When will they ever learn?

[Jim Craik]

The right wing hate filled spinning of the truth has taken still more innocent lives, when will they ever lean?

The scumbags incite hate and violence, provoke attacks and they do it for power and money!

It appears the the Oslo terrorist attack was committed by a gun and bomb toting conservative right wing Muslim hater.

He felt that by committing these horrible crimes, the notoriety gained would allow him to broadcast his fear and hate filled message to a large audience. Kind of like Fox.

Now that asshole spokesman for the conservative movement Mr Beck is comparing the innocent children in Norway to the Hitler youth.

When will they ever learn?

 

[David Morton]

The world will never run out of the mentally ill. Oslo shows that to be true.

 

[craig]

The right wing hate filled spinning of the truth has taken still more innocent lives, when will they ever lean?

The scumbags incite hate and violence, provoke attacks and they do it for power and money!

It appears the the Oslo terrorist attack was committed by a gun and bomb toting conservative right wing Muslim hater.

He felt that by committing these horrible crimes, the notoriety gained would allow him to broadcast his fear and hate filled message to a large audience. Kind of like Fox.

Now that asshole spokesman for the conservative movement Mr Beck is comparing the innocent children in Norway to the Hitler youth.

When will they ever learn?

You better watch out Jim, some mentally ill left-winger may be reading your posts and interpret your obvious hatred towards us conservatives as a subliminal message to kill us....ya see I really doubt that this lunatics hatred towards these poor victims was any less then the hatred that you have towards FOX....the difference is he is a sick evil person..

 

[Cliff Beer]

There's no supportable logic to it Jim. IMHO it's not about being "right" or "left" or anything in between...or trying to justify a position and gain visibility...none of that.

It's simple: either you're a human being or you're a f'ing animal. The perp here is not a human being, he's an animal. And like a rabid dog, he needs to be quietly put down.

 

[Pat]

The right wing hate filled spinning of the truth has taken still more innocent lives, when will they ever lean?

The scumbags incite hate and violence, provoke attacks and they do it for power and money!

It appears the the Oslo terrorist attack was committed by a gun and bomb toting conservative right wing Muslim hater.

He felt that by committing these horrible crimes, the notoriety gained would allow him to broadcast his fear and hate filled message to a large audience. Kind of like Fox.

Now that asshole spokesman for the conservative movement Mr Beck is comparing the innocent children in Norway to the Hitler youth.

When will they ever learn?

This might be the stupidest thing you ever said and your academy of idiocy is a pantheon...

 

[Jim Craik]

Veek,

I hope this is not another of your drop in and then run comments.

Please explain that I said that was stupid or not true.

 

[Pat Buckley]

Another drop in....

+1 Veek.

Jim, I simply don't have the time or the will to engage your obviously biased stupidity.

Go learn how to spell.

 

[Jim Craik]

Pat,

OK you guys talk big!

You are the second person to call what I said "stupid" Please tell us what I said that is "stupid" and please tell us what I said that WAS NOT TRUE!

 

[Joey Dean]

OK, let me try.

This attack was carried out by a deranged individual. That is it, nothing more.

I, who have used explosives and own guns, have not in my entire life had a wish to hurt another human being in any manner. I do vote Republican as well.

Since I fit entirely into your criteria, I guess for me it is just a matter of time.

Sir, I am forced to the conclusion that you are nothing more than a troll on these boards using your own inflamatlry rhetoric to cause confrontation and bolster your own self worth by doing so.

 

[Jeff Young]

I'm not sure why you guys are taking this personally. Jim was not talking specifically about YOU.

At the same time, what has disturbed me from the start is that some of the very same ideas that get kicked around on this board a lot -- the belief that Islam is a violent religion, that Muslims are "colonizing" Europe, that most/all terrorists are Muslim -- are the seeds of belief that grew into the violence of this weekend.

Like I said in the other thread, the disturbing thing for white western caucausians (like me) on this one is we can't "blame it on the Muslims." We have to turn and examine our OWN prejudices, biases and hate to figure out why this happened (and "he's a psychopath" isn't a sufficient answer) and how to prevent it from happening again.

 

[Joey Dean]

Jeff,

Seriously? "he's a psychopath" isn't enough?

There are a lot of ideas I do not care for. There are issues that I can not support. There are things happening in America today that I stand against. Since these things exist for all men in all cultures in all countries, and since the majority of people DO NOT act out on these with violence then why do you for a moment even consider it is a social issue and not one of a indiviual sick mind?

 

[Doc Kaler]

Jeff,

I agree that introspection by all is needed. But, in this case, to prevent this singular event from happening would necessitate preventing mental illness. People of his ilk have deranged thoughts, flight of ideas, definitely not logical thought. An internet "manifesto" and the actions he took do not make for logical thought. My "rule of thumb" is that 20% of the population has some degree of mental illness and this guy is a couple of standard deviations away from "normal".

 

[Jeff Young]

No, it's not enough to say he is a pyschopath. It's the easy way out, and and it is what "we" (white westerners) want to say because he looks like us.

But this guy is not alone.

There is a "movement" afoot in the US and Western Europe that is isolationist, fervently Christian, biased and prejudiced. It is breeding guys like this.

While no one is saying that you would do anything like this, I'm glad that this incident has provoked some thought on your part (and mine) about your own biases and prejudices.

Doc, I'd agree with you except that....the very same things this guy is saying and doing we now see in a lot of the far right political movements of Europe and the US. Isolationism. Anti-foreigner. Anti-Islam. Fervent Christianity.

