Truly custom engine builds...

(I apologize in advance Fran, but this seemed like the area of the forum that would have the most people actually interested in this...feel free to move as needed)

There seem to be many folks in SL-C land who want a custom engine for a truly unique ride...but that means building or installing an engine that is based on an OEM platform.

This is great as it builds on aftermarket & factory support...parts are available. The bummer is that SBC/LS engines are common as belly-buttons and less common blocks are limited in offerings while also being more expensive.

But what if there was an alternative engine platform that utilized the existing parts infrastructure, while giving you truly unique motor-vation for your kit/custom?

What if there was an alternative that offered a truly modular platform to build anything from I2, thru I3, flat-4, I4, V4, flat-6, V6, flat-8, V8, V10, flat-12, V12, V16? These designs would be based on existing off-the-shelf components, like bearing shells, con-rods, pistons, valves, springs, keepers, etc.

Would anybody be interested in having this option?
 
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There seem to be many folks in kit-car land who want a custom engine for a truly unique ride...but that means building or installing an engine that is based on an OEM platform.

This is great as it builds on aftermarket & factory support...parts are available. The bummer is that SBC/LS engines are common as belly-buttons and less common blocks are limited in offerings while also being more expensive.

But what if there was an alternative engine platform that utilized the existing parts infrastructure, while giving you truly unique motor-vation for your kit/custom?

What if there was an alternative that offered a truly modular platform to build anything from I2, thru I3, flat-4, I4, V4, flat-6, V6, flat-8, V8, V10, flat-12, V12, V16? These designs would be based on existing off-the-shelf components, like bearing shells, con-rods, pistons, valves, springs, keepers, etc.

Would anybody be interested in having this option?
 

Ron Earp

Admin
Yes. And I'd like rainbow colored unicorns with farts of rose fragrance to deliver it. Tomorrow.

Flat twelve please.
 
You do kind of have that option now. If you dig deep enough and have the deep pockets. You could really build your own Ferrari engine. There is always parts available. But if you have enough money to do that. I am sure you can afford a real Ferrari.
 
Ron, I have to admit I got a good chuckle out of that.

This is completely feasible, it just hasn't been exploited in this capacity before. Look at Falconer with his V12, uses SBC architecture and components. The oil galleries, water jackets, etc are all the same. Look at the Ford 4.6/5.4 V8 and 6.8 V10. Look at the 4/5/6 cylinder Volvos. Look at the 4/5/6 cylinder Vortec from Chevy. Look at the old GMC V6/V12.

The difference here would be the platform...completely modular...I don't mean that in the Ford way, I mean that in the most basic meaning of the term...by adding modules to stretch the cylinder capacity of an engine.
 
You do kind of have that option now. If you dig deep enough and have the deep pockets. You could really build your own Ferrari engine. There is always parts available. But if you have enough money to do that. I am sure you can afford a real Ferrari.

I agree. Dart will machine a billet block based on any dimensions you provide. They partner with several companies to provide billet heads as well. Ditto for camshafts and crankshafts.

But what if there was a completely MODULAR platform on which to build your dream? Think Lego blocks. Want a V12 with SBF bore spacing? Slap on a few extra cylinders. Want a V10 with LS bore spacing? Ditto.

What if you wanted to do something extra special? Say a DOHC 120* V6? An engine like that would run you $25-30k (at a MINIMUM) with a custom block and internals, using off-the-shelf cylinder heads. Now imagine doing it for $10-15k...all custom. That's a game changer.
 
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Ok i wasn't sure what you meant before. Now I get it. Being able to have a total custom built motor at any level is a car mans dream. But if you could do like your talking. There could be a lot of money in it. Just thinking about it makes me excited. My dream engine would be a pretty simple. Take a 458 italia engine. bore it to a even 5.0, make it handle 10lbs of boost and hold on.
 
