Problems with Jay Cushman

[Jim Rosenthal]

Several months ago I was contacted by Jay Cushman of Cushman Competition, who wanted to sell me parts to complete my GT40 project. Jay owns a number of original bits, or bits taken off original cars, at any rate, and was making copies of them. Some of these items were things I needed for 1149. One thing Jay offered to do was complete the pedal box assembly- I had only the castings and needed quite a few other things to make the pedal assembly work.

My dealings with Jay have been a decidedly mixed bag. Jay does know a lot about GT40s and some of the things he has supplied to me have been fine- the rear sway bar, for example. But the pedal box is STILL incomplete after months, although it has a lot more on it than it did. I finally took the box down the street to a machinist to have the balance bar bushing made up- the one that Jay promised me not more than four or five times and that I never got. For the pedal box, Jay also owes me the captive nut strips that help anchor the pedal assembly to the top of the footbox, the dead pedal/footrest which I am sure I will never see, and so on. For the sway bars, he owes me the plastic bushings which go inside the aluminum pivot blocks that mount the sway bars. So the bottom line on Jay is that after MANY phone calls and emails (all of the most recent ones unanswered, by the way), I have some of the pieces I need to complete various parts of the car- but hardly anything that was sent to me complete. Some of the parts that Jay sent me I haven't used yet, like the window hinge assemblies, so I don't know whether I have everything that I need to make them work. If the past is prologue, I'm sure I am in for fresh frustrations as I figure out what he left out and what I will need to get from other sources to make all this stuff go together and do what it's intended to do.

Jay is also immune to any criticism. Excuses abound (he's traveling, he's racing, he's photographing GT40s, etc etc). Lectures also abound (1149 isn't original, the front uprights look terrible, etc) Note that this is someone who approached ME- I didn't come to him asking for parts: he emailed ME asking to sell me parts to go on this project. And while I am glad that things have moved along a bit, a realistic assessment is exactly that- things have moved along a bit- and the amount of effort and time I have put into getting these pieces is staggering.

As I've posted before, the quality of what Jay does is good. (some of the photos he's posted are of my car's stuff) Since the car isn't running yet, we don't know know how well this stuff WORKS- we do know that it LOOKS good and for the most part, it fits. We also know that Jay is difficult to deal with, unreliable about getting stuff to you and returning calls and emails, very prone indeed to tiresome lecturing about GT40s, and kind of a prima donna. So, once again, I got less than I paid for. After spending considerable money with a vendor who sought my business, and getting less than I ought to have gotten, things have moved along a bit, but not as far as they should have moved, and overall the experience has not been a good one.

Yelling and screaming about this sort of thing isn't my style. Those of you who know me are aware that I'm a fairly patient guy and that it takes a long time to get me to this sort of level of pique. I also try to be publicly appreciative of those folks who are helping me along the difficult and long path of trying to create a 1960's Ford race car from scratch. So this is a mixed review of Jay, to say the least- a lot put in on my part, quite a bit less gotten out, and generally an experience that started out with a lot of promises and ended up as far less than it ought to have been. Keep this in mind, everyone, when you hear similar promises from the same source. I am interested to hear if anyone else has had similar problems; do the parts work, do they fit, has your customer experience been better.worse than mine?

Jim Rosenthal
Annapolis, MD

 

[MWGT40]

Jim

I can tell you that I have had similar problems to what you have experienced except that the quality of what I received was also poor as well. I ordered a Gurney Weslake engine to be built on a Dart aluminium block from Jay on 6 January 2008. The engine was supposed to be ready "in 8 weeks maximum" so I could race it for the 2008 season. However, as of today, it is not even in my car and will not be until the end of the 2009 season. So what happened? Here are the details:

1. The engine build progressed much more slowly than planned with various excuses given along the way by Jay and Brad Watson, his engine builder (I won't bore you with all the detail here). Finally the engine was despatched to me on 24 June with it arriving in the UK at the beginning of July. So the engine was received mid-season taking 6 months instead of the 2 months that was originally promised.

