Wiring from hell with pictures!

[BigB98]

Well, I can tell you, I love wiring! I've learned a lot along the way, though at some personal expense to my mental capacity. All connections are crimped and soldered though, so things should be good in the end and I'm nearing completion....thankfully.

[Pat Buckley]

Keep a cell phone on you, Brent....when those wires start tightening up you may need to call for help!


LOL.....

[Jac Mac]

Sooner you than me, one of each for starter,alternator,coil,wiper,brake light, plus an earth.---anything else is a luxury

[BigB98]

Pat, I'll keep that in mind....And you will be on the speed dial.

Jac Mac, that would have been easier...though I'm not doing anything fancy!

[Allen English]

Too funny Brent

[Sandy]

I remember that, a tangle of wires, wait, it's still the same. I am just starting to wire the back Part of the RCR40 and fortunately I have eliminated the notion of a harness and fuse block, seemed like more stuff to hook up. I crammed that all into the dash so less stuff and a couple of connectors. Was a pain to cram it all in, but less stuff to sort out with the fuse block, etc.

So seat heaters and beverage chiller are out Mr. Mac?

Plumbing and wiring is the fun part!

Sandy

[Ross Nicol]

Ah! of course the guys a brain surgeon. should stay well away from wiring.
He has mentioned soldering and I have a warning that should put you off from soldering terminals in a car. I have made a lot of solder joints in my time and although soldering wires into terminals in a car seems like a good Idea, vibration is your enemy. Soldering a terminal creates a solid connection but vibration will act on the copper wire just before the solid soldered strands. Of course not all terminals and wires are subject to vibration but I prefer to crimp using the proper tools for the job.
Crimping leaves the copper to flex at the terminal. It also looks neater and professional. Leave the solder for circuit boards I say. I do make joins and terminate several small wires to one large wire using a solder join though, with tinned copper wire wrapped around and heatshrink to cover the join.
Ross

[Russ Noble]

Originally Posted by ross nicol

Soldering a terminal creates a solid connection but vibration will act on the copper wire just before the solid soldered strands. Of course not all terminals and wires are subject to vibration but I prefer to crimp using the proper tools for the job.
Crimping leaves the copper to flex at the terminal.
Ross

Ah! So is the crimp not solid? Surely, if there is movement at the crimp, eventually the wire will work it's way out? And if it won't work it's way out then maybe the crimp IS a solid connection? So what's the difference between a vibration acting on the wire just before the soldered strands or working on a wire just before the solid crimp? What about heat shrink extended past the solid soldered strands to let the vibration act at the (un-solid) end of the heat shrink?

BTW. What you got planned for the week b4 Ruapuna? I think I need a wiring guru. I'm just a brain surgeon!

[Jac Mac]

Originally Posted by Sandy

So seat heaters and beverage chiller are out Mr. Mac?

Plumbing and wiring is the fun part!

Sandy

Its a racing car, if you need a seat warmer your going too slow!
Beverage chillers are only for Aussies that sit in the sun all day talking about how great they were & Slow Drinkers!

[Pete K.]

So you took the easy way out and used various colors for your wires? It is cheaper if you simply use a single color... like white. ;-)

[Ross Nicol]

Should be able to help with your wiring Russ and I'll set you straight by explaining the soldering issues directly. Hopefully the press committments won't be too heavy, When team 40 to NZ arrives. I will be well ready for a break from work. I should be with you this Saturday.
Ross

[Russ Noble]

Sorry Ross, a bit tongue in cheek. BUT I have got the good crimping tool, not the severely challenged Utilux etc versions.

Your assistance will be great, there's going to be that many volunteers working on this thing the next week or so, that we'll all be tripping over each other! I don't know where I'd be without my mates!

Looking forward to catching up again on Saturday.

Sandy, sorry about the hijack.

Cheers,

Russ

[Sandy]

No hijack of my thread I'm a squatter here ;-).

