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GT40 Tech - Exterior, Interior, AC, & Trim All that other stuff not in categories above.

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Old 11th June 2002, 09:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Elsewhere on the forum there were a couple of testimonials for POR-15's two part clear coat for polished metal; in my case, aluminum. Today a fellow who buys and refurbishes and sells chandeliers as a hobby told me that with the polished brass, copper and aluminum that he deals with, he has had the best luck with Krylon clear coat of all things. He says that is the only one that really does "self level" and seems to stay put and doesn't dull out the luster of the polished metal.

Can anyone corroborate this story or suggest any other product??
 
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Old 12th June 2002, 12:40 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn, If you want serious durability, I would still go with the POR-15 "Glisten" 2-pack.

If you polish the surface & then clean it with POR's AP-120, you will not lose any of the lustre of the original polished surface.

On the "self-levelling" issue, I have found Glisten to be almost perfect on a "wet edge" application - as long as you are brushing back into an edge that is no older than about 1 min, it all levels out. If you need longer to come back to the starting point, I have found that about 10% POR Solvent, mixed into the Glisten, will vastly improve the self-levelling - overall, and particularly if you are coming back to to an edge that is more than a minute or so old.

I finished my side window frames (MkIII swing-outs with fixed quarter-panes) the other day - I used the Glisten with 10% Solvent & you would swear that it was a spray job.

The most important things for Glisten are :

- Thoroughly clean with AP-120, hose off & let dry completely.

- After applying Glisten, leave it to dry for 3-4 days - whilst it is touch-dry in an hour or so, full mechanical strength takes a few days.

I hope this helps a bit.

Kind Regards,

Peter D. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 29th June 2002, 02:50 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Well, I purchased the GlistenPC clear coat system along with the AP120 cleaner and solvent. I have my aluminum console cover polished with Wenol to the point that I could easily use it to shave with. However, when I spray it with the AP120 cleaner and dry it, I have cloudy spots on the metal. There are also some areas that look like water spots. I have kept the piece wet with cleaner for exactly 2 min. as per instructions and then hosed it off and dryed it with a clean towel. I am begining to wonder if there is some incompatability between the AP120 and the Wenol. I tried rubbing the cloudy spots out with the POR-15 solvent and also tried acetone. The only thing that takes them out is to repolish with Wenol. I put a fluffy buffing muff on my DA and turned down the speed; boy does that do a nice job of polishing. Curiously, after repolishing and going through the cleaning process again, I once more had cloudy areas and water spot looking marks, BUT they were all in new locations. Anyone have any suggestions on how to get rid of the spots? I would really rather have a clear coat on the aluminum because it scratches soooo easily. I even have to be careful what kind of cloth I use with the polish or it will leave swirl scratches in it.
 
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Old 1st July 2002, 11:44 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

In my limited bit of clear coating polished aluminium I have found:
1) polish to shine
2) I used aluminum etchant (probably the stuff you are seeing cloudiness. I tried etching for the full recomended time and saw some milky haze appearing. Then I thought hey you are etching the metal which will add roughness to the metal, etc. So I ended up polishing followed by a short etch. Trade off time (good bond of clear) for cloudiness (looks like S**).
3.) Clear coat with Plasticoat (sp) clear high temp engine enamel.

The Plasticoat is the best I have seen although none seem to stick well to smooth metal. I tried Eastwood (yellowed easier and did not stick as well). I believe I tried another name brand, but not sure which.

Good luck.

Gary
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Old 1st July 2002, 12:42 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Gary, Thanks for the input. POR-15 has given me some suggestions. The likely culprit is either the Wenol reacting or possibly my water. I have ordered their polish and if all else fails,I will try rinsing with distilled water as a final rinse. If that fails I will compromise like you did and only use their Naphtha solvent and then clear coat. Its not like I'm doing a wheel that needs super adhesion. I'll post the results.

I had tried the Eastwoods Diamond Clear initially, but got inconsistent and unacceptable results. Maybe I'm just to picky, but I want the piece to look like it does when I have polished it and be protected. There is another product out there that was mentioned to me called Zoops Clear Coat Systemthat may work. Eventually, I'll find something, I just wonder how much it will cost in getting there?
 
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Old 1st July 2002, 03:49 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

One would think, huh Neal? No, it just my stubborn Norwegian streak that won't let this clear coating of polished Aluminum beat me. And the key here is polished. I just went by the automotive paint supply store to pickup some polyester putty and was bemoaning the problems I have had with it. They said, "Oh, we have some stuff.." But, when they looked it up, it was for brushed or machine finished aluminum, not polished.
 