2. However, when the engine arrived there were lots of items that Jay had agreed to provide that were missing. Further, the build quality was suspect so Frank Catt had She Devil Racing Services do a visual inspection of the engine. The report issued is copied below:

Frank
Visual inspection Gurney Weslake

Second hand water pump ( repainted exterior )
Porous water manifold (filled with Epoxy resin) – additional porosity in valley ( see photos )
New throttle linkage binding badly on bearings because of distortion in welding
Carbs incomplete missing various parts including throttle links
Carb manifold studs too short
Sump leaks round weld on nut due to faulty welding (Dip stick tube fitting )
No loctite on flywheel bolts and oil leakage around rear crankshaft seal (if we re dyno should be able to pinpoint leak)
Light rust in cylinder bores and light oxidisation corrosion on tops of pistons
Rocker studs shortened by hacksaw – not machined

Vacuum test in HG acceptable minimum being 600
Inlet 1 = 480 Exhaust 1 = 725
2 = 400 2 = 725
3 = 325 3 = 725
4 = 650 4 = 700
5 = 550 5 = 680
6 = 250 6 = 600
7 = 500 7 = 725
8 = 625 8 = 725

Unfortunately when engine was shipped they fitted carburettors with old foam filters that had degredated to fine dust that has dropped down the intake ports and behind the valves, which could possibly lead to the poor readings in the vacuum test

Leakdown test normal figures would be between 10% and 20%

1 = 22%
2 = 36%
3 = 42%
4 = 18%
5 = 16%
6 = 40%
7 = 20%
8 = 26%

Tappet clearance in thou

Inlet 1 = .002 Exhaust 1 = .001
2 = .003 2 = .004
3 = .003 3 = .002
4 = .001 4 = .002
5 = .001 5 = .001 Tappets marked .001 – no clearance.
6 = .002 6 = .001
7 = .001 7 = .003
8 = .006 8 = .006

Regards

Dave SDS RACING SERVICES

3. Naturally I took up these issues with Jay and Brad Watson who made various excuses and assured me that they would follow up and supply the items that should have been shipped to enable the completion of this engine and preparation for Dyno testing by Peter Knight. Besides minor parts, the parts that were promised but not supplied included:

(i) the thermostat cover/outlet pipe casting and gaskets;
(ii) the special exhaust header pipe flanges to cylinder heads and gaskets;
(iii) the phenolic spacers provided for the carbs (as the ones provided were not useable)
(iv) the full specification sheet of ALL of the measurements and clearances used in the build

4. As for the expoxy resin on the manifold, I decided to wait until the engine was tested on the dyno to decide whether that would work (as Jay claimed it would) or not. At this point, after losing faith in Jay, I decided to have SDS do a further investigation on the engine by removing the sump and their report is below:

14 October 2008

Gurney Engine

On removal of sump I found the following points

The Cam shaft retaining washer had been ground with a slot to clear the cam drive pin rather than just shortening the pin

A standard oil pump drive had been fitted to the high volume oil pump

The trap doors around the oil pick up were held closed with the retaining wires. This is probably the cause of the drop in oil pressure when the engine saw rpm on the dyno.

The sump was still touching two main caps despite these being extensively ground off and in my view would have probably led to cracks or holes in time with engine vibration.

5. I finally received the cam card on 6 January 2009 - exactly one year after ordering the engine. Some of the other items promised arrived in December 2008, others did not arrive at all and I simply gave up chasing for them. I decided to send the engine for a dyno test at Knight Racing Services in Daventry. Peter Knight is very well known and respected in the UK and has a lot of experience with Gurney Weslake engines. The good news was that the engine generated 530 BHP and 531Ft/Lb which was in line with what was promised. The bad news was that the quality issues we had seen on the engine were confirmed. This time SD Racing Services and Wealden Engineering (Frank Catt) were asked to strip down the engine completely and produce a comprehensive report which is reproduced below:

Cushman Gurney Weslake Engine

The Engine ordered by Martin Weigold as a replacement unit for GTD40 (6GTD) arrived after considerable delays at my workshop in July 2008.

Initial inspection on receiving the engine were expressed to Mr Weigold, and subsequently confirmed in an initial report commissioned from Dave Milam of S D Racing services dated 31st July 2008.

Works to remedy the identified problems were put in hand, including the removal of the sump pan, repair of leak in the oil sump pan, replacement of inadequate oil pump drive shaft, replacement of the water pump, modification to the sump pan baffles and gates. Engine leak down tests showed unacceptable levels of cylinder leakages, causes unknown unless engine completely dismantled, and many concerns identified over the quality and care in the workmanship of this build. Many parts ordered were missing or not included in the consignment delivered.

