GT40s.com
MK-I  MK-II  MK-III  MK-IV  GULF  MIRAGE  J-CAR  LOLA
GT40s.com
Home Forum Gallery Support GT40s.com  
Register FAQ Advertisers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   GT40s.com > GT40 Technical Forums > GT40 Tech - Powertrain/Transaxles

GT40 Tech - Powertrain/Transaxles Transaxles and driveline - don't dare post engine things here!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 21st January 2008, 07:57 PM   #1 (permalink)
loctite
Rookie
United States
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Douglasville Ga
Posts: 15
SBF What transaxle?

I am looking into mounting a SBF 302-351 into a small space. I need a trans axle like the thm325 gm that mounts to a sbc. This transaxle mounts to the sbc and then comes back under the motor so the cv axles are about middle ways of the block. Is there a ford version of this? I have a kellison gt body and it will mount on a Fiero with not much work at all. Same wheel base and width. I know fiero is not the chassie of choice but i have both of these laying around. I can put the sbc and thm325 in with no problem at all but would like to use a ford motor. I also have a 302 laying around.

Thanks for any info. Randy

Last edited by loctite; 21st January 2008 at 08:00 PM. Reason: added
loctite is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 11:49 AM   #2 (permalink)
69valkyrie
A Tenth
United States
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Colorado
GT40: '69 Valkyrie
Posts: 134
Re: SBF What transaxle?

To be honest sir, I do not believe I know of such a transaxle ever being produced. Ford never made a late model FWD V8 like the old Toronado's and such of GM.
__________________
Cheers,
Ryan W. Zielinski
69valkyrie is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 06:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
Pantera1889's Avatar
Pantera1889
Bronze Supporter
United States
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Maryland,USA
GT40: RCR MK1
Posts: 1,453
Re: SBF What transaxle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 69valkyrie View Post
To be honest sir, I do not believe I know of such a transaxle ever being produced. Ford never made a late model FWD V8 like the old Toronado's and such of GM.

Actually I think that there are some later Lincoln Continentals with 4.6L V8 and AX4N transaxles.
__________________
RCR GT40 MK1#14 (SOLD)
DeTomaso Pantera#1889
1994 Mustang Cobra NASA American Iron Race Car #14
Pantera1889 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 06:22 PM   #4 (permalink)
Ron Earp's Avatar
Ron Earp
Administrator
United States
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: NC, USA
GT40: None.
Posts: 6,308
Re: SBF What transaxle?

And I think the one that Ron refers to is the same that was used in the SHO, or a variant of the AX4N. Not sure but seems I remember that. Probably a trip to one of the SHO forums would help you.

In fact, a SHO motor would be a pretty sweet motor in a Fiero. They make a lot of power. The later SHOs had a small V8, 3.4L I think.

Ron
__________________
Ron Earp

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Ron Earp is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 07:58 PM   #5 (permalink)
loctite
Rookie
United States
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Douglasville Ga
Posts: 15
Re: SBF What transaxle?

That would be a great motor to put in this project. I can get my hands on plenty of late model mustang v8s. The fiero dosen't have much space to mount a v8 long ways and still be able to hook up a transaxle and keep it center to the cv axles. The 350 and thm325 trans will work great but having a kit that somewhat favors a gt40 it would be nice to keep a ford in it.
loctite is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 08:30 PM   #6 (permalink)
Ron Earp's Avatar
Ron Earp
Administrator
United States
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: NC, USA
GT40: None.
Posts: 6,308
Re: SBF What transaxle?

I'm not sure there is a lot out there for the 3.4L Ford V8, but the V6 SHO is extremely well known and the four valve head a proven performer.

As usual Wiki is helpful. The V8 went on in the Volvos and undoubtedly you could find these to use.

Ford Yamaha V8 engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And the original SHO would be a great engine for a Superlight Roadster.

Ford SHO V6 engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
__________________
Ron Earp

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Ron Earp is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 09:22 PM   #7 (permalink)
Pantera1889's Avatar
Pantera1889
Bronze Supporter
United States
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Maryland,USA
GT40: RCR MK1
Posts: 1,453
Re: SBF What transaxle?

