Porsche 930 Starter Predicament - Page 2

Ron Earp · 06-19-07, 09:04 PM

Hi Mark,

Any source on that little starter you have?

Ok, I have a stock 930 starter in house as well as the mini gear reduction high torque unit. Neither will fit as you can see in the photos. What I need is a mini starter that is clockable in relation to the ears for mounting. In fact, that is what I thought I was buying when I got this ministarter, but that wasn't the case.

Have a look at the photos and see if you can suggest anything I'm missing. Looks like I'll have a ministarter for sale shortly, I think I can return the 930 starter. Anyone know of a source for the piece Mark found or a source for mini starters that are clockable?

Ron

Gregg · 06-19-07, 09:11 PM

Ron, have you tried these people?

IMI Performance Products, Inc. Hi Torque

Fran Hall RCR · 06-19-07, 09:12 PM

Call Roger Brown at CMS(ex PHII) ...he supplied us with a clockable unit for Sandys car..also a 930 box

Ron Earp · 06-19-07, 09:20 PM

Will do fellows, thanks for that. Gregg, that European page does have something that looks good, but I tried them the other day and got nowhere. Will try again tomorrow as well as try Fran's suggestion too.

That little one I show in the picture would work if it'd clock about 20 degrees up, counter-clockwise. Unfortunately the case and flange are cast as one piece and it isn't easily clockable.

Ron

Tom · 06-19-07, 10:31 PM

Ron,

If your other sources fall through, you might contact Gardner Douglas cars in England - gdcars.com. They can supply a gear reduction starter strong enough to turn over a LS7 motor, it fits Porsche transmissions and is clockable. You might have to drill your own holes but I can't see it being a problem for you. I'd include a photo but chassis is away for the moment. I can try to get one late in the week if it is helpful.

Good luck with it.

Tom

markpreece · 06-20-07, 03:02 PM

Hi Ron
I have a phone number for the starter people they are UK based i will give them a call tomorrow for you. i will get some pictures of the starter offered up to my transaxle for you in the next couple of days.
Cheers
Mark

andys · 06-29-07, 02:04 PM

Ron,

Perhaps marrying some old school methods to what's available may possibly lead to a solution. Those offset gear reduction starters rarely lend themselves to tight space applications. So here's my thought: Look at the Summit G1660A starter. The mounting block is clockable, and the solenoid is tight against the body on the motor so it's quite compact. Perhaps a little re-configuring and drilling the two mounting holes to match your 930 mounting requirement, it might just fit up. The first thing to confirm however, would be the pinion tooth count to see if they match; the pitch I believe is the same at 12TPI. There might be a need to do some further machining of the mounting block, but it should be pretty simple (or fabricate a new one from scratch to fit your needs). Now for the "old school" stuff. If you rotate the brush plate by 90 degrees, the starter shound turn in the reverse direction (we used to do that with old Ford starters).

I don't have any photo's, but I fabricated a new mounting block for that particular Summit starter also for a space limiting reason, though be it for a LS1 motor.

Good luck,

Andy

Doug Sainlar · 06-29-07, 06:04 PM

Ron, I'm not sure where you stand on this issue and don't have time to read all the posts right now (stuck in SW KS where the only internet access is the public library, and dadgum if they don't want to close--go figure!!), but I found this as I was stumbling around an old kit car mag. There's a company called Tuff Stuff Performance out of Cleveland, OH that offers mini gear reduction starters for Ford, Pontiac and Olds engines that allow multi indexing. According to what the blurb says, their starter can be positioned on its base and rotated to whatever position works best. They are available in up to 2.6 hp and were developed for high compression competition engines, and they say their starters will spin anything from a 260 to a 455 CID engine. They mentioned the starters are 1/3 smaller, weigh 40% less, are unaffected by heat and can be ordered in either chrome or black finish.

Tuff Stuff Performance Accessories
1982 W. 74th St.
Cleveland, OH 44102

1-800-331-6562

Here's a link--hope it works.

Tuff Stuff Performance manufactures chrome alternators, chrome water pumps, chrome starters, chrome alternator, chrome water pump, chrome starter, chrome power steering pump, chrome power steering pumps, chrome power brake booster, chrome power brake

Hope this helps.

