Member Removed

[Ron Earp]

I am sorry to say that I had to recently ban a forum member. It is the first time I’ve ever felt compelled to do such a thing on the forum.

I tried to work with Oliver (John) numerous times via PM’s and emails in attempts to restrain his caustic comments and insulting (to many members) behavior over the last few months. Oliver would promise me that he would change, but the change was short lived.

Over the last three months or so I’ve received, on average, two or three communications per week about his behavior requesting that he be removed from the board. These communications came from 24 unique individuals whom I know and respect on the board. These members wish, as do I, to keep the signal to noise ratio of www.gt40s.com far above the norm for car forums.

I’ve always firmly believed that the forum should be a place for free speech, interaction, and free from censorship. But, a friend told me that a forum is a lot like a party at your house where you have invited guests. Guests are expected to be cordial and abide by the rules of your party, or, they may be asked to leave. After I thought about the comment I tended to agree.

I was extremely lenient with Oliver and probably lenient to a fault. Because many of Oliver’s acid remarks were directed at Roaring Forties, but in no way limited to Roaring Forties as some clearly know, I allowed the banter to go on for far longer than I normally would have done. Some here on the forum associate me with Roaring Forties and that simply isn’t the case, so, to insure that Roaring Forties didn’t get special treatment I didn’t take action until I felt it was absolutely due. In retrospect, had Oliver antagonized CAV, ERA,Tornado, etc. and members asked for his removal, I would have done so far more quickly. And it just isn’t associated with manufacturers, there were many personal attacks as well that people felt were unwarranted.

So that is the short version of the saga. I am sincerely sorry to have had to take action and I hope it doesn’t result in a board split as has happened on other car forums. I know that some here identify with Oliver or like the persona and I’m not faulting that, I just hope it doesn’t result in a factional board membership.

John has communicated with me via email two things that I feel I should share since he cannot respond directly on the board. One is that he feels that I have called him a fool and that I am not abiding by my own board rules (see post in the RF section). The second is the following:

----
Ron,
Since you decided to ban me, I will be unable to fill the current orders for the DVD. I'm not going to commit to ordering from the studio with limited orders. Please notify members to file for refund and individuals that sent check will be returned .
Sincerely
John
----

I’m sorry that this has resulted in the DVDs being cancelled. I know many were looking forward to receiving one, as was I, but it appears that is not possible now. Again, my apologies for how this has played out.

Best,
Ron

[Chris Martino]

Hey Ron,

I never got into exchanging words with John but did read quite a few threads where the conversations went south in a hurry. You can't stand behind the forum as your defense/shield to justify every and anything you feel you have a right to say - that borders on abuse of the service you provide forum members. John was lucky to stay as long as he did, an insult to you for pushing as far as he did, to have to make you come to this conclusion shows little respect IMHO.

Majority rules - bye!

Chris

[Rick Muck- Mark IV]

Perhaps a "time out" would work. Over on ClubCobra the same thing happened with the Semkos and Dan returned after a ban a kinder, gentler poster. We all can use a second chance...that said, if you strike out twice there should be no third pitch! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soapbox.gif[/img]

just my [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twocents.gif[/img]
Rick [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banana.gif[/img]

[Keith Hardy]

It's a good point. Maybe he just needs some help and will probably change dramatically when he gets his GT, but he certainly enjoys pushing sh*t uphill that's for sure. As for causing a schism on the forum - I don't think so. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[Gregg]

Ron, I think your decision was just and you shouldn't give it a second thought. Anyone who believes that Oliver would return as a changed person after a "time out" is wishing on a star. He has had more than one chance and if I read your post correctly, was warned on more than one occassion. I am not in favor of censorship, but all speech is not protected and I know that most members come to this site to make friends, share their passion for the GT40 and other automobiles and help each other out through past experiences and advice. I don't think Oliver's comments were reflective of the reason this board was started. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twocents.gif[/img]

[TimOz40]

Don't lose any sleep over it Ron. I doubt any of the forum members will. Trying to change Oliver would be like [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dead_horse.gif[/img].

[Robert Logan]

Ron,

I support you 100% regarding this isue.

John is welcome to contact me at any time regarding his own car or he can contact Jerry regarding the same. He is a Roaring Forties customer and his car will be FULLY suported at ALL times.

I hope that Hershal will now return to the forum and contribute as he used to as I know that he was very hurt with some of the things that were said about him. I for one think that people like Ron and Hershal have much more to offer with advise and information and this has been stunted because of the volley of side swipes.

Regarding a "cooling off period", I believe he has already had one but I could be wrong.

Best wishes,

Robert

[Pete.]

