CAV Owners out there...

Tom_Hughes · 06-19-04, 03:25 PM

Have any of you had any problem with boiling the water out of the block, after the system has been properly bled?

Also, it appears that the system uses a non-US car radiator cap. Any idea what make/model it is, or where I could pick one up to try that. I went with a Stant 180 degree t-stat, but after say 3-4 drives, sometimes with the car off in the garage, it seems to puke just enough coolant to get a bubble in the cooling system, allow the pump to cavatate and very, very quickly turn the water in the block into steam. Not being any kin to Mr. Stanley, and not having any experience with a steam engine, I'd like to query you folks to see if it has occurred to anyone else. Some thoughts are to raise the fill/puke tank; not an easy fabrication effort, or to swap out t-stats. Any thoughts, (or attempts at humor) are much appreciated! I know it can be fixed, just getting frustrated. Victor, different issue, but I know how you feel!

Thanks folks
Tom (I got a 70K paperweight) Hughes

Ron Earp · 06-19-04, 03:46 PM

You may want to search the forum on cooling issues. There have been numerous discussions on it and most have solved their problem using Robert Logan's suggestions that he uses in the RF cars. Blackjack solved his ERA problems this way and is elated as he too, had a 100k paperweight he couldn't drive in traffic.

Tom_Hughes · 06-19-04, 03:51 PM

Ron,

Thanks for the quick reply. I'll searh those key-words ASAP. I was concerned that the CAV implementation of hoses/plumbing would be just different enough that I'd be S. O. L. with a different manufacturer, but I'll dig into right now.
Thank you so kindly,
Tom

SpyderMike · 06-19-04, 09:37 PM

you might give a call to Joe Leonard at www.jcperformance.com. He has finished off a few CAVs and he has some mods to the cooling system or understands some issues particular to these cars I understand.

Mike

Mike

Robert Logan · 06-20-04, 05:27 AM

Tom,

Give me a call at work or send me an e-mail.

Best wishes,

Robert

Ron Earp · 06-20-04, 09:52 AM

Robert will be able to help you for sure on the cooling. But, in short from what I've seen I imagine you need to establish a route from the back of the heads to bleed air that is trapped. This is easily done by drilling and tapping the intake manifold, I did mine myself with no trouble.

Put in two 3/8" fittings for hose and ran that to the water pump. This will allow you, when filling the system, to open the tube on the back of the heads while all the air escapes. Once full, re-attach it and you'll have an air free system.

Also, he can detail running a bleed from a header tank to the radiator top which helps immensely. This part will require some work if it wasn't engineered into the car from the beginning, but I think Blackjack took his apart to do it and has been fine with both mods. You don't need fancy electric pumps etc, all you need is a well-designed cooling system.

Tom_Hughes · 06-20-04, 02:58 PM

Hi guy's,

Thanks for all the PM's & support. I'll be in touch Robert.

Late yesterday, I noticed something else that has me feeling like Elvis Presley, and wanting desprately to do the GT what he did to his Pantera! (He shot the damn thing.)

I saw some sort of electronic gizmo sitting at the floorpan next to the accelerator pedal. I picked it up and inside was melted clear plastic. The cover is black. In doing some looking around under the dash, it is one of the fuses that melted apart. The fuse did not blow, hence why everything still seems to be working. I have not pulled the fuse, so I can't tell what will quit working, nor do I have a schematic. Now, I'm at wits end, getting there at FULL THROTTLE! Maybe it's time to load the clip into the 9mm!

Gary Gibbs · 06-20-04, 03:47 PM

Your owners manual has a full wiring schematic and you should be able to trace that circuit.

Ron Earp · 06-20-04, 03:51 PM

T,

Where did you get your CAV from??? I mean, if this is a dealer car they should be helping you sort this out. Even if it isn't a dealer car one of the local dealers should help you out if there are any.

R

Tom_Hughes · 06-20-04, 05:32 PM

Gary,

No wiring diagram yet. The owners manual is on backorder. As for the dealer, it's a good fellow by the name of Mitch Hughes, (no relation) at S/C Motorsports. He's up in Mustang Oklahoma, just West of Oklahoma City. Unfortunately, 200+ miles away, and a pain in the A$$ to get the car there is causing me to do a lot of the diagnostic work. When I spoke with Mitch on Thursday evening, he agreed to pick up the car & solve this one. I just wanted to try to attack it myself to save the time, money & effort. At this point, I'll let him fab it/solve it, just want to get him as much help on this as is possible.

