RCR Body Fitting hints

[Randy V]

I swiped the following quote from Mark Reid's build thread in the hopes that we could get a good central repository for hints on fitting from guys like Ron Randall..

This is the first RCR product that has passed threw our doors and let me say I am very impressed to say the least. Mark installed all the mechanics and we will be doing the body fit, prep, paint work and metal plating. The best advise I would offer to any one that is fitting there RCR body to the chassis is to start with the rocker panel first, I like to slot one hole in each panel and use the slot to align the panels, next I slot the spider the same way using the rear clip as a guide and leave a 3/16 gap. Install the front clip the same way. The doors take the longest to get right, I slotted the aluminum mounting point horizontally, this give you easy adjustment of the door up, down, forward and rearward and with the adjustment that Fran has designed into his hinge its make it possible to get 3/16 inch gaps in ALL THE BODY PANELS.
I have not done any edge fitting yet and already the body panels and gaps looks great. All I can say is "Fran if all your bodies fit this way I will work on your product any day!!

Ron - I'd love to see some pics of where you are talking about the slots in the spider and rockers..
Also - It seems like you dial in everything off of the rear clip. Since the rear clip has a lot of up/down - fore/aft adjustment from the pivot points and the rear mounting tray, I'm curious if you just dialed that in first to center the wheels in the wheel wells...

If Mark or anyone else could add some illustrations, it would sure help many of us that are just now or will be getting to that phase soon...

Thanks!

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

Randy,

Ron spoke at length with one of the RCR techs..Jason I think.

The factory technique is using the front suspension/wheel location and then rocker panels as a station to base all else.

 

[Randy V]

Hi Fran,

So then, the idea would be to;
1) Get the front suspension set at ride height
2) Good preliminary caster/camber/toe setting
3) Position the front clip so the wheels are centered in the arches
4) Set the rockers to match the front clip
5) Set the spider so the trailing edge of the B-Pillar meets with the edge of the rocker & also fits close at the front to the front clip **
6) Set the rear suspension at ride height
7) Preliminary Toe setting on rear suspension
8) Set the rear clip so the wheels are centered in the arches
9) Adjust gap between rear clip and spider by trimming / building
10) Doors adjust to fit - this may mean moving the rocker panels in/out at the front and rear to get appropriate contour from the door to the rocker.

** Spider must be supported in the middle to maintain appropriate contour and windshield clearance - BTW - On my car, this is 27-5/8" (so far) - see build site for more info.

Thanks for any clarification / corrections you can offer up here Fran!

Come-on RCR guys... Share your knowledge here..

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

That about covers it Randy.....

 

[Randy V]

Thanks Fran...

From Ron Randall on Mark Reid's build thread:

Randy that sound like a great idea, I will check it out and and see if I can add anything.

Randy I set the top of the doors 1/8 inch lower than the spider, I used a built up gasket to simulate the height, when it comes time to to install the gasket I have may different types and height to get the doors to fit. The main thing you want to do is get the door to fit the spider perfect when the door is installed after its been painted I will adjust the door to be 1/8 inch heigher than the spider, then use the latch to pull the door down when its closed. I do this so that there is no chance the door can sag and hit the spider as its being shut. Many times in the past I have adjuste a fiberglass door only to have a customer come back with a chip when the door expanded in the heat or just settled into its new home. So by leaving the door alittle high, this is insurance that you will not a problem. If after a few months the doors does not move you can always lower it but the only time the door would be high is when it was opened and there is nothing to gauge the difference in height.
Ron Randall

PS
The user name rich10 is my home computor

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

It should also be considered that the door eyebrows really are a functional item and should be taken into account when doing door edge trimming and fitment

 

[Randy V]

Fran,

I presume that RCR sells the eyebrows too. Are they Fiberglass? How to they attach to the spider?

 

[Rob]

Hey Randy,
The only thing that I would add to your list is to install weather strip prior to fitting the doors. The weather strip should be considered an integral part of the fitment, as it will affect it.

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

Dont forget to align the nose using the front bobbins prior to doing any major alignment,.

 

[Randy V]

Dont forget to align the nose using the front bobbins prior to doing any major alignment,.

OKay - I'll re-compile the sequence tonight...

Question about the Bobbins.
So getting the fore/aft spacing to center the wheels in the arches is pretty straight forward. Would setting the elevation of the nose be dependant upon the doors being fitted or??

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

No....a horizontal plane between the feet of the nose and the top of the rockers is the guide.....

 

[Chris Kouba]

Hey Randy,
The only thing that I would add to your list is to install weather strip prior to fitting the doors. The weather strip should be considered an integral part of the fitment, as it will affect it.

Seeing this come up a bunch of times, I am compelled to reinforce this point. If you only want to do your doors once, get your weatherstripping installed and then align them. Otherwise you're guaranteed to align them all over again.

 

[Randy V]

No....a horizontal plane between the feet of the nose and the top of the rockers is the guide.....

"The feet of the Nose"

I have to say I've pondered this for well over an hour and looked at a LOT of profile pictures of the Mk1 and MK2 trying to figure out what it is you are getting at and I just couldn't figure it out..

I wish I had some sort of PAINT tool that I knew how to use on this bloody Macintosh to draw some lines on a profile picture.. From what I can tell - the line drawn straight off the top of the rocker panel forward would split the distance between the headlight and driving light recesses..
Is that right?

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

The "feet" on the nose would be the sections that rests on the rocker panel....that lower edge and the top of the rocker panel should be parallel.

Chris, agreed

 

[Rob]

I believe this is what Fran is speaking of....

