ZF Transaxle for sale
- Thread starter Tachitup
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Sorry, rookie question here - being a Pantera transaxle, would this transaxle need to be flipped and re-plumbed to ensure sufficient oiling? In other words, reverse the R&P and potentially makes some changes to oiling to ensure sufficient lubrication....
Yes. And no. Optimally and historically, yes, you would need to flip it. However, I am
sure it is possible to run it in a non-flipped orientation.
Ian
Frank Jerome in Dallas is quite adapt at rebuilding Pantera gearboxes, as is Les Gray in Phoenix. However, the work required to invert the gearbox for use in a GT40 is decidedly non-trivial. Several blanked-off fluid passages inside the case need to be opened up, and additional modifications need to be made to ensure the side bearings get adequate lubrication.
Dennis Quella and Lloyd Butfoy are both equipped to do this sort of work, with appropriate jigs etc. created specifically for this job; I don't know of any other ZF specialists who are so-equipped.
Figure a minimum of $2000-3000 to have a gearbox converted; that includes the basic cost of a rebuild with new bearings etc. Depending on the state of the gearbox, the cost can go quite a bit higher if things are trashed inside.
Dennis Quella and Lloyd Butfoy are both equipped to do this sort of work, with appropriate jigs etc. created specifically for this job; I don't know of any other ZF specialists who are so-equipped.
Figure a minimum of $2000-3000 to have a gearbox converted; that includes the basic cost of a rebuild with new bearings etc. Depending on the state of the gearbox, the cost can go quite a bit higher if things are trashed inside.
You Pantera guys ...
"Right side up" ... as, if
Everyone knows the ZF was designed to be run "inverted" and the Pantera runs it
upside down !!!
Of course, since the major source of ZFs has historically been from Panteras or Pantera
parts suppliers, upside down is now right side up
Ian
You Pantera guys ...
"Right side up" ... as, if
Everyone knows the ZF was designed to be run "inverted" and the Pantera runs it
upside down !!!
Of course, since the major source of ZFs has historically been from Panteras or Pantera
parts suppliers, upside down is now right side up
Ian
That's absolutely true. When the Pantera program got off the ground, ZF extensively redesigned the case internally to allow it to function inverted from its original orientation. Now we are faced with the proposition of spending more money to re-redesign it to run as it was originally intended! :dizzy:
Pantera runs the crank centerline above the pinion & output shaft centerline to allow for more ground clearance and wet sumps in its road going form. The GT40 -intended as a race car runs the crank below the pinion & output shafts- lower C of G etc. Hence the need to flip the ring gear from one application to the other. From what I have read of the ZFQ it runs a hypoid R&P and therefore would require a reverse cut R&P to enable fitment to a Pantera-- or you could use the ZF or ZFQ in GT40 format in a Pantera & make it a lower/better car than it already is!
Frame rails on a Pantera are too close together to allow the transaxle to be inverted and the motor lowered. The bell housing flanges on the motor will not allow the motor to be lowered without significant frame and suspension modifications.
Be very careful with inverting a zf-type 2. It will not lubricate properly and may be severely damaged before you have any idea there is a problem, particularly under the noise of a loud engine between the driver and the t/a. The problem stems from the fact that the drive gear set in a type one is located well above the t/a fluid in the bottom of the gear case. The type two was rotated 180 degrees to fit in the pantera, and as such, the drive gear set is now in the bottom of the case and fully runs in the oil.
Zf incorporated a transfer oiling tube in the type 1 t/a originally designed for the gt40, that collects splash from the ring and pinion and drops it on the gear set. Oil is collected from the ring and pinion which rotates through oil in the bottom of the t/a and splashes it into the trough. A tube then takes that oil through the wall that seperates the r&p cavity from the gear case and drops it on the upper positioned gear set in the transmission side of the case, which otherwise does not get oil. Oil transfer holes must also be machined in the lower section ("after inversion" orientation), so that t/a fluid can flow between both the axle section and the gear section of the complete housing. If these transfer holes are not machined, eventually the r&p splash will tranfer all the oil in the r&p cavity to the gear case side and the r&p will be damaged form lack of lubrication.
I secured the trough/transfer tube assembly directly from zf parts in friedrikschafen, germany in 1991. The part was still available at that time. 17 years later you may not find it at zf, but if you can locate a parts manual for a type 1 this trough/tube assembly is illustrated and could possibly be fabricated. Also, if you find a type 1 parts manual, it will show a couple of other components related to oiling in the gt40 orientation that nominally apply to a type 2 inverted for a gt40 (i don't remember exactly what they are). If aggresive vintage racing is in your plans, these additional modifications are mandatory for t/a life, but if you're going cruising mostly they're not necessary. I ran my inverted type 2 for 10 years on the street and experienced no probelms related to oiling, having only installed the trough.
At any rate i strongly recommend not running a type 2 invereted for a gt40 without re-designing the oiling system.
Zf incorporated a transfer oiling tube in the type 1 t/a originally designed for the gt40, that collects splash from the ring and pinion and drops it on the gear set. Oil is collected from the ring and pinion which rotates through oil in the bottom of the t/a and splashes it into the trough. A tube then takes that oil through the wall that seperates the r&p cavity from the gear case and drops it on the upper positioned gear set in the transmission side of the case, which otherwise does not get oil. Oil transfer holes must also be machined in the lower section ("after inversion" orientation), so that t/a fluid can flow between both the axle section and the gear section of the complete housing. If these transfer holes are not machined, eventually the r&p splash will tranfer all the oil in the r&p cavity to the gear case side and the r&p will be damaged form lack of lubrication.
I secured the trough/transfer tube assembly directly from zf parts in friedrikschafen, germany in 1991. The part was still available at that time. 17 years later you may not find it at zf, but if you can locate a parts manual for a type 1 this trough/tube assembly is illustrated and could possibly be fabricated. Also, if you find a type 1 parts manual, it will show a couple of other components related to oiling in the gt40 orientation that nominally apply to a type 2 inverted for a gt40 (i don't remember exactly what they are). If aggresive vintage racing is in your plans, these additional modifications are mandatory for t/a life, but if you're going cruising mostly they're not necessary. I ran my inverted type 2 for 10 years on the street and experienced no probelms related to oiling, having only installed the trough.
At any rate i strongly recommend not running a type 2 invereted for a gt40 without re-designing the oiling system.
