gear lever

Huw Peplow · 05-07-07, 02:44 PM

However much I try cannot get enough movement to get all the gears .Have achieved all 6 forward gears then cannot quite get reverse always slipping into 1st
Looking at the gear stick itsself its movement is limited by its rose joint and its steel collets held with circlips see pics
to increase its movement I plan to thin down the collets as the photo shows there is a dramatic increase in movement with a minor amount of collet thining(just rasied the collet to show the possible effect os thining it on lathe)
Anyone else had this problem ,if so how did you solve it

Frank Catt · 05-07-07, 03:08 PM

Huw, you are going in the right direction, because the lower joint on the lever has to traverse an arc, then the lever at the swivel joint needs movement up and down to allow for the change in length between the joints. You can do away with the collets altogether if the first section of operating rod is supported by two bearings. The problem with the outer gear selection ( r /1 AND 4/5 ) IS that the radius of the ball joint prevents you going right into the corner of the gate, so the solution is to use a bigger spherical bearing then sleeve it down, it gives you a much greater radius for the lever to move. Frank

Mark Worthington · 05-07-07, 03:19 PM

Bingo. What Frank said. Check these out:

AED Motorsport Products - Your supplier of Misalignment Bushings

Alternatively, I thonk you could also use a high-deflection rod end.

AED Motorsport Products - Your supplier of FK Rod Ends

Andrew E · 05-07-07, 05:41 PM

Hi Huw,

Sounds like your not getting enough movement across the selectors to get reverse. The rod change splines can be located in three possible positions. I would suggest moving to another position on the splines to enable enough throw to select reverse but also still get six forward gears.

Andrew

Huw Peplow · 05-09-07, 02:03 PM

thanks all have just tried with the collets both below the bearing but still not enough movement. where in uk can I get a threaded rose joint of larger dimension but same thread size to fit into the rf mounting point. I can turn a bush to fit .
tried all three spline poss settings but reverse remained elusive or the 5th and 6th gears failed any one photos of this area as it would be good to see your set up clearances
Had to make the forward gear box rose joint mounting plate my self as it was missing from the kit may be this is also affecting it

Frank Catt · 05-09-07, 02:08 PM

Huw, you are welcome to give me a call to discuss, Frank (01323 843839 )

Huw Peplow · 05-10-07, 05:53 AM

Thank you frank for a very informative chat and now have discovered the true cause of lack of reverse!!! ITS THE GEARBOX SELECTOR SHAFT.
Using mole grips on the shaft it selects 1 to 6th easily then if Im correct it enters the gating for reverse and then locks out just short of engage ment

Now just to check my findings lets go to basics.This isan audi six speed this means 6 forward gears and one reverse.

the reverse is found by pulling the converted selector shaft out as far as possible beyond 1+2 then rotating it clockwise.(this feels where it wants to go but wont quite make it!

If this is correct I need to strip out the shaft and examine it
HOW?

There are 2 setector stents(sprung) and then an rf made oil seal . This is bolted to a new welded housing on the right side of the box . some of you have done your own conversions out there so I should be able to find the fault aand correct it
HELP

Bobski · 05-10-07, 09:58 AM

Huw, is your motor running? Because I had the same problem and couldn't select reverse no matter how hard I tried and as soon as the motor was running, Bingo, in she goes.

Bob

Huw Peplow · 05-10-07, 12:43 PM

going to try tonight .jack the car up sit the wife in it and turn it over on the starter motor if not with some fuel

Andrew E · 05-12-07, 05:06 AM

Hi Huw,

Attached photos, first overhead in neutral, second photo side view in neutral, third photo overhead in reverse, forth photo side view in reverse, hope these assist. As Bobski has mentioned they can be difficult to select gears without the engine running mainly due to the gearbox being dry and oil not being splashed over the syncros. Mine was like that until I had run the car.

The positioning of the lever off the selector shaft is critical to successfully get all gears and reverse, the locking nut needs to be done tight and loctited to prevent slippage on the selector shaft.

