Warning: Probe 427

WARNING:

I am compelled to advise you all about Probe Industries, aka Probe Racing, aka, Coast High Performance of Torrance, CA.

I purchsed a 427 engine from Probe cost about $9,800.
The engine was installed and dyno tested by JC Performance. They noticed immediately that the engine showed severe signs of being defective, the compression ratio was way too high, among other things, and if left unattended would have blown up.

Not such a big deal! Take out the engine and simply return it to Probe and have them send another engine! Not the case. After Probe got the engine back and conducted their own inspection they found the claims of JC Performance to be accurate, in fact the compression ratio was all wrong, among other things.
They refused to replace the engine.
In fact they wanted me to use the defective engine regardless, with their modifications.

Now which one of you is going to put a defective used engine in a vehicle valued at $100,000? I guess no-one.

Probe has absolutely no customer service or follow up. They are experts at concealing their policy and agenda until you make a claim. Good thing I had JC Performance for the install.
I am now forced to litigate the matter, I will prevail since Probe has admitted in writing that the engine was defective.

I am convinced that Probe is short for PROBLEM.
Hope you do not get caught by them.

John Place.
GT40

Hi John,

Sorry to hear that. I would be pissed off beyond all belief! Just some thoughts. Are you sure Probe & Coast are one in the same? I have dealt with Chris Huff (Believe that was his last name) before. He is one of the two owners. He took good care of me several years ago. I do know things change, but would suggest you speak with Chris one on one. Last time I tried to reach him (on the phone) he had a fellow by the name of Martin assist me. May want to try him as well. I'd bet if you get a hold of Chris, he'll fix you up.

Good luck with this. Keep us posted...

A fellow CAV owner

John,

Sorry to hear this, I am sure you will get your money back and then some. It is great that you had an independent shop (JC performance) verify the builder’s claims.

You know about my fiasco with the FMS motor. IMHO, all these manufacturers need to be told “your motor WILL BE DYNOED, do you have a problem with that?” That is when the pretenders disappear real quick, and the good ones say “NO PROBLEM”. Keep us posted on how this turns out.

Hi Tom;

Thanks for the advise. I will try to call Chris.
Martin is the one who gave all the grief.
Will keep you informed.

John

Is there anything more to the story?

Guy on Club Cobra, Andy Dunn, had a 427 he ruined because he installed the lines to his remote oil cooler backwards, of course there was no way for Coast/Probe to know this when he sent the engine back, but they completely rebuilt the engine and sent it back. He reinstalled it and did the same thing again - Coast, as I recall, was going to send somebody to work with this guy's local engine builder when he realizecd what he had done. I believe he paid Coast for the 2nd engine, but the point is that he had tremenduous service from them.

Keep working with them, their service is usually excellent.

I personally have a Coast 347 and received excellent service. But, it was easy for them, nothing went wrong.

David Lowell

Some of you guys I see over at CC feel free to correct anything I have misstated.

It is WELL worth the $500 or so that Keith, Coastal, etc. charge for dynoing the motor before you get it. Many send a video of your engine. This way if things go wrong it goes wrong on their nickel, without the shipping hassles, and without the claims hassles.

Dave;

You are talking about people in JC Perf building and installing race engines all the time. Not as simple as your story installing pipes incorrect.
Probe stated they installed the wrong pistons as the Comp ratio was near 11.6:1 - not a street engine. They confirmed other parts were faulty. They were talking with an expert engine installer and were quite unco-operative.
We are still open for them to come to the table and resolve the problem, this is months old now.

John

Sorry,

My story was not to question you or your engine people; just to show how Coast gave great customer service even when the problem was not caused by them.

I am surprised you are receiving such poor customer service because I have heard such great things about them

David Lowell

OK here's my 2 cents, Before you spend a lot of money on lawers take a day trip down to Coast and talk to the OWNER. Make your case and except a motor that meets your specs even if it is based on the orginal build. It would be resonable to ask for a warrenty that covers the face that they will rebuild your motor with new correct pistons and all related parts and extend the warrenty period to make up for the fact that they will be reuseing the crank, block etc.

