I'll be...the SCCA being progressive on kit cars....

Ron Earp · 06-24-09, 02:16 PM

Looks like the SCCA is considering some kit car action, finally. Seems there is discussion of these cars in XP. Sorry, could only get an image from the SCCA July FastTrack, couldn't get the text.

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 06-24-09, 02:25 PM

Ron,

I hope the "Denver Despots" don't limit the SPF GT40 to the MK II listed here as he MK I and the MK I "R" shpuld be included.

Ron Earp · 06-24-09, 02:35 PM

Who are the Denver Despots?

Peter Jankovskis · 06-24-09, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Earp

Who are the Denver Despots?

I think he means SCCA National.

Ron Earp · 06-24-09, 03:17 PM

Ah, SCCA National/HQ is located in Topeka KS. They used to be in Denver some years ago, as well as in the Northeast before that.

Ron

WEGENER Engineering · 06-24-09, 04:51 PM

Ron - Do they say anything about Kirkham and ERA Cobras?

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 06-24-09, 05:51 PM

Ron,

Have not been an SCCA member for MANY years, but they went from being the "Westport Pharohs" to the "Denver Despots"..no idea what they call 'em in Topeka!

Keith 'Baron' Hardy · 06-24-09, 06:26 PM

Ron what car in the list are considered 'kit' cars or do they mean turnkey minus? I have no experince of the Kirkhams etc but aren't the GTM's and Nobles (and many of the SPF's) sold as complete cars - there being no 'kit' available?

Ron Earp · 06-24-09, 09:40 PM

Hi Keith,

Every GT40 and Cobra I know of can be had in turnkey minus or turnkey form. So that isn't a distinct enough attribute to distinguish something as a kit or production.

Here is my own personal definition and I think the SCCA is using something similar:

If the manufacturer of "the car" requires the owner to title the car because that said manufacturer does not undergo EPA testing, crash testing, and so on then "the car" is a kit car.

That definition would include every Cobra or GT40 that I know of sold in the US. All the GT40s discussed on this forum, save the original cars, are all titled in the US the same way, as self-builts, etc. and the law views them as kit cars. I'm pretty sure the Shelby Cobras, that is the current production glass and fiberglass Cobras, are kit cars as far as the law is concerned. I know that might make some folks unhappy to hear that used in conjunction with certain cars, but in most states as far as the law goes if you have to procure a title for the car and so on then it is a kit car.

Anyhow, have to read the fast track more when I have time to see what is happening on the kit car front and the SCCA. This has been one category of cars the SCCA has been slow to adoptor do anything with. NASA was quick to adopt some classes for kit cars but they didn't do well as I recall. NASA just has too damn many classes and "Spec series of the month" stuff going on. Heard of Spec Focus and Spec Mini? Well, they were once NASA spec classes that have died off along with Honda Challenge (in most places) and others.

I don't know what the SCCA was thinking when it moved to Topeka. They moved there, put a lot of money into the crappy Heartland park track, held the Runoffs there for a couple of years, and now that so many people hate the track the Runoffs are moving to Road America. I sent the SCCA a population density map along with my last license renewal to graphically illustrate that:

a) They are in the middle of nowhere.
and
b) Most of the population of the US lives within about 150-200 miles of the coastline. The SCCA should locate in a population center.

"Thank you for your input". was what I got back.

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 06-24-09, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Earp

Hi Keith,

"Thank you for your input". was what I got back.

Polite "corporate -speak" for "screw you, please go away..........."!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Randy V · 06-24-09, 11:05 PM

Glad to see that they are at least considering some of the kit / component cars out there.. FFR Roadsters have been running under AP for some time now.

BTW Folks - the "XP" class is for Solo (Autocross only) - but it's a start...

SCCA Location / Runoffs -

When the National Office was located in Denver, they were as far away from any competition venue as they could be. Travel costs were prohibitively high. There were no tax incentives to stay there and actually taxes were exceptionally high as well. I, for one, applauded their move to Topeka. More centrally located. Airfare into / out of that area was reasonable - Face it, neither KC or Topeka are known as the place to get away to.. Not so for Denver.

Heartland Park track - I've not raced there personally. I've heard a lot of good remarks about the track and some not so good. The track owner, Ray Irwin, is a really decent sort. He's also a racer (GT1) and used to own Blackhawk Farms raceway - which he also made many nice improvements to. Any one of you would really like him.

On to Road America - I've a ton of laps on that track. Thousands of miles. I love it. But it's a very expensive venue. Regardless of the expense - It's a good place for the R-O's - but as I understand it, the R-O location will change periodically (or at least that's what I was told)... I think it's only fair to move it around. Too many guys learn one track and dominate. I know of two people that relocated to the Mid-Ohio area simply for that purpose.

Well - that's the way this man sees it...

Ron Earp · 07-04-09, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big-Foot

When the National Office was located in Denver, they were as far away from any competition venue as they could be. Travel costs were prohibitively high. There were no tax incentives to stay there and actually taxes were exceptionally high as well. I, for one, applauded their move to Topeka. More centrally located. Airfare into / out of that area was reasonable - Face it, neither KC or Topeka are known as the place to get away to.. Not so for Denver.

Well - that's the way this man sees it...

I'd have to say I can't disagree with you in the long-term view. I wasn't participating when they were in Denver, only since they have been in Topeka. And as a new comer finding out they were HQ'ed in Topeka I thought "WTF?!?!?!".

Apparently not all is rosy in Topeka. New SCCA pres is reputed to not like the HQ location and shares the sentiments of some members that the SCCA should be located on a coast, near population centers.

From some folks close to the action at HQ I've also heard that not everyone is pleased with all the little regions and fiefdoms in the SCCA. Have to agree there. Why the Southeast has 19 SCCA chapters when there are only a few States in the Southeast is beyond me. And why the SC region controls two tracks in NC and can't afford to put on races at them so no races occur is beyond me too.

Lest my comments get folks down, the SCCA is great racing and the best available in the US as far as I'm concerned. Despite being a bit too old school in many aspects is is a great club.

Ron