I believe the SHO uses a different bellhousing than the Lincoln V8 .Basically the same trans otherwise...
I may be able to take a picture of one tomorrow.I'll see if we have one in stock.
__________________
RCR GT40 MK1#14 (SOLD)
DeTomaso Pantera#1889
1994 Mustang Cobra NASA American Iron Race Car #14
Pantera1889 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2008, 09:32 PM   #8 (permalink)
jac mac's Avatar
jac mac
I Have No Life
New Zealand
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Gore, NZ
Posts: 3,221
Smile Re: SBF What transaxle?

Save yourself some $$ and buy the adapters that allow the SBF rocker covers to be fitted to a Bo Tie, even that small change will help the chebbie feel better. Gonna be tight fit though, I have watched another gent try to fit a Buick V6/Hewland in a Fiero [ from a distance thank goodness ] for the last 12 months, looks like a major exercise to me, so the SBC is going to add 4.38" of harder to do to the job.

Jac Mac
jac mac is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2008, 01:44 AM   #9 (permalink)
UKTONY's Avatar
UKTONY
Lifetime Premier Supporter
United States
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, USA
GT40: CAV GT #82
Posts: 138
Re: SBF What transaxle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jac mac View Post
Save yourself some $$ and buy the adapters that allow the SBF rocker covers to be fitted to a Bo Tie, even that small change will help the chebbie feel better. Gonna be tight fit though, I have watched another gent try to fit a Buick V6/Hewland in a Fiero [ from a distance thank goodness ] for the last 12 months, looks like a major exercise to me, so the SBC is going to add 4.38" of harder to do to the job.

Jac Mac
A Chevy V8 in a Fiero is no big problem, there are plenty of adapter kits for this and it is an easy swap...check out V-8 Archie (who also does the GT4T body kit described as "A totally accurate Mark I body mounted to a specially modified Fiero chassis". Although I have never seen a Ford V8 put in one, the others on the forum might be right in saying try a complete SHO engine/trans unit. The V6 should fit no problem and it would be a Ford (well kind of as the heads are Yamaha design) and can be tuned to give some excellent power, the only thing I'm not sure about is how the driveshafts would line up. Also, there were some issues with earlier SHO transmissions failing. I had mine replaced twice with under 30,000 miles.

Cheers,
__________________
Tony M.

Panoz AIV Roadster
Triumph MKIII GT6
Lotus Europa (Twin Cam)

Last edited by UKTONY; 24th January 2008 at 02:07 AM. Reason: Added more info...
UKTONY is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2008, 02:58 AM   #10 (permalink)
jac mac's Avatar
jac mac
I Have No Life
New Zealand
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Gore, NZ
Posts: 3,221
Re: SBF What transaxle?

I was under the impression that Randy wished to mount the motor inline rather than sideways to keep with the GT40 theme. The back & under trans as per GM & Toronado/Caddy will present there own problems of placing the motor higher as well, just as the Audi etc transaxles do with the CWP below the input shaft. In the Fiero I mentioned the installation was inline & a very tight fit with the V6/Hewland transaxle - a V8 would have reqd a wheelbase extension.
jac mac is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2008, 09:53 AM   #11 (permalink)
UKTONY's Avatar
UKTONY
Lifetime Premier Supporter
United States
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, USA
GT40: CAV GT #82
Posts: 138
Re: SBF What transaxle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jac mac View Post
I was under the impression that Randy wished to mount the motor inline rather than sideways to keep with the GT40 theme. The back & under trans as per GM & Toronado/Caddy will present there own problems of placing the motor higher as well, just as the Audi etc transaxles do with the CWP below the input shaft. In the Fiero I mentioned the installation was inline & a very tight fit with the V6/Hewland transaxle - a V8 would have reqd a wheelbase extension.

Yep, probably shouldn't respond to things at 2:00 am...bed would have been a better option...

Thanks,
__________________
Tony M.

Panoz AIV Roadster
Triumph MKIII GT6
Lotus Europa (Twin Cam)
UKTONY is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2008, 08:47 AM   #12 (permalink)
domtoni
10 tenths
United Kingdom
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,422
Re: SBF What transaxle?

