that my kits would be ready to deliver in three motnhs, so I could start to see some positive cashflow in four or five months after my initial investment???
(I'm, only thankful, that I wasn't dumb enough to take any deposits for the people who were waiting for those "NZ" kits to arrive.)

How much interest do you think I lost on the funds I sent with you , which you had use of for over 7 months?
YOu used me to help bankroll your business, and now you want to call and apologize. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] Don't bother.


"The only minor incorrect point in what has been said so far is that we no longer produce GT40 kits. We do and it is business as usual. "
Oh, excuse me, I suppose I did make a mistake in assuming you no longer produce kits. Glad to hear it's "business as usual", there. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

"We have also decided to pursue our direction with some interesting new developments to be announced in the very near future. Suffice to say that we have finished re-designing the chassis to make it lighter, cheaper while at the same time stronger. Very soon we will publish the results (and the price)."
hmmmm, this sounds very verrry familiar....now where have I heard something like that before????? hmmmmmmm.

I do wish to apologize to Ron and my fellow GT40 friends/enthusiasts on the site. I did not want this thread to become a pissing contest, nor did I even plan to go into too much Detail about Dave and his sale's pitches.
......but I refuse to sit back and let any of you be possibly missled either.
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

[Brian Kissel]

Alain, I don't see this as a pissing contest, only a statement of the facts as you see them. I personally have had the same problem with some companies requiring large deposits. They have a tendency to use your deposit money for R&D, and sometimes eventuly deliver a product. If you read my posts on Arao cylinder heads, you will see what I mean. I wish you the best in your venture with the people in Indiana. With the positive part, of being able to go there and see what the problem is or isn't. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Regards Brian

[Bill D]

GT NZ was a much better run company when Phil Ware owned it.

Bill D

[Mike Dozier]

Bill

I got the impression that Phil was not really interested
in expanding GT40NZ to become a larger player in the GT40
market. One advantage of keeping a very low output (ERA)
is that it's much easier to run the business.

It appears Dave wanted to expand GT40NZ and that effort
didn't go as planned. I have my opinions as to why...
but I hate being second guessed so I won't criticize Dave.
However this situation certainly helps perpetuate the poor image of the "Kit Car" Industry.

MikeD

[Ron Earp]

There is no need to apologize to me. I encourage frankness on the forum and wish there was more of it. If I've ever indicated differently I am sorry.

The purpose of this forum is to keep facts straight and that is all I'm interested in. I moderate the forums heavily when I am around, but basically to to make sure posts are in their proper location so information can be retrieved at a future date - my pet peeve is forums with little or no moderation that all topics to fly all over. This results in a forum that is basically unusable when, in two years, you know you saw something about a lightened flywheel for a porsche/SB Ford applications and you can't find it now. Other than categories and placement I say motor on.

[Pete.]

Alain, no need to apologise, nothing like a "robust debate"
to keep the forum interesting. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]"No tree is too big for a short dog to lift his leg on". [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Ron Earp]

There is some discussion of the NAGT40 over on Club Cobra:

CLub Cobra Link

Looks like some nice cars and they're asking $115k for Alain's yellow car. Tube frame, modifications from the GT40 NZ car with improvements.