ABS and traction control on Apex

I am entertaining the idea of adding both ABS and traction control to my Apex build. Would like your opinions on having (OR not having as many of you prefer) them on your cars AND if you have information on incorporating the C5 ABS as a standalone. My car will be about 75% street use so I think they are a good idea.

I started looking at this because I knew that I would have to address my brake bias and I was considering upgrading the eclipse master cylinder (3g is 2/16 larger and I thought it might be a better match for the C5 brakes). I would've like to add a dual master cylinder setup but my budget is too tight. But since I started with a C5 donor car I have the ABS pump and EBCM. If I can incorporate it I gain ABS and don't have to buy a bias proportioning valve (bosch ABS units incorporate dynamic proportioning so it will always be "optimal"). It appears the C5 units can be ran stand alone and you can even incorporate a switch to turn ABS on/off, but I haven't found any detailed build logs or substantial information with them. I think some gtm's have used them. Any direction to information you've seen on this would be appreciated.

As for traction control...this came into being a possibility as I'm toying with the idea of a stand alone ecu for the LS1 instead of using hp tuners. I planned to use the Holley HP but it prevented me from using the DBW TB which I already have. Then I read more on the Haltech Elite ecu. Not only can it run the DBW it reads flex fuel sensors (I plan to run e85) and is supposed to support traction control potentially by various methods like retarding engine and the DBW throttle control. Seems it might be worth the additional 3k for a self learning ecu and added functions.
 
Doesn't mega squirt also do the same? As far as race logic goes they still support it but no new systems so buy in stock or used and problem solved. The aem unit has it built in as well
 
My primary focus is getting the c5 corvette abs working on the car and hopefully being able to turn it on and off by switch. So hoping somebody may have some experience with this.

I appreciate the suggestions on the TC units but I'm not really looking to buy a separate unit. I was already planning on doing a standalone ecu and the haltech just happens to support TC. Megasquirt does read wheel speed and pulls timing when it sees variances however ms3 cannot control dbw which is far more effective. So I'd have to replace throttle body and run cable system and it would be less effective. Otherwise the ms3 is cheaper but does not self tune and is not as user friendly but is does read flex fuels sensors and adjust maps something the Holley dominator and hp don't do. Also holley dominator says to control dbw but only certain ones...not ls1. So it will be the elite 2500 or hp tuners.
 
The AEM does everything and I know one builder of an SL-C on here has a complete corvette drive train with holographic wind shield display and all. Don't know if he has any of the stuff your asking about hooked up BUT I think he is running the corvette BCM and ECM so he would probably be the one best suited to ask.
 
The AEM does everything and I know one builder of an SL-C on here has a complete corvette drive train with holographic wind shield display and all. Don't know if he has any of the stuff your asking about hooked up BUT I think he is running the corvette BCM and ECM so he would probably be the one best suited to ask.

Didn't research the AEM much...I'll look into it. I looked at the diagram of the entire system yaw, wheel speed, steering angle etc, I can only imagine what it takes to use everything. I think Ken's the one doing that. I was hoping he might see this and chime in.

I also found this article related to Matt's 69 camaro who got this to work (in my first link).

Hotrod.com article on abs

and some good info on protouring

Protouring thread on ABS
 
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You really should cruise the SL-C threads as this very topic (and that link with another 69 camaro was posted with the same conversion was posted in it) has been discussed. I have a feeling most of you APEX guys should just start following those builds since a lot of the same issues are going to come up with this build. Also the Sl-C guys are great for the most part.
 
Getting traction control or abs to function, and getting them to be effective for a given platform are two entirely different animals. A friend does development and testing for oems on these systems and I have heard lots of stories about tuning and getting the system to be right even within the original design specifications of the car it was designed for. To transplant the system into a different car, which has a completely different layout, weight balance, etc and expect it to behave like an oem-designed system would be a stretch at best. They are not self-learning systems but need to be tuned much like an engine throttle map. I'm not suggesting you shouldn't try, but keep your expectations in check.

A.J.
 
It actually rained in California last night and I tested out my traction control this morning! :thumbsup: It worked.
 
Getting traction control or abs to function, and getting them to be effective for a given platform are two entirely different animals. A friend does development and testing for oems on these systems and I have heard lots of stories about tuning and getting the system to be right even within the original design specifications of the car it was designed for. To transplant the system into a different car, which has a completely different layout, weight balance, etc and expect it to behave like an oem-designed system would be a stretch at best. They are not self-learning systems but need to be tuned much like an engine throttle map. I'm not suggesting you shouldn't try, but keep your expectations in check.

A.J.

This is definitely my concern with the ABS. I feel like giving it a shot and seeing how it will perform. If I'm not happy I can run with it disabled and investigate tuning/programming options further in the future (though this doesn't seem promising given the complexity and lack of interface).

How do you think the brake feel is affected by running the brake lines through the ABS while it's turned off. Doubtful that it is 100% pass through front/back. I think I need to look at the inside of one of these things.

What I don't want is crappy brakes with it on and crappy brakes with it off.
 
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Glad they worked!!! and you weren't a contribution to the 2 hour commute (20 miles) I had.

I did it on purpose. I live in a pretty rural area and before I get on 101 there are a few places I can let it slide a bit in relative safety.

I agree with you on the commute! Mine is 35 miles, but as soon as roads get wet, many Californians forget how to drive!
 
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