Ford 5.4L Spark Plug replacement

Pat

Supporter
The good news is that Ford says the spark plugs in the 5.4L 3Valve engine should go 100K. The bad news is that when you try to remove them they break off. For me it was 7 of 8.
There must be an easier way to do this or an alternative spark plug...
 

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Doug S.

The protoplasm may be 72, but the spirit is 32!
Lifetime Supporter
Ford dealerships have a special tool that allows for the spark plugs to be removed without breaking. It has been a significant problem on the rear-most spark plug on the drivers' side.

I don't know if the dealerships sell the tool or not...I broke that "problem plug" while trying to change the plugs in my daughter's pickup truck and believe me, it took a mechanic two hours to figure out how to get that thing out. He was ready to admit failure when the stars aligned correctly and it broke loose.

IMHO it may be related to the length of the threaded portion of the plug...I know that anytime I change plugs I put a dab of anti-sieze compound on the threads. I haven't had to change the plugs out again, but when I do I have high hopes that the threads will not have "frozen" into the heads again. After looking at the photo you posted, though, it looks like the threaded portion had nothing to do with the part that broke off...mystery to me!

Getting those 7 threaded portions out must have been miserable....how did you do it?

Cheers!

Doug
 

Rick Muck- Mark IV

GT40s Sponsor
Supporter
The issue is the plugs are two piece and induction welded. The EPA requires vehicles to be certified as meeting emissions specs for 100,000 miles with no plug changes. This is why the plugs are all platinum, etc. now. The downside is that they do not want to leave their cozy home after 100k!

A friend of mine just called this AM to ask how much it should cost to have a plug change. The price starts at $300 and goes up to $750 if they all break.
 

Doug S.

The protoplasm may be 72, but the spirit is 32!
Lifetime Supporter
A friend of mine just called this AM to ask how much it should cost to have a plug change. The price starts at $300 and goes up to $750 if they all break.

Does that mean $300 if they all come out just fine? Seems a bit high to me...but, then, I haven't been buying platinum plugs, which I do understand can be pricey.

I notice that the "sleeve", for lack of a better term, is slightly "flared" where it seems to have come loose from the body of the spark plug. Is that flared section becoming fused with the area where it seats/seals? If so, perhaps just a light coat of anti-sieze compound to keep the parts from getting so well acquainted would be a good idea. If one had a go at removing the factory plugs when the car was right off the showroom floor and lubing them to avoid them sticking, perhaps it might eliminate a whole lot of angst later on (but, then, if you were running a Ford dealership and needed income from the service department to make your bottom line black rather than red, this might be an area that the dealers would NOT be anxious to see resolved).

Never thought I'd see the day when just changing the spark plugs would cost $300!!!!

It cost $200 to have that ONE broken spark plug removed from the back cylinder on my daughter's pickup truck, though...so for 8 of them $750 might just be a real deal!!

Cheers? Not so sure that Ford's failure to produce a durable enough product to withstand extraction is worth cheering for....:thumbsdown:

Doug
 

Pat

Supporter
Apparently the problem isn't the threads but below that where the extended tip goes into the head. Carbon builds up to the point the tip becomes impacted with carbon and the ceramic of the plug breaks when the body is loosened with a wrench.
The job at the dealer was quoted as $780 if the broken plugs can be extracted with the dealer kit. He added they break more often than not. If they are really fouled, they need to pull the heads and the bill gets really ugly. In addition, the dealer charges $21 per plug for the part but I'm told some will discount to as low as $12.
The dealer suggested next time change them at 60K (vs 100K) after running lots of Sea Foam through the intake per the instructions on the can. If you look at the pics you can see the issue. Ford revised the design for 2008 so only the early 5.4L 3V are affected.
 

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Doug S.

The protoplasm may be 72, but the spirit is 32!
Lifetime Supporter
So, does the shell/sleeve transfer from the older plug to the newer one?

I can see that the design is significantly different from the one I faced with my daughter's plugs...on that job, though, the "hex" on the plug broke off so some sort of extractor was used to grip the remnant of the plug and get it out. I was truly afraid the head might need to be removed...and while $200 seemed a bit high for 2 hours of rather strenuous physical labor, I was glad to pay it rather than to have to resort to the Ford dealer with their "highly regarded" labor and material fees.