Andrew

Huw Peplow · 05-12-07, 01:14 PM

have found reverse and as you all said had to get the engine running first.Now this prompted me to put the box in reverse then assemble the gear change lever at the rear.This could not be assembled as the front rose joint would not tighten while in reverse.This is mounted on a plate I made myself but looks identical in position to the photos shown.
My thoughts are if the distance A-A in my diagram was lengthened by 5mm the solution would be achieved orthere is the option of remaking the front rose joint gear box mounting plate
Could someone please measure A-A before I attack mine with grinder and welder
Thank you all for your efforts in helping me sort this problem

Andrew E · 05-12-07, 04:40 PM

Hi Huw,
Seeing your drawing on the rear section of the change mechanism has made me realise that they are different between five and six speed. Are you sure you have a six speed one? I'll measure mine and advise.

Andrew

Huw Peplow · 05-13-07, 04:37 AM

gear box is definitley 6 speed and changer looks remarkably like those in the photos.
The second or mid shaft runs very close to thesupport bar for the removable cross member and in previous attempts does touch

Andrew E · 05-13-07, 07:40 AM

Huw,

I wasn't suggesting that your gearbox is not a six speed but there is a dfference in the length of the rear change rods between five and six speeds.

RF2 would have the plate for the rose joint that bolts onto the gearbox, if this is an option I can always get one and post over? I would be relucant IMHO to modify the change rod as this will impact on the amount (excessive) gearlever throw. I remember also that I had some clearance issues through panel holes which needed to enlarged.

Andrew

Huw Peplow · 05-13-07, 09:26 AM

Is the difference between 5 and 6 speed a difference in length at A-A as in diagram If so ,and with the parts supplied with car its quite likely that ,I have been supplied a 5 speed rear connection arm
I have sent message to rf2 reference this and hope to get a rapid response.
They have been exceptionally helpful so far which bodes well for them

Andrew E · 05-13-07, 05:43 PM

Hi Huw,

The difference between 5 & 6 Speed rear change rods is not the length of item A you wanted measured but the location of A along the length of the change rod.

Andrew

Huw Peplow · 05-13-07, 06:44 PM

see what you mean.
today set box in reverse then assembled rose joints etc arround this setting as this would force me to assemble the whole lot in a reverse obtainable fashion .Unfortuneately the splined conector rod would not fit onto the final change rod as the bolt bottomed out on theuniversal joint below it!!

The New Roaring Forties · 05-13-07, 09:40 PM

Hi Huw,

Andrew is correct, dimension A is the same (54mm) for 5 and 6 speed.

I have the rose joint brackets in stock, please let me know if you decide you need one,

Regards Paul RF

Huw Peplow · 05-14-07, 06:16 PM

thanks for all your support especially the new RF

Huw Peplow · 05-19-07, 06:49 PM

for the benefit of chris the other sa rf owner

The gear box change mechanism is not as others on our cars, Having spent nearly one month on this particular problem I am getting to understand the ins and outs of it.

The dimensions given of 54 mm by others for the vertical swaybar on the final link of the change system would in no way work on my system after its conversion .In fact a length of A-A as measured in a previous diagram on this thread varied as the box went through the gears

A-A 5th and 6th with the changer peg pushed right by the oil seal bolt heads 45mm
3rd and 4th 52mm
1st and 2nd 59mm
reverse 62mm
hence there has to be a problem with either the length A-A or the position of the peg on the shaft through the gear box

Looking at previous photos(thanks ) there is a distinct difference in the conversion to my box .(see photo)

Primarily there was a shoulder on the through gearbox shaft preventing the peg going close enough to the gear box. As the changer shaft through the box diverges away from the horizontal gear change shaft at about 15 degrees the peg connecting with this shaft needs to be as close to the box as possible which in turn reduces the required length A-A to the 54 mm for reverse gear

I have so far turned down the oil seal mount by 5mm and corespondingly ridden the peg further up the shaft over the shoulder which has alieviated the problem to a greater degree. Will try and counter sink the bolt heads tomorrow and probably shave off some more of the oil seal

Compare the photo with that of easta earlier in this thread.Look at the welded on end on the reversing light casting see how mine protrudes further from the box than the other (chris at this point i have already removed 5 mm off oil seal)

the front mount is home made and is too low compared with where it should be by 3mm so although this now works I still need to move the peg closer to the oil seal

SLOWLY GETTING THERE