Serious Question Chaps

[David Morton II]

How on earth can this extremely tragic and still unfolding event be on Wikipedia with 2 hours of the actual incident and why?

This is all speculation at the moment, until then you have Fox News for the truth...

2012 Aurora shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Seriously, hope no one here has any friends or relatives involved....

[Mr. Fechter]

Everyone is walking around with more computing power than the Apollo space mission. Skype, Twitter, whatever else is instant communication.

[David Morton II]

Yes I understand Bob, but why? The fucking gunsmoke has barely blown away. Are these people retarded or what?

Wikipedia is going down the tube fast. I hope someone removes that and has the deceny to wait until the dust has settled and there is a solution. This "story" doesn't belong in an (any) on-line encyclopedia at this time period.

Still in progress.....

[Mr. Fechter]

Everyone in this brave new world wants to be noticed, whether its to be the first to report a tragedy, or become a mass murderer. I feel its all part of the "celebrity" culture where it doesn't matter what you did as long as you become famous. Very sad indeed.

[Mark]

A bloody horrible tragedy.

Not that this has any bearing whatsoever and wouldn't change things one bit, but I did wonder to myself, what the hell were children doing out at midnight?

I hope this A-hole gets the chair! Heart-felt sympathy to all those effected.

Agree, not suitable for Wiki. WTF is that all about?

[Pat]

Thoughts and prayers to the victims and families impacted by this atrocity. This occurred less than 10 miles from the Columbine, Colorado high school massacre. Those poor souls must be reliving that nightmare as well.

[David Morton II]

We've all got our fair share of "nutters".

Brave New World Indeed. Two steps forward 6 back.

No words for this....

[Pete McCluskey.]

So sad.

[Al Wohlstrom]

The shooter will get lawyered up, analyzed, medicated, blame it on his parents, and waste millions of tax payer dollars, when they have him dead to rights and should have done something equally as ruthless to him immediately. Anti gun lobyist and politicians will have a hayday and in the end this jerk will come up for parole in 40 years like Manson.

[Erik]

First off my my thoughts are with the familys and frineds.

Second of all this guy is a idiot. Did you know they do not have to register guns or go through a back ground check in CO. The back ground check was dropped a few months ago by CO. Might have made it a bit harder for him to get the gun if there was.

Any way this guy like some one said. He will be out in 40 years. I bet he will be out sooner. He will say he is mentally unable to stand trial. If he is convicted. His layer will say he is a mental case. So he will will sit in a padded room for 20 years. Then he will be allowed to get out.

If he blames is parents. You know what they will do. They will blame the video game and movie industry. I am sorry me and my buddy grew up playing then violent video games. We are both normal and sane well in our mines sane. We also have guns. I know I have never wanted to kill any one.

Any way there was also a mob movie preview playing before it. They had a scene were a bunch of mobsters burst through the screen at a movie theater. Then they lit up the whole place. They pulled the preview from every theater. You cant even see it online any more.

[Dimi Terleckyj]

Hi All

I feel deeply sorry for all the victims and people involved but you must understand that all the gun laws in the world cannot and will not stop this kind of senseless violence.

In Australia we have total gun laws and the average person is not allowed to own a gun.

But we still have shootings and gun violence constantly.

At the beginning of 2012 for the first 2 months of this year we had shootings in Sydney every single night yet guns are banned.

Those that want to commit these crimes will get the guns and means to commit these crimes simply because they are criminals and do not respect the law and the anti gun laws do not apply to them or have the slightest meaning to them.

It is the same with any laws, they are there for the law abiding citizens and not for the others as they do not have any respect or fear for the consequences of their actions, thats why they are criminals.

Dimi.

[Jim Craik]

Dimi,

I too am deeply saddened for the effected folks, their friends and their families.

Additionally as you say countries with strict gun control laws still have shootings, but I'd like you opinion on this chart.

These are UN murder statistics with guns by country from 2002, this data is a little old, but it seems that countries with strict gun laws have considerably fewer deaths.