Ron, as Tim said I dont think any of us will lose any sleep
over it. And I am sure Oliver wont. People who are never wrong and have a hide as thick as his never do. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twocents.gif[/img]

[Iron Sheik]

Ron,

WHAT????? Oliver Twist aka Johny (the laundry boy) Boooobowski is out???!!!! PRAISE THE LORD, WHAT AN A$$. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Normally I would be in favor of keeping a hemorrhoid of this stature, just so we can smear him with Preparation H. But I think like any good Dr., you operated correctly by removing the smelly gorged flesh. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

For those whom are sorry/sad to see him go, no worries,, just like any hemorrhoids, he WILL RETURN (only to be shoved back “IN” again, hopefully!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/loser1.gif[/img]

P.S "Any" Topic regarding Oliver, should be in "MY" section. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Mark Worthington]

Ron, your analysis is spot on and there is no doubt you did exactly the right thing, if a little belatedly. I do not believe that OLIVER would have ever changed his stripes after a time-out - he simply had to go. In four years of running the forum, there have only been two users who, in my opinion, needed to get kicked off the island. Both of them were extremely disrespectful and obnoxious, and maybe that could be tolerated if they had brought any meaningful tech with them, but they didn't. GT40s.com is one of the best automotive-related forums on the internet, and the reason is because we have a diverse, intelligent membership who are mature enough to behave like adults, even if we don't always agree. The forum is only as good as the people who contribute to it, and OLIVER, or John, or whoever he was, was single-handedly dragging the whole thing down.

Good bye and good riddance. Long live the forum!

Hershal, come home!

[Peter D]

Ron, after the above posts, there is nothing I can add other than "Well Done".

The only useful thing that he offered was the DVD - and his withdrawl of that offer to the PEOPLE he made it to (as opposed to you, Hersh or the Forum) just confirms his incredibly childish behaviour.

Offensive, childish brat spits dummy - big surprise !!

Hersh - come on home !

Ron - thanks !

[Bill Hara]

Personally (I don't know how other RF owners felt), I preferred not to comment on any of his rants as it would only:-
1. Get an immediate defensive (offensive) response.
2. Potentially damage RF by seeming to defend them. (Robert is perfectly capable defending himself - much better than I am!).
3. Leave a bad taste in my mouth about participating on this forum. (as it has done to many others already).

I was thinking about comments posted here about free speech and censorship, however in almost all democracies there is a vote or consensus & when the "people" cast their vote.... there has to be a [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/loser1.gif[/img], he just didn't know when to stop [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dead_horse.gif[/img]

I won't say too much more ( [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soapbox.gif[/img], [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twocents.gif[/img] or [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dead_horse.gif[/img]) other than I found comments belittling RF's professionalism hard to understand, considering the 4 year + dealings I have had with Robert and team, which have been brilliant.
Producing one of these cars is a huge effort in so many ways and RF (plus every other long term constructor) has to deal with high emotions and high expectations on a daily basis. RF (amongst others) does it very well.

P.S Other than being a satisfied customer, I do not have any other connections to/with RF. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/fyi.gif[/img]

[JackW]

I haven't been a member that long but have been a reader for a while. His posts stood out like a sore thumb. Every other person on this forum is so encouraging and helpful towards everyone else. In the next 18 months I am hoping to order a kit (I am currently studying an MBA and need to finish that first and my order will most probably an RF because I live in Melbourne). Quite frankly I don't know a damn thing about building a car other then when it is done it will be awesome and no doubt along the way frustrating as hell. A BIG part of the decision to go ahead with the project as opposed to buying something already made such as a Lotus Exige is that between RF themsleves and the people on this forum I doubt I will ever get stuck despite my limited knowledge. So reading all the helpful advice and encouragement is great, then you get to that guy and it is just insults, negative comments etc and someone like Hersh who has authored so many terrific and awesome posts, not wanting to contribute, and this hurts the forum a lot more then blunting the freedom of expression of one guy who really contributed nothing. You more than gave him a chance to have his say. You did the right thing.

Regards

Jack

[David Morton]

Thank you Ron.

[Peter Olliviere]

Bill,
I'm in complete agreement with you, I to perferrrd to stay out mainly because I felt that responding only gave him a platform to continue his ranting and attacks and that what he really wanted. Anyway Ron your actions were correct, so that ends that.

I must admit that once or twice I was not happy with RF but I purchased from them because of the committment I saw on this forum from Robert, Hershal and Jerry and in my 4 years of observing them and then being a customer I have never regreated my decision.

Peter

[ChrisL]

In his own words, he didn't care that he didn't fit in, so he won't care that he is now gone. Good riddance to him.

[Ron Earp]

Dear Members,

Oliver is indicating he is getting offending emails. I would suggest that folks emailing him cease, it is only fair. He isn't here on the forum any longer.

Ron