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Old 1st July 2002, 05:07 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

I pick up that you are trying to spray a clear lacquer coating onto your ali panelling. I think...Why? All personal choice etc but consider that you will get little bits of grit in at some time and they will scratch it and deteriorate the surface. Also in the wheel arches proper you will get plenty of stones flying about.
My ali is a salt resistant ali (marine grade). I have used Alu to polish it and then I keep it clean with WD 40. This is just a thin oil which when wiped off, leaves just a small residue behind that reduces the amount of dirt sticking to the polished surface. It also helps to repel water.

A lot of historic racers do this to their ali work. It gives a nice patina which is appropriate for a 40.

My car isn't showroom condition (heaven forbid!) but has done over 24000 miles and the panels will clean up when I want them too. Will a sprayed finish panel clean up after mileage?

I gather from your postings Lynn that you don't intend to just show the car but to use it. Thats the way to go. Cars are for driving not polishing!

Just an alternate thought

Malcolm [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[ July 01, 2002: Message edited by: Malcolm M ]
 
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Old 2nd July 2002, 01:00 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Malcolm,

I am only doing alloy console and switch plate covers in the cockpit. I have a V shaped console that comes up from the tunnel to just under the switch panel. It contains my A/C & Heat, fan speed, thermostat and fresh air select switches; also the ignition switch (a Ford switch that uses the old square Ford key) and a 12V power plug. John Donnelley has also bent up a very nice aluminum panel that is formed exactly to the two switch panels on either side of the steering column. I also have a set of aluminum aircraft stype map lights on the center ceiling just in front of the firewall window. All of these are polished and I would like to keep them that way as I drive my car.

You are absolutely correct: this is not a car to be shown, but to be driven! But now that you mention it, I might do the same for the ally (as you put it) 9-hole vent cover on the rear clip. Although the WD40 thing does sound interesting. I know that Lee Holman does his exhaust with WD40 and it gives them a very nice golden type appearance. Does it give the same affect on aluminum? (I assume his exhaust is stainless. It might be polished aluminum, but I am just not sure.)
 
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Old 2nd July 2002, 01:23 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Geez Lynn, are you becoming a waxer??? [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
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Old 2nd July 2002, 05:00 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Hopefully your cockpit interior will suffer less stone chips than the wheelarches, but do not be totally sure of that! I spun at No Name corner at Goodwood a couple of times (I mean years back!) and afterwards it is amazing how much grass and stuff gets into the car. All Gt40s leak like sieves from rain but grass?

I doubt that the exhaust is an ally one. Mine is coated with an ally powder (on steel) and that melts and balls up on the headers. Most likely it is stainless steel that has goldenised with heat. The wd40 does not goldenise the ally. Just gives it a nice lustre.

Have to say I couldn't picture your interior layout exactly from your description so if you can, post a picture.

On the 9 hole Le Mans vent I still wouldn't lacquer it but keep it just polished ally. The heat that comes out there is quite fierce. That is why the holes are put there in the first place. You normally can fry an egg on the plate it gets so hot.

Only thing to remember when you use wd 40 in the engine bay is that when you start up after cleaning the car is that it may smoke for a little bit while it burns off any surplus. I have yet to set fire to the car!

Malcolm
 
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Old 3rd July 2002, 09:43 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn - I did the rear/top vent cover in HPC / JetHot (same as for the headers & rear vent grills, springs, etc). Whilst it doesn't give a mirror finish, it does polish up nicely & will be completely heat-proof.

Peter D. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 3rd July 2002, 10:07 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Excellent idea Peter. What do you polish it with?? There are a couple of marks on my headers (jet hot coated) that I would like to take off. Things like letting the leads of my multitester touch a hot header while reading the ohms across a faulty temp sender.

I keep forgetting that you can coat anything that can take the heat of curing. I think they have hi-temp powder coating now also. Hmmmm.....this is what makes this forum so good.
 
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Old 3rd July 2002, 06:09 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Speaking of coatings, there is a nice article on header coatings in CarCraft mag. August issue. It gives some of the background and insights of coatings. Check it out.
Jet-Hot Coatings Inc.
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Old 3rd July 2002, 06:59 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Malcolm, Here is a picture of the dash prior to installing the aluminum switch panel covers. They sit under the switches on both sides of the steering column. They are flat on top and curve to fit the underside of the panels

 
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Old 3rd July 2002, 11:41 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn, I just used Autosol metal polish & things came up with quite a nice sheen to them.

Kind Regards,

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Old 5th July 2002, 11:47 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Glisten update - I gave up on the AP-120 step for my console cover. Even with their polish and distilled water rinse I got the cloudy spots. So, I cleaned with their solvent and cotton balls until no residue showed on the cotton. I did use the AP-120 on some smaller parts like my map lights that weren't as critical and didn't have the wide field area like the panel.

