Is it worth fighting this parking fine

OK so this has the potential to cost 4 of us £100 each because we read it as charges are from 07:00 to 18:00 Monday to Friday, didn't assimilate the next bit.

They say you can appeal and the fine will be held at £60 if you post them your evidence 14 days from the issue of the notice or it is a £100 fine, if not paid within 21 days. The letter arrived today 13 days after issue, so it is impossible to get the evidence for an appeal to them within their 14 day period.

So by law they are right but a £100 fine for accidentally not paying 50p is surely punitive. We did not cause them to loose any revenue apart from the 50p as the car-park was empty I have asked them for a breakdown of their charges.

So is it worth fighting, asking them if they have CCTV as they will see us walking over to read the sign there was never any intention not to pay just misunderstood what it meant.

Any advice welcome.
 

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Doug S.

The protoplasm may be 72, but the spirit is 32!
Lifetime Supporter
It's always worth the time...NEVER give in to their money-grabbing ways. ALWAYS make them work for it (I always ask for a trial...you'd be surprised how many times they have dismissed the case because the police officer did not show up for the trial!).

RAGE against the machine!!!

Cheers!

Doug
 
It's always worth the time...NEVER give in to their money-grabbing ways. ALWAYS make them work for it (I always ask for a trial...you'd be surprised how many times they have dismissed the case because the police officer did not show up for the trial!).

RAGE against the machine!!!

Cheers!

Doug

Thanks Doug,

Happened to my son his advice was "Private company ignore load of rubbish have as much right to fine u as the milkman See how my court case goes been waiting 3 years."

Slight difference is he had a valid paid parking ticket and they were trying to charge him £100 for taking 5 minutes to find a space and pay for the ticket.

Also, as a sensitive tree hugger ;) glass half empty guy my nerves are not as good as his, but my sense of injustice is :)
 
Google has it's uses

Private parking tickets on private land

Private parking firms CANNOT fine you. Tickets at supermarkets and private car parks may be disguised as fines, but they are really just invoices. They are not regulation 10 Penalty Charge Notices issued by an authority.

Private car parks are usually unmanned and take your vehicle registration using ANPR when you drive in. You enter your vehicle registration into the machine when you buy your ticket, but if you don't buy a ticket or enter a wrong registration, the registered keeper receives a demand through the post.

The parking company gets the name of the vehicle keeper from the DVLA. However unlike local authority tickets, there is no legal power for parking companies to force the keeper to make over the name of the driver. The registered keeper receives a volley of letters each one more threatening than the previous. If you ignore them, it might well come to nothing, but they MAY take you to court.

If a parking company tries to take you to court, then the parking company is taking a calculated risk. At this stage, you can either defend the claim or pay it. You can say you are only the registered keeper of the vehicle and were not the driver that attracted the charge. In other words, there is no contract between you and the parking company that gives rise to the claim.

Bringing a claim in the county court for by private parking company ticket is financial uneconomical. Under court rules, the claimant, being the parking company pays their own solicitors fees regardless the outcome of the claim.

Parking companies rely on you not defending the claim and getting a default judgment against you. If that happened, you will not be able to apply to set the judgment aside because you do not have a reasonable defence. The judgment of ParkingEye Limited v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67 ruled a parking fine is neither extravagant nor unconscionable.

So, if you get court papers, then you must DEFEND the claim. That makes the claim financially uneconomical for the parking to pursue.
 
Hi Nick,<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>
You’ve got to fight it as they are thieving b******s working in very grey area of the law.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
I had a similar incident a few years ago, caught on CCTV for parking in an area I’d previously used. I didn’t receive the original notification, so it went straight to £100 fine – how strange is that and as I disputed it, it was passed to a debit recovery firm, when the overall fine became £150!<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
I fought back and, disputed everything and asked for the evidence. As part of their guidelines (British Parking Association) it states it that they need clear photographic evidence of the vehicle, specifically the number plate. In my case they’d guessed a couple of digits and then matched it with the DVLA database. When I pointed this out to them, they dropped the case<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
The devils in the detail in these matters, the code of practice can be downloaded from the BPA website, don’t let the b******s win<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
Rgds,<o:p></o:p>
Andy<o:p></o:p>
 

Keith

Moderator
Difficult area but lawyers I know say just ignore them. Others say don't ignore them. I think the middle ground is that you acknowledge receipt and depending on circumstances say that you are not paying. I have never yet met anyone who has been taken to court but I'm sure they exist. As you say, only the local authority and the Police can fine you. In essence, all you are technically guilty of is trespass and that carries a £5 fine at worst.

It appears you have done your homework well. Good luck...
 
Difficult area but lawyers I know say just ignore them. Others say don't ignore them. I think the middle ground is that you acknowledge receipt and depending on circumstances say that you are not paying. I have never yet met anyone who has been taken to court but I'm sure they exist. As you say, only the local authority and the Police can fine you. In essence, all you are technically guilty of is trespass and that carries a £5 fine at worst.

It appears you have done your homework well. Good luck...

Thanks Keith,

Big problem is this, you have to appeal to Excel parking first, they then decide whether or not your appeal is upheld. So you are relying on the judge jury and executioner to say yes we got it wrong. I would love to know how many times if any they have accepted they made a mistake.

Next step if they reject my appeal is the option to use their “independent” appeals service AIS, they used to use POPLA for appeals, when at least you had a chance of winning. Unfortunately, AIS who they now use have been described as a kangaroo court by many, so I will not be using them. Also, at this point they put their £60 invoice up to £100 if you decide to use AIS.

To show what AIS are like it is a basic principle of a fair appeals service that each party is given the opportunity to see the other party's case and to comment upon it. This is the position at POPLA. Appellants should obviously see the evidence in it's entirety.A party may challenge the contents of a particular document and this will be carefully considered but in the absence of evidence to the contrary, what is produced in all of the circumstances might contain some or all of the information required to determine the issue.

Here is step 3 of the IAS appeals process

OPERATOR RESPONSE TO COMPLAINT
The operator is provided with 5 working days to provide written representations and evidence in support of their response to you. You will be notified by email when this has been submitted and the case will then be placed before an adjudicator for a decision to be made.

Please note, you are not able to respond to these submissions but you can view them by logging into the system.

As the IAS does not allow motorists to see and comment on the operators entire evidence. In a number of appeals seen, the parking company has submitted false evidence or distorted the truth, yet the motorist has been refused permission to bring this to the attention of the assessor.appeal. The IPC have also refused to reconsider any verdict.

In contrast, in cases where false evidence has been presented to POPLA which has come to light after the event, the case has been reheard.

Only 20% of appeals heard by AIS are upheld I believe with POPLA it is around 50%.

So after their rejection you have a £100 fine to pay, debt collectors letters start usually (as Andy found out) followed by notices to proceed with a case, (at which point they have pushed their costs up to a few hundred pounds), where you then have the stress and have to spend time filling in fairly complex legal forms.

Simon Renshaw-Smith is the owner of Excel and his attitude to the law is well known. When he lost a court case against Martin Cutts he described the court ruling as "an embarrassment to the judicial system" and described the judge as "not fit to serve the civil courts". The car park in question, the Peel Centre, remains one of the most complained about car parks on forums. The signage at the Peel Centre remains appalling

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBV5tlCsaFI

It is of course a matter of record that on BBC WatchDog an undercover journalist caught IPC company PCM UK admitting they provided false information in appeals.

So I expect like most when my appeal fails with Excel I will end up paying the £60 invoice as any further appeal is probably futile and in my opinion AIS is basically a kangaroo court.
 
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