During the Dyno test at Knight Racing Services premises in Daventry, it was found that the very low oil pressure recorded on initial start up was due to the inadequate engineering in the cylinder head valve rocker gear shafts, an immediate temporary modification was required to allow the tests to proceed. Subsequently it was necessary to remanufacture the rocker shafts and bearings to higher tolerances to retain oil pressure in the engine, and to prevent excessive build up of engine oil in the rocker covers, starving oil from the oil pump pick up.

To enable the fitting of these modified parts supplied by Knight Racing Services, Dave Milam was commissioned to carry out these works, which required the removal of the cylinder heads to allow for replacement gaskets to be fitted. On removal of the cylinder heads it became apparent, both visually and by measurement, that again poor and inadequate workmanship has compromised the whole structure and validity of this engine and proved that it is not fit for the purposes described in its commission to the builders.

A brief summary of the problems identified are as follows: -

The engine has been built with a bore and stroke that gives 363 cu/inch swept capacity. The engine requires modification to a dry sump lubrication system to prevent oil starvation to the rotating components and subsequent destruction of the engine. This is due to the extended crankshaft throw, which will pick up oil in the shallow GT40 sump pan and prevent adequate oil capacity to the oil pump pick up. There is no windage tray fitted, and lack of space to fit one above the sump oil level.

The piston crowns are at level with the aluminium block deck height, which prevents any subsequent re-machining of the block faces, and which allows only the .040 thou thickness of the gasket between the piston top and the cylinder head casting at piston top dead centre. This would be OK except that the steel cylinder bore inserts are wrongly set at between .003 and .004 inch ( 30 and 40 thousanths/inch ) below the block faces, which means that the gasket cannot seal correctly and allows both compressed gas loss on compression and water leakage into the cylinders from the engine water galleries. The high-pressure compression gases will quickly erode the mating surfaces of the cylinder heads and block, and water ingress was already apparent on delivery in the bores, as reported earlier, starting corrosion on both the cylinder walls and piston tops.

Visual inspection of the camshaft through the lifter bores shows distinct damage to 4 number lobes, which are precision ground and hardened parts that are particularly subject to accelerating wear due to lack of care in run in on initial start up and reduced lubrication.

On inspecting the lifters four showed accelerated wear being concave after just the two Dyno sessions. But without removing the camshaft it is impossible to measure how warn the lobes are.

The problems stem from the poor workmanship in the installation of the cylinder bore liners, both in the fact that tops do not align with the block face, and that they are distorted by whatever reasons both in round and longitudinal measurement (oval and tapered) which leaves a legacy which will be very difficult and expensive to remedy. We have already commented on the inappropriate modification of parts by unsuitable tooling (main bearing caps cut away by die grinders etc) and to the obvious lack of care in assembly, but there is no doubt at all in my mind that this constitutes a complete lack of provision of an item suitable for the uses intended, and as such constitutes a breach of contract. I also do not consider that the parts originally supplied are to the quality or specification intended at the commission of this contract

The repair of this unit will need to incorporate the following works: -

Total dismantlement of the whole unit.
Removal and replacement of the heat shrunk cylinder liners, re-machining liners both in bore and end face to block face to exact tolerances.
Removal of the pistons from the connecting rods if possible without distortion, machining the piston tops to suitable profile and clearances and reassembly with balancing.
Replacement of damaged camshaft and cam followers.
Careful scrutiny of the modified main bearing caps, all crankshaft bearings and running surfaces.
Dry sump installation of a modified sump pan, oil sump extraction pump, large oil supply tank and associated pipe work and filters etc.
Full reassembly to exact tolerances required.

Frank Catt, Wealden Engineering Development
David Milam, S D Racing Services
1st March, 2009

5. The engine is currently having the programme of works identified above carried out by Knight Racing Services at considerable expense. Note that it was SD Racing Services that issued the report so there was no vested interest in issuing the report to me as Knight Racing Services were to carry out any repair work. Knight Racing concurred that the work above is required.

I have asked Jay Cushman to address the issues raised in the report (in March) but he has not responded (and this is over a number of months now). Accordingly, I feel that others on this forum should be aware of my experiences.

Martin

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

I am sorry to hear of this. Compared to the magnitude of this, the parts I haven't gotten are a drop in a very large bucket indeed.