So far so good! My inexperience and my HVLP did put on a bit too much material on the console cover. I had thinned with 5% solvent, but given the heat and humidity, both VERY high in Raleigh yesterday, I should have went to %15 (which I ended up with) and put on thinner coats. The orange peel that was very evident initially did flow out mostly. There are some scattered "bumps" on the surface. My image is clearly seen through the clear coat, however, even with the bumps. This more than I could say for the other product. The smaller parts don't have any of these bumps because I had the material thinned pretty well by the time I did them. I had mixed up 50cc of material and had plenty left over from the cover. This stuff has a long pot life, but given the heat and, especially, the humidity, I kept the spray gun in the air conditioned house between uses. (The material is water cured.) This gave me plenty of time to disassemble my map lights and sway bar mounting hardware, both polished aluminum also. These parts look really nice!

After the 4 day cure, I will try to buff out the panel cover. The clear coat is supposed to be hard as a rock by then. The only thing left is to use the parts and see if the stuff stays put and stays clear. But, right now, I am feeling pretty positive about the system. I just wished I understood why the cloudiness kept appearing. POR (I assume) told me through Peter Delaney (thanks again, Peter) that some imperfections disappear under Glisten and I found this to be somewhat true. But, I think that these milky spots would have shown.
 
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Old 6th July 2002, 10:58 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn, I was delighted (relieved) to hear that you have had some measure of success with the Glisten. So far, I have only brushed it (thinned with about 10% solvent) on smallish or irregular shaped parts. Now that you mention it, I can see a few small "bumps" but you really have to go looking for them. It sounds like it is quite sensitive to the % of solvent when sprayed - 15% sounds like it is about right.

I needed to remove some POR-15 a while ago, & found that the only thing that would touch it was the most evil paint stripper I could find (3 coats). Once the stuff had cured, no solvent that I could find would affect it at all. I guess that Glisten will be much the same.

If at the end of the day, you are not happy with the dash panels, you could consider having them plated. There is a funny little company here who specialises in plating anything (baby's booties, fruit, & all sorts of weird things in bronze, chrome, nickel, etc). Most of their work comes from re-plating (chrome) classic car dash & interior metal/plastic bits - perhaps there is is similar outfit near you ?

Kind Regards,

Peter D. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 6th July 2002, 02:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Peter, there are a couple of option before plating. There is the Zoop clear coat and there is a clear powder coat. Translucent powder coat colors also look cool. Before I would have the alloy plated, I think I would have it anodized. I believe that there is a clear anodization in addition to the more common blues, reds, greens and purples.

POR also has a new transluscent color application that can be done to polished metals and chrome before the Glisten step that looks really cool. It is not on their website, but was in the catalog they sent me with the Glisten.
 
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Old 6th July 2002, 09:39 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn,
I've used Eastwoods powder products on a lot of my engine parts. The clear on polished aluminum will take away a lot of the "brillance" of the polished look. It still looks good, but not as good as the bare polished aluminum. Another vendor may have a clear that don't take away the shine but I've never looked for alternatives.

Another thing to watch for with the powder is aluminum castings. I tried to do my bell housing 3 times before I finally gave up. Air trapped in the pores of the casting will bubble up under the powder at the 400 degree cure temp. Preheating the part then cooling it before applying the powder helps somewhat. The type of casting will dictate how easily trapped air is a problem. Example, die cast is no problem. Sand cast is awful.
The translucent colors look very nice. They have to be put over silver or chrome look powders, chrome, polished finish, etc. The drawback to them is tightening a bolt or screw against the finish. Since the color is going over a polished or chrome finish, or previous coat of powder, it doesn't adhere with as much "tooth" as it does to a sandbasted surface. When you tighten a bolt against it, even with a flatwasher, it will crack the translucent finish. Using ARP slime (their moly lubricant)between the bolt, washer, and finish will help, but you still have to use a light touch and hold your breath.

The powder can be removed with paint stripper if it doesn't come out the way you want it. I've went through a gallon or two of stripper in the last 2 years!

Leave us know how well the Glisten holds up. I was thinking about putting it on my wheels.

Dave

[ July 06, 2002: Message edited by: DaveWharran ]
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Old 7th July 2002, 06:43 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: Clear Coat of Polished Metal

Lynn, I just heard today that there is a new version of Glisten - Glisten 2 or something, & it is supposed to have better adhesion, better heat resistance & a better level-out. Is this the one you have used ?

If you get really desperate & the Glisten or anodising doesn't work out, the plating which you might like to consider is Rhodium. I have only had a little experience with this on small parts for my scale model yacht, but the results are great - it is less obvious than chrome & tends to look more like polished S/S. Manufacturing jewellers use it, either as a finished surface, or as a base for silver/gold plating (I think). It might be worth a try, just getting a small part done to see what you think.

Kind Regards,

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