I would not worry to much about a 11 to 1 motor that was run only for a few short mins as long as there was no valve interference or other dammage.

Maybe you can get them to include a dyno run for customer service/satisfaction. Again lawers will not only extend the lenght of time you take to get this resolved but will surely cost you more money in the end.

I don't have any relation to Coast or whatever it is called, I would just like to see you get it resolved without any more pain on your part.

Good luck.

Well, here is the next update;

Tom, I followed yr advise and called Chris Huff, owner of Probe. He was in a meeting each time I called, then Martin answered and stated that "Chris Huff never takes any call unless he knows the reason for the call". Must have a lot of problems! Martin is the person who told JC Perf that they may have used "cheapy" pistons causing the problems.

Martin stated that they credited $6,389 on March 18, 04 and the matter should be resolved with return of money. He then admitted that he did not know if the $3,000 deposit had been returned and he would talk with the Sales Manager or Chris Huff and call me back on my cell phone. That was Wed and it's now Sunday!
JC Performance have not received a credit, but had received a letter from Probe stating that they would auction the engine??? That is high handed arrogance, and again confusing feedback. Since the engine was ordered it's 8 months. That is total lack of service and what good business would let this go on?

Dave, I also believe that attorneys only waste money, but it leaves no other way. I would easily have resolved the matter with Probe, but their hands-off arrogance makes me mad and I do not care about attorneys costs. They do not even know me so it can happen to anyone.

John

Latest news

The Credit Card company reviewed the representations, reports and letters about the CHP/Probe Cobra Classic 427 engine and refunded the major amount about $6,400 made by credit card, as they assessed that the goods were indeed faulty. Now hopefully Probe will do the right thing and refund the $3,000 deposit and pay JC Performance for the work they authorised in removing the engine from the vehicle and checking the heads and pistons. If not .....

It is a "be careful" notice when you consider an engine.

John

SOunds like things have worked out about as well as you could've hoped. Here's wishing you best of luck in the future.

Latest;

We have contacted Probe regularly, and Tim states each time that we should call back "Monday" as he will get it resolved.
There seems no intention on their part to resolve the matter;

1. When the engine was on the dyno test at J.C. Performance and ran badly Probe authorised JC Performance to dismantle parts to determine the problem, and that they would pay for the work. This was done and they are not honoring this authorization.

2. JC Performance deposited $3,000 to initially get Probe to order the engine. The balance upto nearly $10,000 was paid by credit card. The credit card company reviewed all documents over many months then refunded the amount.
Probe refuse to refund the deposit.

Every effort has been made in reasonable terms with Probe, now a Court action is being filed.

John

It's been a long haul. Altho probe acknowledged it being a faulty engine, other experts stated it was grossly faulty still Probe would not stand by their product. The lawsuit filed against Probe/Coast High Performance got their attorney talking a settlement. Naturally trying to discount the amount due. We accepted less to get rid of the problem.

John

Just a quick pitch in from my own experiences. Indy Mustang Performance in Indianapolis, IN. STAY FAR AWAY from them. He's a Clem type person working in an alley garage who advertises on the internet. I have first hand experience of his work, and have personnaly seen another one of his disasters, as well as hearing of a few others. If you perform a Yahoo search of Indy Mustang, there is actually a listed thread of my proplems from a Club Cobra thread. It would be worth your while to check it out. Too much to list here though.

John:
I might have missed this, but where did you ultimately get the motor for the car? Did you consider JC as a source, since they were apparently doing the install and finish work? I take it you recommend JC? also, what acr are we talking about? A new CAV or something else.
Thanks and good luck.
SDP

SDP

I installed a 392 Ford Racing engine that JC Performance arranged in order to get the car on the road. It is a CAV GT40 from the U.S agent in san Diego, VIP Classics (Roy). I wanted a 427 engine and JC Perf is installing one of their custom built aluminum 427 engines Dart block, h-rods, Scat crank, AFR heads dyno at over 600 h.p.
JC Perf are presently installing their higher torque rear axles /couplers.

John