Any one in Holland to comment on this? Is it true?

David Morton

Lifetime Supporter
I didn't write this.
Does it echo the thoughts of many here in the UK
or is it bullshit? I think it it echoes what the majority
are thinking. However it may all be made up. Any one in the Netherlands
care to comment?




Subject: Go Dutch - Food for Thought


Go Dutch
Go the Dutch - but why wait until 2013?
The Netherlands, where six per cent of the population is now Muslim,
is scrapping multiculturalism: The Dutch government says it will
abandon the long-standing model of multiculturalism that has encouraged
Muslim immigrants to create a parallel society within the Netherlands.
A new integration bill, which Dutch Interior Minister Piet Hein
Donner presented to parliament on June 16, reads: "The government shares
the social dissatisfaction over the multicultural society model, and
plans to shift priority to the values of the Dutch people. In the new
integration system, the values of the Dutch society play a central role.
With this change, the government steps away from the model of a
multicultural society.
The letter continues: "A more obligatory integration is justified
because the government also demands that from its own citizens. It is
necessary because otherwise the society gradually grows apart and
eventually no one feels at home anymore in the Netherlands ..
The new integration policy will place more demands on immigrants.
For example, immigrants will be required to learn the Dutch language, and
the government will take a tougher approach to immigrants who ignore
Dutch values or disobey Dutch law.
The government will also stop offering special subsidies for Muslim
immigrants because, according to Donner; "It is not the government's
job to integrate immigrants." (How bloody true).
The government will introduce new legislation that outlaws forced
marriages and will also impose tougher measures against Muslim immigrants
who lower their chances of employment by the way they dress. More
specifically, the government will impose a ban on face-covering, Islamic
burqas as of January 1, 2013. Holland has done that whole liberal
thing, and realized - maybe too late - that creating a nation of tribes
will kill the nation itself.

The future of Australia , the UK and Canada may well be read here.
READERS NOTE: Muslim immigrants leave their countries of birth because of
civil and political unrest "CREATED BY THE VERY NATURE OF THEIR CULTURE."

Countries like Holland, Canada, the UK and Australia have an
established way of life that actually works, so why embrace the
unworkable? If Muslims do not wish to accept another culture, the
answer is simple; "STAY WHERE YOU ARE!!"

This gives a whole new meaning to the term; 'Dutch Courage' -
Unfortunately Australian, UK and Canadian politicians don't have the ...
guts to do the same. There's a whole lot of truth here!!!!

ELECTION 2013 IS COMING. A Nation of Sheep, Breeds a Government of
Wolves! I'M 100% for PASSING THIS ON!!! Let's Take a Stand!!!
Borders: Closed!
Language: English
Culture: The British Constitution, is the Bill of Rights!
Drug Free: Mandatory Drug Screening before Welfare!
 

Keith

Moderator
Any 'enforced' multiculturism in order to prove an unworkable political theory is wrong, as is the passing of laws that prevent individuals speaking their minds on the subject and criminalising those that dare to.

No matter whether the principle of 'multiculturism is right or wrong, if you put the idea of mass immigration of diverse and sometimes opposing cultures to ANY country in the world to a referenda, the answer would always be a resounding 'NO'.
 

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
We have experienced enforced Multi Culturism for many years. I think it is fair to say that it has mostly worked with the exception of the radical Muslims who accept no law other than the law of their God and whose aim is to do away with
non believers and enforce their law on all others.
There are parts of Sydney and Melbourne that only the bravest of non Muslims would venture.
 

Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
What exactly is "enforced multiculturalism?" For example, I believe that immigrants should learn the language of the country they have migrated too, but should be allowed to teach their kids their "home lanugage" and use that in social settings if they wish. Subsidies? Not so much. Force teaching Spanish in US schools? No. Having signs in Spanish to allow the transition to the "host" country to be easier? No issue.

It seems like a fine line to me between doing too much to encourage separatism, the correct balance between acknowledging and respecting cultural history and still promoting integration, and bigotry (and not saying there is any of that in this thread).

Tough issue.
 

Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
I see.

So other than your question, you are not prepared to have a reasonable discussion about the issues the letter, and your original post raises?
 

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
I got you both beat, about 10 years ago, we spent a few months living on the Keizersgracht in Amsterdam. As long as we are making hugely simple generalisations, the Dutch seem like tall, very fair, easy going, friendly folks who really like to sing.
 
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Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
Enforced multIculturism, my definition is multIculturism enforced on the people
Against their will by a government elected without spelling out their intent prior to the said election.
 

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
Enforced multIculturism, my definition is multIculturism enforced on the people
Against their will by a government elected without spelling out their intent prior to the said election.

Pete, you mean kind of like Truman integrating the military and Johnson passing the Civil Rights bill?
 

Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
Now Jim...play nice.....

Pete, my question: what multiculturalism is enforced on the white folk in Australia against their will? I guess that is what I am trying to figure out. Exactly what is the Government in Australia, Holland, the UK doing to promote, or enforce, multiculturalism?

Like I said above, I think having a national language and sticking to it is a good thing. Forcing dual language, is bad, but folks having enclaves where they speak that language 00 without any Government umbrage or protection -- seems fine by me.

Just trying to understand the issue....
 

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
Now Jim...play nice.....

Pete, my question: what multiculturalism is enforced on the white folk in Australia against their will? I guess that is what I am trying to figure out. Exactly what is the Government in Australia, Holland, the UK doing to promote, or enforce, multiculturalism?

Like I said above, I think having a national language and sticking to it is a good thing. Forcing dual language, is bad, but folks having enclaves where they speak that language 00 without any Government umbrage or protection -- seems fine by me.

Just trying to understand the issue....

Not like you to play dumb Jeff, I'm sure you understand. And it's not only enforced upon the white folk it's enforced upon the indigenous people also.
But just in case here is some light reading. It was never in the party platform.
http://www.immi.gov.au/living-in-australia/a-multicultural-australia/multicultural-policy/
 
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Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
Not playing dumb at all, just trying to figure out what it is that is troubling you, and others about multiculturalism.

Like I said, the Government forcing dual language usage, or providing subsidies and benefits to immigrants, or embracing foreign law concepts and forcing natives to use them: problem.

Immigrants moving in and simply being told that the Government will (a) respect their right to follow their own traditions to the extent they don't interfere with existing policy/culture/law and (b) give them equal opportunity as natives, not a problem.

That's the issue I see with some of the attacks on "enforced multiculturalism." There is really nothing being enforced. Rather, it's just that the natives don't like the immigrants and their ways.

We have a long history of that here in the US of course, where the original immigrants from the UK didn't like the Germans who didn't like the Italians, who didn't like Poles and Irish who came after that, who in turn didn't like the next wave of Chinese immigration who then now don't like Hispanics.

I read every word of Australia's multicuturalism document you linked to. I don't see anything being forced of any one. What I read simply stated that an immigrants cultural beliefs and heritage should, within and subject to the broader goal of national unity, respected and immigrants not discriminated against as a result. It also stated that immigrants should be given equal opportunity to succeed.

So, two questions:

1. What is wrong with any of that?

2. And what is the "enforced multiculturalism" that you don't like (and I probably wouldn't either) or am I missing it? Or is it just distaste for immigrants?
 
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