I received two vitriolic emails from Jay Cushman about all this, after my post. To say that we don't agree on how all this played out understates the situation considerably. So I'll repeat what I said before: some of the items I've gotten from Jay seem fine, some of them haven't shown up yet in spite of MANY emails asking for them, and some of them may never show up at all. Jay still owes me a number of small parts which he may choose to send, or I may have to figure out how to get them some other way. He has also now informed me that he won't sell me the dead pedal which was part of the original deal on the pedal box assembly, although not paid for yet. I guess I shouldn't ask about some other stuff I asked him for, should I? (I should mention that Jay has always had a credit card number from me and could ship whenever he wanted to with payment guaranteed instantly.)

We'll see how this all plays out. In the meantime, I hope your engine can be rebuilt to do what it's supposed to, and reliably. If you were in this area, I'd have some suggestions; over there, I think Frank and friends will do well by you. I hope so.

 

[Ron Earp]

Has any resolution been reached in these instances?

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

Not yet. I have gotten several emails from Jay. He feels I am unfair and ungrateful. I, obviously, feel otherwise. We are going to remachine the balance bar to take a smaller spherical bearing which will allow us to assemble the pedal box and get it into the car and hook it all up. I am still waiting for several of the small parts I have been promised*, but I have not seen them yet. I don't know about the (much more serious) situation described above by Martin involving his engine. Jay sent the front sway bar to me with me understanding that it would need to be bent additionally to fit into the car, which we were able to do with no difficulty. We think all that will fit together fairly well- we are waiting on Heim joints for that.

*captive nut plates, plastic bushings for the sway bars. The other stuff, which I had not paid for yet, I have given up on and will look for elsewhere.

 

[roaldin]

Ungrateful?
What a world...

Give'em the flick mate - soon as you can.
I've been involved in situations like that and made the mistake of trying to stick it out, since I've moved on I haven't regretted it once.

Tim.

 

[MWGT40]

No my problems are not sorted at all. I do not get any response from Jay. But given all the previous broken promises, I have just moved on to someone I know will deliver what they promised (Peter Knight). Most of the remedial work has now been carried out by Peter and Frank Catt and I am hoping to have the engine back in the car at the end of July. Of course, this will have cost me a lot of additional money though.

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

I got my pedal box from the machine shop today. They remachined the balance bar and pressed in the bearing I got from Aurora, and I was able to assemble it. I have asked Jay to pay the cost of this, plus I have again asked him to ship the parts that I need to finish the sway bar installation and complete the pedal box and get it in. (sway bar bushings and captive nut plates for the pedal box installation). I've also told him that I will dispute the last charge he made to my credit card (to which I've notified him he can no longer charge ANYTHING) unless I get a satisfactory resolution to all of this. We'll see how this turns out.

 

[Richard]

Have you found another source for the dead pedal? If so would you share your source? Thanks.

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

I think Gelscoe in the UK have the dead pedal; look on their site or look at them using Google.

I got a box with the remaining bits and pieces from Cushman a day or two ago, and they appear to all fit. This concludes our dealings, as noted above.

 

[Steve C]

Richard,

Try Olthoff (he made one for me), see attached:

Steve P2125

 

[Frank Catt]

Finally installed - I am sure Martin will update you with the tale of this Engine, Frank

 

[Garry]

Frank and Jim,
Good show! Please tell us about the dry sump system.
Garry

 

[Ron Earp]

Guys, this is a Vendor feedback thread regarding problems with Jay Cushman delivering goods to another member. Engine installs and details should be over in the Engines subforum.

 

[MWGT40]

The engine finally got sorted out using Peter Knight of Knight Racing in Daventry. As you can see from the photos that Frank has posted, it looks great. I will post more photos once the installation back in the car is finished.

There was no more contact from Jay Cushman and it cost me £14,031 with Knight Racing to sort all the issues out including a full rebuild.

 

[Eric Johnson]

That is one nicely done GTD. Congratulations. :thumbsup:

 

[MWGT40]

The engine puts out 545 BHP and 531 Ft Lb and is built on an aluminium block so it goes some too!

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

I did get all that I had paid for from Jay, and since then we've also done some other business, just to bring this thread up to date.

 

[Randy V]

Thank you for bringing this thread up to date Jim...

I'd like to hope that there will be no more entries to this particular thread.

 

[Andrew Komosa]

I'd like to add, that I have bought a load of period original parts for my P/1042 project from JC and he's one of the most knowledgable GT40 chaps around. He obtained the most realistic shipping quote for me and those parts are now on the high seas between the USA and NZ. Regards... Andrew