Doug

Jeff Hamilton · 07-01-07, 07:15 AM

Ron
I didn't see this post until today. I will try to get some pictures today, you have everything you need in your hand to make it work. I used the mini starter in your picture. I just did mine last night. I feel it is a good fix.
Jeff Hamilton

Ron Earp · 07-01-07, 08:04 PM

Hey Jeff,

I missed this post, if you have some pictures that would be wonderful. About the only think I can figure is cutting off the ears and having them re-welded back on.

R

Jeff Hamilton · 07-01-07, 08:16 PM

I sent you a message. Give me a regular email I can forward you some pictures. I looked at cutting a ear off but think I have found a better solution.
Jeff Hamilton

Fran Hall RCR · 07-01-07, 08:47 PM

Jeff, that would make you a great painter....!
Glad it worked out for you.....so there is now a solution for a G50-05/2 RS Carrera box...well done.
Give me a call tomorrow sometime ....

Ron Earp · 07-01-07, 09:18 PM

Hi Jeff,

I didn't get a message, but you can click on my profile and send messages or email. My email is rlearp@gt40s.com

Ron

Jeff Hamilton · 07-01-07, 09:20 PM

Ok here is what I did. First off I wanted my motor further forward in the chassis. Fran said I could use a indexable starter but I already had the good priced Ebay starter. I wanted to modify the trans so if I needed a new starter later it would be a bolt on and go part.
I turned the starter so it didn't hit the trans or the cradle. The bellhousing locates the starter. I turned it where the positive cable would miss the trans. I then drilled and heli-coiled the hole. The back side of the bell housing is irregular here and I would suggest a Heli-coil. I installed the Heli-coil and a stud with red loc-tite. The bottom ear is a straight shot to the adapter plate and misses everything. I think it was almost 4 7/16" to the adapter plate. I have a friend making a spacer the exact length tonight. I lined that bolt hole up and drilled and heli-coiled that hole ( this is overkill but I already had all the stuff out). It is a little tight on space for the spacer so install everything before you drill the first hole. It works on the RCR 40.
Jeff Hamilton

Jeff Hamilton · 07-01-07, 09:28 PM

The other thing I looked into was making a distributor type hold down off of the factory stud for the lower mount. If I install the nut on the lower stud before the starter it clears.

Fran Hall RCR · 07-01-07, 09:43 PM

Jeff,

that is a very similar solution to the one that I discussed with Ron a short while back....we also looked at that solution using the indexable starter from Kennedy and making the starter motor itself have a stud threaded into the nose cone and bolting straight through the adapter plate to the engine side...

Nice work...

Ron Earp · 07-02-07, 08:33 AM

Hey Jeff,

So the jist of it is mount the starter where it can fit, then use long bolts to secure it. One will go into the adapter plate, the other will sink into the bellhousing somewhere.

Do you have some pictures of the bellhousing hole and location?

This is a good solution and I didn't think of it at all. I was considering modifying the starter but with the one I have the housing is all cast as one piece and really can't be changed easily.

I've got a new starter (third one is the charm?) coming from IHI, who supplies Kennedy. It is indexable. We'll see if it fits, nice thing is the fellow there is extremely pleasant and said if it won't work then return it, no problem.

If it won't fit then your solution is going to be put into place, nice work!!!

Ron

Ian Anderson · 07-02-07, 08:33 AM

Does nobody make a starter with a remote solenoid?

Something similar to the old Morris Minors?

No idea here but just chucking another idea into the mixing pot

Ian

markpreece · 07-02-07, 09:41 AM

Hi Ron
Sorry for the delay in getting these pictures up here is the starter i have attached to my G50 as promised i think it could be coaxed to fit either way and have shown photos both ways (first & last pics the wrong way up!). The company who made it are supposed to be emailing me some info, they no longer make that model but have a new versionwhich is wider & longer. If you think the starter will do the job i would sell you the one i have as i have no fitting issues and could use the larger one i paid £190 for the starter.

Jeff Hamilton · 07-02-07, 05:08 PM

I have the same mini starter you have in your picture. I added the stud at the top of the starter opening. Here is a few more pictures. I told John I needed a spacer and he made a nice one. He drilled and tapped the end for a starter bolt.
Jeff Hamilton