016 and porsche LSD

[Cliff Beer]

I can definitively say that a stock porsche LSD from a 944 box will bolt right into a standard audi 016 transaxle. A fine member from this site sold me a stock 944 LSD and it bolted right in no problem. The only thing that was different (in terms of fit) was that the 016 open differential has a notch cut in the RH output shaft into which the plastic spline drive gear fits for the rev counter. I didn't bother with notching this in as a) it would be difficult because the metal shaft is very hard metal (would have to use a grinder most likely), and b) my car uses an electronic rotation counter run off the CV axle bolt heads (so I don't need the internal rev counter function).

The stock porsche 944 LSD is a very nice unit - friction plate, not torsen. It's not the most high performance LSD, it only has a few plates, not 10 or more like some of the more modern ones. But, it works well and you can adjust the lock up with the pre-load on the cupped washers on either end of the stack.

Installation is a bit of work as it's not just a matter of taking off the side plate and then removing/installing the LSD. Unfortunately not. The gear set and gear set housing has to be separated from the bellhousing so that the pinion and main shaft are not in the way of getting the diff/crown wheel out of the bellhousing. Then, of course, once the LSD is installed (with new bearings and seals) then the clearance has to be set on the differential...both the pinion/crown clearance and adjustment, and also the lateral clearance and adjustment for the LH/RH taper bearings using the shims set in behind the bearing races. Get ready to take the races in/out a few times, and find a way to do it without damaging the shims or the housing/race.

I also replaced the input/main shaft seal. I didn't replace the pinion taper bearing as it looked very good (hoping that wasn't a mistake...). All the syncros and gear teeth looked excellent, and there was no metal in the old oil which was drained. Filled 'er up with a 50/50 mix of Redline 75W90/75W90NS. The 016 in the car is coded AAZ (OK, but not so great ratios) while the one to be swapped in is coded AFC (more long legged). Now I just need to find a weekend without other distractions I can swap out the transaxles

Sorry I didn't take any pics!

 

[Graeme Stebbing]

Hi Cliff, You may find this of interest before you swap over the boxes,if you have not already added the strengthening plate.
Kit c e n t r a l :: View topic - Audi 016 Strength Revisited

and

Audi Transaxle Upgrade Step-by-Step

regards
Graeme

 

[Cliff Beer]

Thank you Graeme. I hadn't previously seen the chat thread on kitcentral - very interesting, and confirms the other reading that I've done on the subject. With the 944 LSD I've improved the situation with regard to the spider gears/diff - that's good.

I have excellent CV axles so that's also good. Had them built at a 4X4 shop for running 500hp chevy engines.....

I'm planning on installing the strengthening plate kit as well before running it in the car. I actually bought the kit a while back and have it ready to install (will get the aluminum cover machined down this week). My problem with the kit I bought ("AP Products") is that the plate itself doesn't look to me to have enough surface area to really add much strength. I'll snap a pic of it later today and post. The plate in the step-by-step looks good to me however - has a lot more surface area than the one in the kit I bought.

I'm sure I'll get something sorted out with the kit/plate and eventually get it in the car. If it breaks/implodes....well, no big deal, I'll just go get a G50 or ZF. I could go get a G50 or ZF right now, I just think it's kind of fun to work through these little modifications with an underdog transaxle and see if a good outcome can be achieved.

It's kind of like finding a really good cheap wine. Anyone can go out and spend $100 bucks on a really good bottle of wine. For me it's more fun to spend $10 bucks and be really pleasantly surprised once in a while....works well so long as you don't mind drinking a fair bit of cheap wine in the process.....

 

[Pat]

Great post Cliff, thanks for sharing. While you're tinkering, have you given any thought to changing the ring gear or otherwise altering the drive ratios? That's the biggest frustration I have with the 016.

 

[Dave P]

Veek:

I have a porsche 944 ring and pinion and plan on changing it out but it seems a bit more complicated. Attached is the instructions I found some where.

 

[Cliff Beer]

Veek,

Thanks, glad it has been helpful.

I hadn't thought about messing with the R&P ratios, but that's an interesting idea. The 016 I have done this work to is coded AFC, and it should be pretty long legged as such (about 170mph at 6,000rpm with 26.6 rear wheels). I guess the AFC has different R&P than some of the other (shorter legged) 016s??

Based upon my limited experience with it, I would guess that it's pretty much a snap to change the ring gear, but the pinion is going to be quite a bit more difficult on the 016. My experience level (moderate at best) with manual gear boxes stops me before attempting that. I would be concerned I'd tap out a roll pin somewhere and then BOING!! Gears and shims and shafts would go flying everywhere, rolling under other cars, the bench and coming to rest in piles of sawdust and metal filings never to be seen again. But it's a good idea for somebody more skilled than I.