Thanks guy's...
Tom

JOSEPH · 06-20-04, 07:22 PM

T Hughs, My CAV was altered to let the air bleed off the top of the intake and " T " into the top of the filler tank. The filler tank was also raised up about 3" to 4" to allow the air to move above the block. This made filling the cooling system much faster and solved the problem of getting the air out of the system. The bolt just to the right and down from the top of the filling tank is the old position of the tank when it came from CAV. I have had no heating problems even when the temperature got up to 98 degrees. Hope this helps. Joe [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Gary Gibbs · 06-20-04, 10:45 PM

I have a yet to be tested mod that I have just done. I will post the info when I can this week. I will be testing it on track at SAAC convention so we will know how it holds up.

Tom_Hughes · 06-21-04, 11:42 PM

Gary,

Thanks for you time on the phone today and your courtesy & kindness. I really appreciate your efforts. Please let us know how it goes for you!
Tom

Canuk40 · 06-22-04, 09:40 AM

Hi Tom,

Thanks for your private email.

There are threads elsewhere in the forum that talk about making sure all the air is out of the system before driving it. These are not easy cars to do (including the originals).

Moving the header tank up and teeing off the top off the thermostat housing works. We were the first to do that on a CAV with Angelos Gulf car a year ago.

There are other mods that we've done that are internal to the chassis plumbing, a bit akward to accomplish but results in a much more stable cooling system.

I had to chuckle when watching an episode of American Hotrod on Speedvision. Boyd Cottington and crew where having a $#^%^& of time getting the air out of a 32 Ford street rod. Deja vu!

Have a great day, we'll talk soon.

Tom_Hughes · 06-23-04, 12:15 AM

Can anyone identify the radiator cap used on the CAV? I am told it is a non-US cap. I am sure spares are available over here, but would appreciate any leads to the model/type used on the car.

I ran my cooling system up to temperature with my Stant pressue testing unit on the system. It went as high as 14PSI. As I raised the RPM's, pressue in the tank side dropped a bit. I believe this is good. However, when I tested the cap, it bled off air at about 11-12PSI. This may be a part of the over heating problem. I'd sure like to find a 15 or 17 PSI cap.

Anyone have any idea's where?

Steve Toner · 06-23-04, 12:55 AM

I don't have the answer to your question, but perhaps we should create (somewhere) a CAV parts list as people do come across this information. I'm sure at some point I'm going to need to know what brake pads the car takes, for example...

Tom_Hughes · 06-23-04, 01:07 AM

Excellent point Steve...

Ron, what kind of $$$ annually would it take to fund a FAQ section for CAV owners? I am sure a few of us would be willing to chip in the $$$ to sponsor it on the site.

Thanks,
Tom

Canuk40 · 06-23-04, 01:21 AM

Hi Steve, These are PBR Calipers which also supplied to Baer Brakes and used I understand on Mustang Cobra R. Haven't had to look for pads yet or I'd send you the part number. Shouldn't be hard to find though.

Cheers

Tom_Hughes · 06-29-04, 12:11 PM

Hi guy's,

I have gotten lots of advice on raising the purge tank & adding bleeds. Yet one issue with the CAV system appears to be the routing of the heater and that mysterious 'T' in the bulk-head. My dealer (Mitch) and I have tried to find the best solution. He's only done 5 or 6 CAV's, and thus has not had a lot of experience with this. Mine appears to be the only one with boil over issues.

So, question of the day is: Does anyone have a schematic of how the lines should be properly routed? Also, I have spoken to several of you who have moved the 'T' back into the engine bay.

Lastly, the lines to the heater core go to the front of the car, and all the way back to the rear, correct? The heater does not empty into the radiator return line, correct?

Thanks guy's,
Tom (I'm about to boil over now) Hughes

Ron Earp · 06-29-04, 01:16 PM

Hi Tom,

The coporate sponsorship is $350. Why? Well, it is what RF gives and it seemed reasonable. My vision was that enough coporate folks would fund the forum that we'd not have to have any donations. But, that never came to pass as outlined on other threads, only RF wanted to support and have their own forum section. CAV was going to at one time and I actually had one up for them but it never materialized so it is dormat now. It still exists, it just isn't active. Hope this helps a little, let me know if you get enough owners interested in having a forum. Then I'd need someone to moderate it and let me know how it owuld be accessed - CAV owners only, all people, only subscribers to the forum ,etc.

R