VIEW DATA:* * Totals *
Definition *** Source ** * Printable version***
** * Bar Graph * * Pie Chart * * Map *

Showing latest available data.
Rank** Countries* Amount*
# 1 * **South Africa: 31,918*
# 2 * **Colombia: 21,898*
# 3 * **Thailand: 20,032*
# 4 * **United States: 9,369*
# 5 * **Philippines: 7,708*
# 6 * **Mexico: 2,606*
# 7 * **Slovakia: 2,356*
# 8 * **El Salvador: 1,441*
# 9 * **Zimbabwe: 598*
# 10 * **Peru: 442*
# 11 * **Germany: 269*
# 12 * **Czech Republic: 181*
# 13 * **Ukraine: 173*
# 14 * **Canada: 144*
# 15 * **Albania: 135*
# 16 * **Costa Rica: 131*
# 17 * **Azerbaijan: 120*
# 18 * **Poland: 111*
# 19 * **Uruguay: 109*
# 20 * **Spain: 97*
# 21 * **Portugal: 90*
# 22 * **Croatia: 76*
# 23 * **Switzerland: 68*
# 24 * **Bulgaria: 63*
# 25 * **Australia: 59*
# 26 * **Sweden: 58*
# 27 * **Bolivia: 52*
# 28 * **Japan: 47*
# 29 * **Slovenia: 39*
= 30 * **Belarus: 38*
= 30 * **Hungary: 38*
# 32 * **Latvia: 28*
# 33 * **Burma: 27*
# 34 * **Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of: 26*
# 35 * **Austria: 25*
# 36 * **Estonia: 21*
# 37 * **Moldova: 20*
# 38 * **Lithuania: 16*
= 39 * **United Kingdom: 14*
= 39 * **Denmark: 14*
# 41 * **Ireland: 12*
# 42 * **New Zealand: 10*
# 43 * **Chile: 9*
# 44 * **Cyprus: 4*
# 45 * **Morocco: 1*
= 46 * **Oman: 0*
= 46 * **Luxembourg: 0*
= 46 * **Iceland: 0*
Total: 100,693**

[Al Wohlstrom]

Jim, Granted a lot of people die in the US via firearms, but we don't get too upset about 50 times that amout being killed by tobacco, or 20 times that amount by medical screwups, etc, etc. I don't see us banning tobacco or Doctors in the near future, seems like a misplaced priority with other motives.
Leading Causes of Death in the United States

[Mr. Fechter]

Al with the notorious manipulations done with statistics, I would wonder how real this is.

Also, what are the stats on a per capita basis.

And, the 500 pound gorilla in the corner is how many lives have been saved by armed citizens defending themselves. They never will/can put that one on paper.

[Jim Rosenthal]

Well, for those of you who do not live in the USA, this happened in Colorado, not California or New York. Colorado is part of the Old West. This guy will NOT get lawyered up and get off on a plea deal with life, no sirree. No prosecutor will have anything to do with a guilty plea unless the man pleads guilty to multiple counts of murder with the expectation he will be executed, like Gary Gilmore did years ago. This man will get tried, convicted, and sentenced to death and executed, which he richly deserves. I don't give a fuck what the voices that may have been in his head told him what to do.

He can be mourned by his family, for what he could have been and what he threw away. They know him in a different way. The rest of us have something else altogether to feel terrible about and to grieve over- all the people who just went out to the movies and didn't come home, or came home wounded.

As to what kids were doing out at that hour- I distinctly recall from my childhood a few occasions like this when as small children we were allowed to stay up very late and go out and do something like this with our parents. These were special events; this was not routine. Taking a child to the movies for a late premiere would have been a treat for all concerned. Most folks on this forum don't have bedtimes anymore and may not recall what it is to stay up very late when you usually go to sleep at eight or nine. I don't think there was anything wrong in those kids being out that late.

And, for what it's worth, the people who innocently took their children to the movies and ended up in the middle of this hellish chaos are already beating themselves up, regardless of whether anyone got hurt or not, so they don't need us to make it worse.

[Jim Rosenthal]

Originally Posted by Al Wohlstrom

Jim, Granted a lot of people die in the US via firearms, but we don't get too upset about 50 times that amout being killed by tobacco, or 20 times that amount by medical screwups, etc, etc. I don't see us banning tobacco or Doctors in the near future, seems like a misplaced priority with other motives.
Leading Causes of Death in the United States

We can't ban doctors. I am too old to learn a new trade.