The shooter in Tucson clearly was deranged and seemed to have no agenda. Guys like this guy, or Timothy McVeigh, they do, and there are many more of them out there, and they get whipped into a frenzy by the far media and interweb "news" sources.

In fact, some think that in the US, the threat from domestic sources of terror is now as high as from Islamic ones.


http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/07/25/domestic.extremism/index.html?hpt=hp_bn1

 

[Jim Craik]

Joey,

You say this was just a "derenged individual"......."nothing more"

These attacks were purely political. He attacked the Liberal Govenment and Childeren at a Liberal sponsered summer camp!

This was not the sudden act of a "nut" these attacks were planned well in advance, these were mutli pronged, complicated attacks, designed to do the most damage (the Prime Minester and Childeren).

He ordered the bomb making materials long ago, obtained a police uniform and coriographed the entire day, including his surrender so he would have an oppertunity to tell his hate filled, right wing story to a wide audiance.

Does that sound like nothing more than a deranged individual?

This was a person with very very strong political feelings, spured on by the hate filled right wing media who then acted out a well planned political attack!

Mr Glenn Beck compared the childeren at the youth camp to "Hitler Youth", just a bunch of brain washed childered. In Mr Becks mind, that somehow makes it less of a crime.

Mr Beck is fully aware of the Tea Party youth camps and their indoctrination of the young.

OK Veek, Pat and Joey........................

Which of the following would be best compared to a Hitler youth camp?

(1) A right wing ultra consevative youth camp.

(2) A liberal sponsered youth camp.


Pat, if you have any trouble making out a word, let me know, I'd be glad to help you out.

 

[Joey Dean]

First off why does planning elimate crazy?

Secondly, why not just have a youth camp?

I find that youth are more interested in each other. It is the adults leading it that tend to interject leanings in one direction or another. Maybe if we just let them talk amongst themselves without trying to influence the outcome we would be heading in a direction we could all better agree on?

 

[Doug S.]

This might be the stupidest thing you ever said and your academy of idiocy is a pantheon...

Another drop in....

+1 Veek.

Jim, I simply don't have the time or the will to engage your obviously biased stupidity.

Go learn how to spell.

Cheap shots, guys, but totally in line with what I and other reasonable Americans have come to expect from the radical right.

"Hit and run" attacks like this are in their own way as cowardly as the manner in which this individual accomplished this terrible slaughter. A bomb....how brave is that, set a bomb and then run away from the scene so you don't get hurt, too. Appearing at a gathering of children dressed as a policeman (whom we have taught our children they should trust), motioning for them to come gather around him and then opening fire...how brave is that?

Yet, I'm not surprised....this is TYPICAL of the radical right, make an unsupportable comment and then excuse themselves.

IF (and I always say "IF is the biggest word in the English language") this deranged individual in Oslo committed these acts due to an agenda of racial/cultural hatred, as his manifesto and attempts to gain a public forum for his "explanation" would indicate, then this desipicable acts SHOULD elicit enraged indignation from ALL Americans, regardless of political orientation.....it was, plain and simple, a cowardly "hit and run" act of immense magnitude.

However, Veek and Pat, there's no need to adopt his tactics for your protestations on this forum or in this thread. If you have a belief, be "brave" enough to offer supporting evidence.

I'm not holding my breath, though....I've seen it SO many times here on the forum and particularly in the political discussions in the Paddock.

Get a grip.....your cowardly protestations, your "hit and run" tactics, do nothing more than make you look like a radical right-wing, TEA partying KOOK, the kind who engages in cowardly attacks and then runs away to hide out of....what, infantile fear that someone might just have a differing opinion?

Grow up, for God's sake!

Doug

 

[Jim Craik]

Doug,

Thank you very much, I always admire your ability to express your thoughts in a clear and easly understandable way. Additionally your spelling appears exelent (not that I could tell)

 

[David Morton]

Even his solicitor says he is mentally ill. How do you construe that to be political JIm?
Is this terrorism? Hardly.

 

[Jeff Young]

OF COURSE HIS LAWYER SAYS HE IS MENTALLY ILL.

Yes, David, this is terrorism. It was politically motivated, to advance a political agenda.

Why are you so adamant in asserting it is not?

Even his solicitor says he is mentally ill. How do you construe that to be political JIm?
Is this terrorism? Hardly.

 

[Doug S.]

Even his solicitor says he is mentally ill.

I'm a bit skeptical, David....unless being a "cunning murderer" fits within the definition of "mentally ill".

Keep in mind who his solicitor works for....it's not unusual for defense lawyers here in the U.S. to bring forth an insanity defense, but incredibly few actually succeed.

This scumbag, Andrew Breivik, has planned this for some time, long enough to create and eventually share with the world via the internet a 1,500 page "manifesto". I predict that the content and literary style of this manifesto will eliminate any doubt about insanity after it becomes clear that his thought processes, other than believing that violence could bring about his beloved "revolution", were not deranged.

We had a very deranged terrorist here in the U.S. who hid behind the U.S. mail service to foment his misdeeds, who went by the way of "The Unabomber"....he was a very "lunatic fringe" type of individual who lived life as a hermit in a shack....who actually dismissed his defense attorneys because they wanted him to plead insanity to avoid the death penalty. He eventually managed a plea bargain on his own and is now serving life without the possibility of parole. Most believe he made a good deal, that despite his unusual social nature he would not have been able to prove insanity.

Berwick's solicitor is just playing the system...he must know his client is not insane, he's just doing what any defense attorney must do, attempt to protect his client to the best of his availability, using whatever means are available to him.

Cheers from Doug!!