Motor's in...now a transaxle (RBT-Quicktime) question

I've got a Quicktime bellhousing and an RBT.

The motor's in :thumbsup:, and the bellhousing is essentially resting on the lower crossmember. Everything is loose, and I suppose the rear of the engine has enough "wiggle room" to be raised up a bit...

The question is this...the RBT mounting flange goes in a complete circle, with bosses for a number of through-bolts (to bolt to the bellhousing), including one at the bottom. There is no provision for this through-bolt on the bottom of the Quicktime bellhousing (that is where the bevel is).

Do I just lift up the motor and bolt everything together, leaving the RBT unmodified, or shave off the lower portion of the RBT (including the boss for the un-needed throughbolt)?

I suppose I can see how the mounting "ears" of the RBT line up with the bosses of the upper crossmember, and that will answer my question....but can't do that until tonight, and I'll be thinking about it all day.

Anyone want to chime in and save me from being distracted all day long?

Ron,
Yes you need to grind off the lower bolt on the RBT. Then bevel to contour of the bellhousing. Also you will need to grind off some of the top fins on the right side where the cable shift fastens. There used to be photos of all this somewhere on the forum. If not I can try scanning my SPF instructions and e mailing them to you.

Dave,

Thanks for offering to email the info, but I think I can wing it...I noticed the interferance with the shift cable mount, bought longer bolts, and stacked a couple of washers until I had clearance.

I was just a bit hesitant to go grinding away on my $$$ RBT if i didn't have to. No problem, have grinder, will travel. Guess I'll be making a little noise out in the garage tonight. Hope the neighbors aren't planning on going to bed early.

No wonder I keep finding dog poop on my lawn.

Whoa Ron! Stand down with that grinder. Before you go buggering up an expensive transaxle you should talk to Dennis Olthoff about his improved shifter hardware. His bracket bolts on top of the transaxle case and generates enough clearance so that you don't have to hack up your ZF's case. Here's a photo of my car. I can shoot a closeup for you if you like. After 3 years my shifter still works like new.

Here's another shot that's a bit easier to see.

Ron. My car's up in the air right now. If you need pics of anything let me know and I'll snap away. If you want to come take a look in person I'm off this weekend as well. Lemme know.

Rich.

Daryl,

Thanks for the warning, but I do have Dennis' shift linkage/brackets...already installed. But I don't see how that changes the clearance at the bottom of the transaxle. As far as I can tell, the clearance is ultimately determined by how high the upper crossmember holds the box, and how the bellhousing is shaped. My bellhousing clears the crossmember fine, I just have an "extra" boss at the bottom of the RBT that cant be used.

Rich,

Thanks for your help so far. If you can shoot a pic, that would be helpful. However, if you can just take a peak, and tell me if the bottom of the RBT is modified, or is held high enough above the lower crossmember that no modification is needed, that would probably be all I need.

Either way, I'll do a trial fit tonight before doing any grinding, and see how it goes.

Thanks one and all.

Ron --

I assume you're installing a small block, but for what it's worth, the BB/Quicktime combination results in essentially zero clearance between bell-housing and lower frame crossmember. However you can gather about 1/8" of clearance by rolling downward the forward flange of the crossmember. Don't know if this applies to you.

There is also the little-known fact that you can shift the engine forward (or backward) ~3/8" by swapping the engine mounts side-to-side, because they are asymmetrical. By engine mounts I mean the plate held to the frame by three ~6 mm bolts and one semi-vertical ~10 mm bolt.

Alan,

Thanks for chiming in. Yes, its a 351W.

Right now, the bellhousing is essentially sitting on the crossmember, but that is with the engine mount bolts loose. I'm pretty sure I can tilt the whole thing foreward, and gain some clearance. But since the bottom of the RBT has that bolt boss sticking out, I'm not sure that will clear even if I tilt everything. I guess I'll find out tonight.

When I first started putting the mounts on, I realized that they were offset, and called Erick Voss in SoCal about the orientation. He said that the standard orientation (as you pointed out) would be to position the motor as far back as possible, which I did. I suppose I could shift everything forward, as you mentioned, but I don't think I would clear the boss....though your suggestion to bend the flange might do it.

Apparently, I'm less concerned about shaving the bottom of my RBT than some others are. But then again, I know I don't need the lower bolt, and have taken the torch, hammer and welder to a number of old Porsches, so I'm a little less concerned about "violating" the car. In fact, I plan a number of "modifications" for this one, and a small thing like giving the bottom of the transaxle a shave doesn't concern me.

Then again, I don't want to do something I don't need to.

Ron,
I think you get the idea that trimming the RBT is not a big deal. If you don't you probably will have interference with the lower chassis hoop. Remember the upper chassis hoop to RBT mounting has no vertical adjustment. I would not shift the engine forward as some modification of the firewall is already necessary with a 351W. You need all the space at the front of the engine that you can get.

Dave,

Thanks, I'll do a trial fitting this evening.

I have no problem wielding a grinder, and will break it out if it looks like I'll need it.

I'm surprised that nobody seems to have a direct and absolute answer to my question...ie, must I shave the bottom of the RBT to fit it in. Ultimately, I doubt it matters much which bellhousing you use, as the locating bosses at the upper crossmember would seem to have the greatest influence...with the engine positioning playing a minor roll.

You mentioned that there was some modification required to the firewall when putting in a 351W...you sure? I wasn't aware that it was longer than a 289/302 block. I'm using Olthoff's serpentine system, hopefully I won't need to do any "clearancing". I haven't looked closely yet, but I think I may be able to get it all in without making any "adjustments"...but I haven't actually tried it yet.

modified ZF

The previous post shows a 351w with Quicktime. The ZF has to be modified as shown. No mods necessary to the front of the mono. The forward edge of the bottom of the rear horseshoe needs to be peened down. Maybe some slight blistering with a body hammer to the access panel if necessary. This is all you need to do to fit the engine/gearbox

RCG, I believe ya.

Did some test fitting last night. Don't believe it's going in until I shave off that boss. (In the pic, the rear of the engine has been lifted about 1 inch over the lower crossmember....still not enough room to attach the transaxle with the boss present)

Ron,
It probably depends on exactly which belt system and water pump you have on a 351W. My Roush 427SR needed a 1/2" 'bump out' in the passenger area of the firewall to clear the alternator pulley and belt. Also the end of the water pump required some hammering of the firewall to clear. I used a heat gun on the plastic trim cover to accommodate the hammered metal of the firewall. Maybe some 351W's will clear with no mods.