Dry Sump

speed220mph · 05-27-06, 07:37 AM

I am putting together a surplus Cup/Busch engine that is set up for dry-sump lubrication. My question is has anyone installed a dry-sump oiling system in a GT-40, either a Mk I or II? I can convert it to wet sump, but it will require installing an external pump, which is no big deal. I guess the admonition ERA gives is it would be very difficult to use dry sump in their chassis, which is probably due to packaging the reservoir and the needed lines.

Tom

scott · 05-27-06, 09:33 AM

Were you planning to run both A/C and dry sump?

speed220mph · 05-27-06, 10:28 AM

Yes, A/C and dry sump. Things will be tight up front. Let me amend that: External pump, either wet or dry.

scott · 05-27-06, 04:46 PM

I once read that ERA could convert a portion of the fuel sponson into an oil tank...I hope that is correct.

speed220mph · 05-27-06, 08:30 PM

Thanks, I'll see what ERA says about it.

Tom

DaveWharran · 05-27-06, 09:22 PM

Tom,
I have an ERA with a 351C in it. Clearances for the engine are best described by saying 1/4" clearance to anything else is wonderful. The attached photos show the positions of the AC compressor and alternator, and the engine to firewall clearances. The water pump is a Snow White short unit although it was replaced with a Davies Craig electric unit when the car went together. One thing the pics don't show is the shift rod which also goes through this area. There was simply NO room to run an 1-1/2" coolant line to suction of the pump.
Bob Putnam can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think there are mods that can be (must be) made to both the firewall and chassis (cut out areas) to fit a 427 with dry sump. The exhaust cutouts were made to my chassis because the Clevland exhaust pipe angle off the heads is similar to the 427. The firewall was not modified.
I'm pretty sure ERA is not running AC on their MKII demo car that has a 427 in it.

AC plus drysump plus alternator in an ERA is probably being pretty optomistic. I wouldn't bet on it.

MBelcher · 05-28-06, 08:50 PM

Tom:
I put a dry sump in my ERA, and it is (1) time-consuming, and (2) extremely expensive. Because of time constraints, I simply didn't have time to work on the car myself. I ultimately took it to Tri-C Engineering, which has almost completed the car. If you want some insight into the cost and problems, you might call Rick Cressi @ (661) 295-1550.

Whatever choice you make, I wish you the very best of luck.

Michael

speed220mph · 05-29-06, 02:22 AM

Michael and Dave: Thanks for the input. Sounds like the limitation is the pump and lines are the constraints. Unfortunately, I have to run an external pump regardless of whether I go with a either a wet- or dry-sump system because the block does not have provisions for an internal pump. Looks like a harder packaging problem than putting a Boss 429 in a Mustang. I'll have to think long and hard on this one.

speed220mph · 05-29-06, 02:23 AM

The engine is now fitted with a 5-stage oil pump. It will definately have to be relocated, either lower or to the back of the engine using a Tilton rear-drive setup.

speed220mph · 05-29-06, 08:26 AM

Photo of engine mentioned above.

Ross Nicol · 05-29-06, 09:13 AM

Here's my setup Tom.No pipes on the pump but you can get the general Idea
an air conditioning compressor ah! where can I put it? She's going back together after valve job. Good to see different Ideas.

Ross

Lee · 06-02-06, 05:54 PM

Please can someone just refresh my memory on the correct plumbing for dry sump.
From the tank, the line goes to the pump, before the filter, and then the engine, but where should a thermostat/ cooler go? I guess the filter should be the last thing before the engine. So the thermostat should go between the pump and the filter? Right?

Richard Timte · 06-02-06, 06:41 PM

Lee,

Here is a link to peterson Fluids (tech section).

http://www.petersonfluidsys.com/diagram.html

Lee · 06-03-06, 03:45 AM

Thanks Richard. So thermostat and cooler go after the filter. That surprises me a little, but not an issue.
Cheers
Lee

Ross Nicol · 06-03-06, 04:14 AM

As you can see from my pics I have a 3 stage pump, 2 scavenge the sump and 1 pressure.The 2 scavenge lines come from the sump to the pump and then a single line out of the pump through filter, cooler , Tank inlet. The pressure line goes from tank outlet to pump and pump to block direct. The filter is before the cooler to hopefully stop crap entering it and the tank. I have a temp sender in the tank. When I set it up I looked at many different Ideas but this one made sense to me.
Ross

Lee · 06-03-06, 11:55 AM

Cheers Ross
My tank has 3 inlets to match the pump (that is how I got it), so I think I will leave the scavenge end as it is. What you say makes sense to avoid the single pressure stage working overtime, while the scavenge is pumping lots of air. In my case though, I will put the filter and stat on the pressure side, using -12 hose to try minimise pressure wastage.

scott · 06-09-06, 06:50 PM

I've seen "rear drive" or "bellhousing mounted" dry sump pumps mentioned a few times in the past. I've searched the net for information but have only been able to find limited info and no decent images of mock-ups/applications. Can anyone point me at an image or schematic as to how such a set-up might go together?
Thanks,
Scott