 

[Randy V]

RCR-40 Body Fitting Essentials

Preface
Make no permanent changes or mounts until you are completely happy with the fit of the body. It would not be uncommon to have to go back and make adjustments in areas that you thought were finalized.

1) Level Chassis on Stands
Spend the time to get your chassis as level and stable as possible.

2) Get the front suspension set at ride height
Lower control arms will be level to the ground (Note-1)

3) Good preliminary caster/camber/toe setting
Toe = Zero / Caster = +4 to +7 / Camber = 0 to -1.5

4) Position the front clip so the wheels are centered in the arches

5) Set the rockers to match the front clip at the wheel arch opening

6) Set the height of the front clip’s nose by adjusting the bobbins to the point where the rear-bottom of the front clip sits flush with the Rockers. See Rob’s illustration above in this thread.

7) Set the spider so the trailing edge of the B-Pillar meets with the rear edge of the rocker & also fits close (choose your tolerance) at the windshield base to the front clip (Note-2)

8) Set the rear suspension at ride height
Lower control arms will be level to the ground (Note-1)

9) Preliminary Toe setting on rear suspension
Toe = Zero / Camber = 0 to -1.5

10) Set the rear clip so the wheels are centered in the arches

11) Set the height of the rear clip’s tail by adjusting the mount pivot points to where the front bottom of the clip sits flush with the Rockers. Since this is very similar to the positioning of the front clip - please see Rob’s illustration above in this thread.

12) Install weather stripping at the top of the spider or shims that will place the roof of the door flush with the top of the spider when set in place. (Note-3)

13) Install door hinges per RCR Manual or see any of the various RCR Builder sites for further reference points.

14) Doors adjust to fit - this may mean moving the rocker panels in/out at the front and rear to get appropriate contour from the door to the rocker. It may require some trimming or building of fiberglass to achieve your desired fit tolerance. (Note-4)

15) Adjust gap between rear clip and spider by trimming / building the fiberglass.


Note-1 Loosen the spring adjusters or remove the shocks altogether and use ratchet straps to “suspend” the weight of the suspension to the point where the lower control arms are level.

Note-2 Spider must be supported in the middle to maintain appropriate contour and windshield clearance - BTW - On my car, this is 27-5/8" (so far) - see my build site for more info.

Note-3 If installing Door Eyebrows, this would be a good time to do it as the doors will need to be trimmed to fit properly.

Note-4 (contributed by Ron Randall) I set the top of the doors 1/8 inch lower than the spider, I used a built up gasket to simulate the height, when it comes time to install the gasket I have may different types and height to get the doors to fit. The main thing you want to do is get the door to fit the spider perfect when the door is installed after its been painted I will adjust the door to be 1/8 inch higher than the spider, then use the latch to pull the door down when its closed. I do this so that there is no chance the door can sag and hit the spider as its being shut. Many times in the past I have adjusted a fiberglass door only to have a customer come back with a chip when the door expanded in the heat or just settled into its new home. So by leaving the door a little high, this is insurance that you will not a problem. If after a few months the doors do not move you can always lower them but the only time the door would be high is when it was opened and there is nothing to gauge the difference in height.

 

[Chuck]

Randy:

Nice job pulling all this information together in one place. Useful and helpful suggestions.

 

[Randy V]

Thanks Chuck - And Rob - that was precisely the image needed!!! Thank you!

Fran or anybody - if you see something else that should be added, I will update this thread and sequence with the information..

 

[EGLITOM]

Just a few things i did:

Adjusting the front wheel center within the wheel well is difficult, because the profile of the wheel well makes defining measuring points difficult, also due to the caster the wheel turns in different in the front as it does towards the rockers. What i did was to move the right rockerpanel as far back as possible ( until the bottom inward front corner touches the chassis). To do so you will have to notch a little the mounting lip of the chassis to clear the female part of the location pin. I than adjusted the left rocker panel to the same forward dimension, by measuring from the a pillar post as an reference. Double check this also towards the wheelcenters ( if you have them setup properly before) to validate. Than i lined the front clip up at the wheel wells to the rocker panel by adjusting the male locator pin location accordingly.
Next step was set the front clip height and left to right alignement. This is purely achieved with adjustments of the bobins. Make sure they run nice in the slot to make adjustment easy without any other force effects to the clip. As an refeernce us your brakedisc plane for left to right adjustment and the left to right location in reference to the A pillars of the chassis. Correct height is verfied like ROB has shown in the picture above. I turned my locater pins down in my lay to achive the 1/8" gap i targeted for.
Next was SPIDER location. I targeted for a centered left to right postion in the front. Refernce was the top of the chassis as well as the front clip gap there.
I then hung may doors adjusted the targetd gap i the front towards the front clip and than fixed the spider to the position which gave me than the targeted gap on the rear of the door.
Door plane adjustment is helped by having the rocker panels still loose, to be able to adapt them to the bottom corner plane, as soon the roof plane is ok. The 66" distance is just a starting point. I ended up having them at 65 3/4" for best result.
Last was positioning of the rear clip. Left to right centered, with the brake disk plane as references. Height adjusted that rear spoiler is leved and that the gap versus the rocker panel is even and parallel like on the front clip. Adjust your Spider to rear clip like described in the build manual (even dimension on both sides towards the rear spoiler edge). See where you end up with the wheel well alignement towards the rockers and wheel center.

PICS
schwabtom/BODY ALIGNEMENT - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

TOM

 

[Dwight]

I know this is a four year old thread but it's a tremendous help to me.

Thanks for everyone that contributed.

This will save me a lot of time.

Dwight