From the bit I know, a SBC bolts right up to the Fiero transmission, and they are cheap. The Fiero was originally designed with a SBC motor before Chevrolet stopped Pontiac from selling the car in that configuration.

Probably better to sell the Ford motor.

I know Wheel to Wheel Powertrain did a car late last winter for someone. You can find them in Madison Heights Michigan.
domtoni is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2008, 09:37 AM   #13 (permalink)
Ron Earp's Avatar
Ron Earp
Administrator
United States
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: NC, USA
GT40: None.
Posts: 6,308
Post Re: SBF What transaxle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jac mac View Post
I was under the impression that Randy wished to mount the motor inline rather than sideways to keep with the GT40 theme. .
You are correct, my bad.

I like Fieros and I think keeping them Fieros can make a lot of sense. There are a few racing in the SCCA and they do fairly well although the class has little in the way of motor mods.

I can't help but think if the money spent to do all of this sort of work on them was used to improve the suspension and work with an easily packagable GM motor, like the blown 3.8L V6, you'd have a hell of a sports car.
__________________
Ron Earp

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Ron Earp is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th January 2008, 10:36 PM   #14 (permalink)
loctite
Rookie
United States
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Douglasville Ga
Posts: 15
Re: SBF What transaxle?

I've been sercing the web the last few days and found alot of info on mounting a sbf to different transmissions. You have alot of options if you mount it transverse but I would like to mount it long ways as I stated in my first post. You can do this with a sbc and the 325/425 trans axle. As I said before this transaxle comes back under the block so you have room for this mount and keep the cv axles lined up. Just can't find a ford trans like this. I did find a link but i can't find it again about someone who mounted a sbf to a gm th325 transaxle? This would be the same as the sbc mount and keep the cv axles lined up. By using an early 302/351 with a carb and the gm th325 you would not need any computer and special wiring. Also getting a adapter plate made to mount the ford block to the gm trans would not be a big deal. You would have to use the torque convertor for the gm trans. The other prob would be the flexplate. This wound be the mount up between the ford and chevy. You would need to have a flexplate that would fit the ford crankshaft bolt holes and the chevy torque convertor holes. As long as everything fit inside the chevy bellhousing it should work? You would aslo need to fab a pilot bushing. no big deal. Now this is alot of work but it is worth it to me to have a ford motor in this kind of kit.This all seems to easy. What am i missing?
loctite is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th January 2008, 11:41 PM   #15 (permalink)
jac mac's Avatar
jac mac
I Have No Life
New Zealand
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Gore, NZ
Posts: 3,221
Re: SBF What transaxle?

"" What am I Missing ""

You are missing the understanding the detrimental effect the Higher mounting of the engine will have on your C of G and the handling of your car.
jac mac is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th January 2008, 11:50 PM   #16 (permalink)
loctite
Rookie
United States
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Douglasville Ga
Posts: 15
Re: SBF What transaxle?

It should mount up just like the kits for the sbc. A little tail heavy but everyone I've talked to with this swap sez its really not a problem. I just found a kit on the tci site. Has the flexplate, adapter and all hardware to mount a ford to a chevy trans. This looks like what i have been looking for.
loctite is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 28th January 2008, 08:13 AM   #17 (permalink)
Eric Martin
2 Tenths
United States
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Dallas TX U.S.A.
GT40: none now, planning one
Posts: 227
Re: SBF What transaxle?

Quote:
Originally Posted by loctite View Post
It should mount up just like the kits for the sbc. A little tail heavy but everyone I've talked to with this swap sez its really not a problem. I just found a kit on the tci site. Has the flexplate, adapter and all hardware to mount a ford to a chevy trans. This looks like what i have been looking for.
The Toronado/Eldorado drivetrain has been used in kit cars for some time. It is very heavy and puts the engine too high and actually has more weight behind the axle line than in front. I have spoken to several people with this installation and they all said it is very tail heavy and the handling suffers alot. Using the SBF would help with the excess weight but you still have the high mounted motor with its high CG and the rear weight bias. Some Lambo builders have turned this around and moved the differential, and flipped it, to get the weight more to the front.
Eric Martin is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:53 PM.