[Jim Rosenthal]

Originally Posted by Jim Craik

Dimi,

I too am deeply saddened for the effected folks, their friends and their families.

Additionally as you say countries with strict gun control laws still have shootings, but I'd like you opinion on this chart.

These are UN murder statistics with guns by country from 2002, this data is a little old, but it seems that countries with strict gun laws have considerably fewer deaths.

VIEW DATA:* * Totals *
Definition *** Source ** * Printable version***
** * Bar Graph * * Pie Chart * * Map *

Showing latest available data.
Rank** Countries* Amount*
# 1 * **South Africa: 31,918*
# 2 * **Colombia: 21,898*
# 3 * **Thailand: 20,032*
# 4 * **United States: 9,369*
# 5 * **Philippines: 7,708*
# 6 * **Mexico: 2,606*
# 7 * **Slovakia: 2,356*
# 8 * **El Salvador: 1,441*
# 9 * **Zimbabwe: 598*
# 10 * **Peru: 442*
# 11 * **Germany: 269*
# 12 * **Czech Republic: 181*
# 13 * **Ukraine: 173*
# 14 * **Canada: 144*
# 15 * **Albania: 135*
# 16 * **Costa Rica: 131*
# 17 * **Azerbaijan: 120*
# 18 * **Poland: 111*
# 19 * **Uruguay: 109*
# 20 * **Spain: 97*
# 21 * **Portugal: 90*
# 22 * **Croatia: 76*
# 23 * **Switzerland: 68*
# 24 * **Bulgaria: 63*
# 25 * **Australia: 59*
# 26 * **Sweden: 58*
# 27 * **Bolivia: 52*
# 28 * **Japan: 47*
# 29 * **Slovenia: 39*
= 30 * **Belarus: 38*
= 30 * **Hungary: 38*
# 32 * **Latvia: 28*
# 33 * **Burma: 27*
# 34 * **Macedonia, The Former Yugoslav Republic of: 26*
# 35 * **Austria: 25*
# 36 * **Estonia: 21*
# 37 * **Moldova: 20*
# 38 * **Lithuania: 16*
= 39 * **United Kingdom: 14*
= 39 * **Denmark: 14*
# 41 * **Ireland: 12*
# 42 * **New Zealand: 10*
# 43 * **Chile: 9*
# 44 * **Cyprus: 4*
# 45 * **Morocco: 1*
= 46 * **Oman: 0*
= 46 * **Luxembourg: 0*
= 46 * **Iceland: 0*
Total: 100,693**

This list is quite remarkable for the countries not on it. I don't see a lot of Middle Eastern countries, for one thing. Interesting.

[Jim Craik]

Jumbo,

I do not see Brazil or Russia either.

[Al Wohlstrom]

So worldwide, we have about 1/5 the people dying from firearms than are dying from tobacco in the US yearly. The tobacco companies must contribute tons of money politcally!

[Pat]

Currently in Aurora, Colorado, where the shooting took place, it is already unlawful to carry a concealed "dangerous weapon," discharge firearms, unless by law enforcement on duty or on shooting range, and have loaded firearm in motor vehicle.
Norway, where hunting is popular, has some of toughest firearm legislation in world but they were apparently easily circumvented by the mass killer where many categories of guns, including automatics and some powerful handguns, are banned from sale altogether.
But so what - if some deranged homicidal can’t get a gun, they can find something else such as the fertilizer used at the Oklahoma City bombing or like the Unabomber make the weapons themselves. (The paralells between Unabomber and Aurora shooter are chilling).
What we aren't talking about the mentally ill are not accurately assessed, teachers, co-workers friends and relatives are ashamed or afraid of repercussions or violations of political correctness if anything is said. We see that law enforcement won't do anything until someone is killed. Case in point is the Ft Hood shooter.
Fort Hood Shooting: FBI Ignored Evidence Against Nidal Hasan For Political Correctness, Report Says
Root cause here is addressing dangerous mental illness and developing ways these isses can be fairly addressed and acted upon.