Ok i wasn't sure what you meant before. Now I get it. Being able to have a total custom built motor at any level is a car mans dream. But if you could do like your talking. There could be a lot of money in it. Just thinking about it makes me excited. My dream engine would be a pretty simple. Take a 458 italia engine. bore it to a even 5.0, make it handle 10lbs of boost and hold on.

That's EXACTLY what I'm talking about!

Now imagine doing it using available aftermarket parts WITHOUT the Ferrari/Porsche/Lamborghini tax.

Being able to run factory GM/Ford/Mopar sensors and accessories.

Would that be something you would actually want to build for YOUR project?
 
John,

As much as I'd love to have a OHC V-12 exotica powering my SLC, I wouldn't be able to afford the oil filter for it. :thumbsup: OK, maybe I could swing the block, but I can't fathom the costs for intake/exhaust/ECU. Then, I would be remiss to use a Ricardo, G50, any other manual gearbox. Rather, I'd need a sequential at the very least..... Nonetheless, if you just want to know if enthusiasts would love to have such options, count me in. Just don't look for a deposit yet......
 
John,

As much as I'd love to have a OHC V-12 exotica powering my SLC, I wouldn't be able to afford the oil filter for it. :thumbsup: OK, maybe I could swing the block, but I can't fathom the costs for intake/exhaust/ECU. Then, I would be remiss to use a Ricardo, G50, any other manual gearbox. Rather, I'd need a sequential at the very least..... Nonetheless, if you just want to know if enthusiasts would love to have such options, count me in. Just don't look for a deposit yet......

You would if the consumables were based on OEM engines ;)

I'm aware that you guys don't know me very well, but I've actually put alot of time, thought & effort on this design. EVERYTHING is modular, from the oil pan to the intake.

As to the ECU, a V12 will run quite nicely as two L6's...yes, this requires 2 ECUs, but there are several very affordable ECUs on the market that are capable of working in sync, rather than only 2 (that I'm aware of...Motec & similar) that are capable of powering multiple-cylinder exotica.

Just think...use OEM sensors from the Big 3 that can be obtained at any dealership/parts store, rather than paying Ferrari/Porsche/Lamborghini tax every time you might need one! Ditto for A/C compressors, alternators, belts, hoses, etc.

As to sequential transmissions and the like...my buddy DeLynn can hook you up with those when the Griffin boxes become available. :thumbsup: We've collaborated on a few things that I think ALOT of enthusiasts are going to enjoy when they come to market.
 
Be cheaper just to cast up some rocker covers with a 'WYLD' or 'ROARK' Logo on them , that could look exotic & nobody would know what they might be covering :):)
 
Be cheaper just to cast up some rocker covers with a 'WYLD' or 'ROARK' Logo on them , that could look exotic & nobody would know what they might be covering :):)

JacMac...we're not Ricers. Where's the fun in that?:lol:

I think that there is a market, just trying to find the right demographic. What if Fran had never designed and built his replicas, let alone his SL-C? What if DeLynn had never designed his gearbox? What if we never decided to incorporate any OEM technology in our builds?

The whole point is to try something different in a functionally practical way...much like building a replica/kit/specialty/custom car to begin with.
 
All an engine block is, is a container to keep spinning masses in a relatively stable configuration, and combustion pressures inside the cylinder...a series of bulkheads and walls...much like an ocean-going ship.

A cylinder head is nothing more than a container too...serving as a structure for intake/exhaust ports and the fiddly bits that open/close them...the rest is just a convenient way to move oil & water without needing extraneous piping hanging about.

There are applicable techniques to make them both lighter, stronger & less expensively than they currently are. Granted, my method wouldn't work for mass-production as they can't be knocked out 100 an hour by a processing line, but still they can be built much more affordably than small-lot castings or CNC'd "billets". Which means that the average gearhead can actually afford to indulge in engine "exotica" as easily as he could order a crate engine from an OEM or custom builder.
 