So...when you replaced the plugs, did you use any form of lubricant on that sleeve to eliminate the possibility that the new plugs might get frozen into those holes?

What an awful design...why not just a regular spark plug with an extended tip? Some of the OHC design motors use a plug with a VERY long body...but not a sleeve to get frozen onto the hole in the head. Just curious if anyone knows why they went to that design...it seems to me that they didn't give it enough R&D attention to see that the problem could occur only after significant miles were put onto the motor.

I've always been a Ford Fan, through and through...always liked their "Ford has a better idea" advertisement theme and hate to see them with a "...worse idea".

Cheers!

Doug
 

Pat

Supporter
Doug, the new plug is all one unit. The bits of the broken old plug are throwaways.
Once you extract the plug body with the wrench (assuming it breaks) you need one extractor for the ceramic and another (like an EZ out) for the plug shell. The new plug is a complete unit. The problem is that it would be impossible to lube the tip as it's subjected to the cylinder burn and the carbon residue. The issue is to keep the carbon at bay or change the plugs more frequently before the build up seizes up the plug tip.

Fortunately, the newer heads (Late 2008 on) have corrected the issue.

Here is a new plug.
 

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Rick Muck- Mark IV

GT40s Sponsor
Supporter
Talked with a truck tech today and he confirmed the heads were redesigned in mid 2008 so after that this is not a problem. My friend has a 2010 Expedition so no worries for him.

Tech told me best scenario for older affected units is a full on combustion chamber cleaning via aftermarket kit at least once, twice is better, run until really hot and then shut down and pull plugs after 10-15 minutes.
 
Their is a product by a company called 3 BOND.
It is used to remove carbon from cyl and intake systems.

I use the product and it works.

If the injectors are easy to get out I would spray 3 bond into the cyl on an open valve .
It softens carbon big time, oven cleaner works as well just harder to start.

Jim
 
Another old trick and it works a treat , start the car with the air cleaner off, and once idling, start pouring water slowly into the intake at the same time raising the throttle to control the idle and stop it from stalling, once you get about a half a litre or a pint of water through you should have a pretty clean engine.
if you want to see how much crap this system removes put a sheet of card board etc behind the tail pipe before you start and check it after, it will shock you.

cheers John
 
If you're changing the plugs in a F-150 or F-250 it's a real nightmare of a job.
The 600-750.00 price is right for the job. First the fuel injection rails have to come out then you can unbolt the coils, then get the plugs out. There are several other small items to be removed along the way too. Job takes about 8-9 hours. I paid once and did it twice myself.
While you're at it and it's apart you might as well swap the injectors and all eight ignition coils. If either goes bad you get to go through the whole process again. Problem with the coils is if one goes out it tends take one or more with it. That was my problem.
And don't forget to use dielectric grease on all the connectors and plug boots. Anti-seize on the plug threads is a good idea too. But don't get the anti-seize on any part of the threads exposed to the cylinder. Causes hot spots and detonation.

I bought the coils on E-bay and the injectors came from a shop in Orlando. Don't recall the name...sorry.
 
Could be worse. On my mercedes S600 V12 you have to remove the whole inlet and fuel rails and all the related hoses and pipes just to get at the plugs. Then, there's 2 plugs per cylinder (that's 24 total) and they're not easy to access. The dealer charges over $2,000 for a plug change. Ouch.

Plugs, caps (2) and rotors (2) on an older ferrari V8 will run $2,500 bucks for parts alone.

Somebody always has it worse.
 
I realized after I entered my post that you while you're working on the rear of the engine you should check the molded rubber elbow at the rear of the intake manifold. It attaches to a 5/16-3/8 vacuum line and the heat dries out causing the elbow to split. Makes for all kinds of bad drivability problems.
I don't recall the part number but had to find it on e-bay. I'll see if I can dig it up.
 
I don't know what year your truck is but mine is a 1997 F-250.
Part number for the vacuum elbow on my truck is F75Z-6C324-JA. And the fitting is 5/8.
 
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