[EGLITOM]

Support Ross,

the soldering tin is not only on the tip of the wire where you apply it. It moreover extends inside the single strands of the copper and hardening it . I had more than one broken connections of this kin on my racebike due to vibration until i decided to redo the complet wiring with high flexible wires with teflon shielding only using profesional crimping connections, tools and heatshrink for cover. Never had any issues since.

TOM

BTW highly recommand this conections
AMP SUPERSEAL

[BigB98]

Oh man...You guys are killing me. All this time trying to do the "right" thing and now I'm hearing that I was just an idiot for making my life more difficult and that I have broken wires in my future.

Are you guys not seeing that I am already minus a couple of screws above? What are you all doing to me?

[RichardH]

It is acceptable to solder crimped wires, according to IPC/WHMA-A-620, however, in my experience, It is only necessary if the wires are too small for the required crimp. - An alternative acceptable method is to double back the uninsulated wire and crimp on this "double thickness". For the correct wires in the correct crimp - a good gastight joint should be made without recourse to soldering, however soldering, if done correctly, can reduce the likelyhood of corrosion, in adverse conditions.
If you intend to solder crimped connections, ensure that the solder does not extend past the rear of the connector, which will break, given time. In the example above(Amp Superseal), it would be acceptable to solder the crimped wires, because the insulation would still be clamped and any flexing of the wires would not be on a soldered section. Soldering wires going into a connector block is frowned apon, unless just to "lock" the ends in place and stop fraying. As stated above any soldered wires after the clamping position will be more likely to break from stress fractures.

Also - to the UK guys - is it just me - why is Chris Evans lying down in a GT40?

[Jason Ferraro]

Richard H is pretty close to the mark on his recommendations. Again this forum amazes me in the great information available

As the engineering manager for Tyco Electronics in Australia (we make the AMP, Tyco etc terminals) I can say that crimping a terminal is always best done with the correct crimping tool, however for the home builder this may not be practical as they can cost many hundreds of dollars each and for any given build many would be needed. Its funny, wire crimping is one of the few jobs that I'm confident about doing on my RCR build, the rest I'm having a hell of a time!

It is also imperative that the correct wire size is also used in the terminal. If the wire crimp bucket (the one that goes on the copper core) is too large for the wire even using the right crimping tool will not result in an airtight seal (the bucket compresses the copper wire so that all the air is expelled and there are no voids). One must also ensure that the insulation crimp is correct. This is the crimp that provides the strain relief for the terminal to cable interface and contributes to achieving a long lasting termination that will not fatigue. This crimp should not pierce the insulation, it should only support it.

Also one must use the small round wire seals on many of the sealed series terminals and connectors. Crimping these seals to the cables without the right crimping tool is very tricky. Also be sure to fit blanking plugs into any unused positions in the connector to keep it sealed.

As per Richards comments the best the home builder can hope to do without spending thousands of dollars on crimping tools is hand crimp with a universal crimper and correctly solder them. The IPC specification is as good as any Tyco Electronics soldering specification and I would go with that as its readily available. Just also remember that it may be better to leave the insulation crimp until after soldering so that the insulation is not melted.

[RichardH]

My only reservations on the above, due to practical experience, is that..

1) The casual user may not have the luxury of using a range of contacts, due to cost or availability constraints (MOQ etc).
2) Wire insulation varies considerably and even using the correct tool with the correct gauge contact for the wire being used, it is still possible on occasions to pierce the insulation, or for the insulation not to be supported.

[Jim Rosenthal]

FWIW in the marine environment, which is worse by far on electrical connections and hardware, the ABYC standard is crimped connections only, no soldered ones. Crimped connections preserve flexibility, soldered ones do not. If the connection needs to be weathertight, you use heat shrink tubing, which some crimped connectors provide already fitted to the item.

Best marine ones are made by Ancor- not cheap, but very sturdy. Their wiring goods are also excellent. Marine spec wire is copper tinned on every strand, and the wire gauge at each spec is slightly larger than AWG. (auto spec)

[Jack]

Right on Jim!
A few years ago I had access to an AMP machine and connectors, but now I will go the ABYC E-11 route with crimped connectors and shrink wrap. I am with you on stranded and tinned copper wire as best.