Just to make clear, I'm not taking credit for any of DeLynn's work. Griffin Gearboxes is solely his undertaking. But you will see a few of my ideas in his products ;) I'm just excited to have had the privilege of talking, sharing ideas with & encouraging a guy who has the enthusiast at heart with his products.
 

JohnC

Missing a few cylinders
Lifetime Supporter
John, it's a super idea and you just need to figure out how to make it work.

In the 70's & 80's I worked for several of the large industrial engine companies, and one of them had a family of engines that were completely modular from an inline six, up through a V16. They shared bores, strokes, liners, pistons and rods. In fact the V16 engine used two cranks from the V8 that were bolted together in the middle, and the V16 block was essentially two V8 blocks welded together. That engine did have some torsional issues in its early days, but if the mains had been stronger, it wouldn't have been as severe.

What you said about the V12 being two inline sixes is exactly correct as well. I have both BMW and Ferrari V12's and they're set up this way. My 550 Maranello has a "limp home" mode which runs the engine only on the left bank or the right, which are controlled from separate ECU's. This engine has dual fuel, ignition, intake, and exhaust systems - the only systems that are shared are the cooling and oiling.
 
John, it's a super idea and you just need to figure out how to make it work.

In the 70's & 80's I worked for several of the large industrial engine companies, and one of them had a family of engines that were completely modular from an inline six, up through a V16. They shared bores, strokes, liners, pistons and rods. In fact the V16 engine used two cranks from the V8 that were bolted together in the middle, and the V16 block was essentially two V8 blocks welded together. That engine did have some torsional issues in its early days, but if the mains had been stronger, it wouldn't have been as severe.

What you said about the V12 being two inline sixes is exactly correct as well. I have both BMW and Ferrari V12's and they're set up this way. My 550 Maranello has a "limp home" mode which runs the engine only on the left bank or the right, which are controlled from separate ECU's. This engine has dual fuel, ignition, intake, and exhaust systems - the only systems that are shared are the cooling and oiling.

That's one of the many areas of engine design I got the idea from.

In fact, my concept is so stupidly simple, I'm wondering why nobody has bothered with it before. Not to sound naive or conceited, by I really feel like this could be a game changer for small firms wanting to produce their own engine.

All the tech is currently out there being utilized in engines or manufacturing, but none of it is being implemented together.
 

JohnC

Missing a few cylinders
Lifetime Supporter
Common internals lend themselves well to reducing manufacturing costs, but I suppose not that many automotive engine manufacturers have need for a range of 4/6/8/10/12/16 cylinder engines. The big industrial engine manufacturers have done it for years, however.

What would be really interesting is to see if you can "stack" modular V2 cylinder assemblies on bespoke block/crankcases and achieve the necessary rigidity to make a "V" of any given configuration. Then, only the crank and cam(s) would have to change. Even the heads could be modular, as they are on big stationary engines.
 
What would be really interesting is to see if you can "stack" modular V2 cylinder assemblies on bespoke block/crankcases and achieve the necessary rigidity to make a "V" of any given configuration. Then, only the crank and cam(s) would have to change. Even the heads could be modular, as they are on big stationary engines.


That's PRECISELY what I'm going for ;) That's why I indicated that it's a truly modular design, based on modules of cylinders.

Personally, I have no use for an engine that would be difficult to balance or require an split-offset crank, ie an L3, L4, L5, V6, V10...but some people like those engines and would want to build them, so I would provide them with that ability.

My preference would be to only offer a parallel twin, V2, flat-4, L6, flat-6, V8, flat-12, V12 and V16...but providing the framework for those engines allows for the odd cylinder counts to be built just as readily.

What I like best is that cams & cranks can be stacked as modules as well, without requiring specific forgings or billets...that alone makes or breaks the concept.
 
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Ron Earp

Admin
Be cheaper just to cast up some rocker covers with a 'WYLD' or 'ROARK' Logo on them , that could look exotic & nobody would know what they might be covering :):)

And you won't even need rainbow unicorns with rose farts to deliver those. UPS will bring that sort of thing right to the door.
 
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