I hate trailers...... - Page 3

Gary Kadrmas · 02-14-07, 11:27 AM

Ron,

If you (or others) are going the truck route, and modifying it into something that is right for you, take a visit to:

Trucks For Sale at Truck Paper: Freightliner, International Trucks, Kenworth, Peterbilt, Mack trucks, dump trucks, dump trailers, used trailers for sale.

You will need to select the truck manufacturer (Ford for me!), or choose the weight limits of the chassis, or "class" of the truck. Their are many ads to see, and alot of "cab and chassis" trucks just waiting for your fabricating skills to make it the hauler of your dreams.

Cheers,

Gary Kadrmas

Gary Kadrmas · 02-14-07, 11:28 AM

Opps.........

That's weird. I thought the first post didn't take.

Sorry.................Gary

Mark Charlton · 02-14-07, 11:41 AM

Ron, it sounds like you and I should start a business here. I'm looking for (what I think is) the same thing you are. I want a used (post-depreciation) one-piece hauler that will not cost a fortune, be non-descript from the outside and enable easy trips to track and shows. Plus, if I can use it as a regular cube-style truck, I can have my business buy it and write it off.

There MUST be more than just a few of us who don't want the hassle of owning a tow vehicle AND a large trailer (not to mention the whole backing up issue).

It's hard to imagine that nobody has done a standard ramp or lift conversion that can be added to a Ford or GM cube van. If anyone DOES know of such a beast, please post details!

Gary Kadrmas · 02-14-07, 02:47 PM

Mark,

Go to the truckpaper web site I posted above. Cube trucks are out there everywhere, and mostly, for a price that will not totally bankrupt a guy.

Converting a box truck to a hauler is not that difficult. It really depends on what your personal preference is and how and if you intend to use the truck for something other than a hauler. Cost factors of the conversion will be if you go the ramp route, or a lift gate set-up, and of course, would be higher if the project was done by someone other than yourself.

Truckpaper has everything from ex-U-haul trucks, to rigs that have been already converted.

Good luck, hope you find something....

Gary Kadrmas

Mark Charlton · 02-14-07, 05:10 PM

Thanks Gary. Cube trucks are everywhere around here too. The real problem is in the ramps/lift conversion. I looked at that site and didn't find anyone specializing in pre-engineered options. I could get a local truck dealer to do a custom thing, but then I'm covering the whole development cost on one unit and I'd rather go with a proven, available solution, if one exists.

Ron Earp · 02-15-07, 10:01 PM

Here is what we need, built on a van frame, with a wide axle. The simple way to build these things is to elevate the entire box above the rolling diamter of the wheels, but that makes the damn box 3 feet off the ground. If we widened the axle and set the box down between the wheels, used some internal wheel wells, we could get 6 ft of width low to the ground to load a car. I bet we'd have a load height of 18 inches or so, which is useable with some real world ramps. That 3 ft height is not usable with real world stuff.

If built on a van frame or van cockpit design the box could go into the cockpit which would be useful for moving around, AC, music, etc.

I wonder if I could find a used F250 van and get an axle widened, then try this at home? 17 ft would be a mimimal length I think, based on the fact Jeff just bought a 18ft enclosed and it is tight in there. I could still build a bunk, tool box, and other stuff in the space though with careful attention to detail. I like this project. Will somebody fund it?

Ron

charlie · 02-15-07, 10:36 PM

Try these guys they did my trucks conversion to a car hauler.

Brown Cargo Van - Manufatures Custom Truck Bodies

Charlie

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 02-16-07, 07:21 AM

Ron and all,

There is a "wide track" Dana rear axle used by Ford for ambulances. I will get the dimensions later today and post the results. It still will probably not allow the width required to get a '40 or T70 past.

The solution I have seen to this is to have the floor at the lowest lever, i.e. just over the truck frame and substructure height and then to use ramps on an angle attached to the body sides to clear the now required wheelhouse boxes. This allows a clear level floor on the center of the body and a more 'loading friendly" ramp angle for driving/winching the car up. I have even seen a version where the ramps fold up against the walls for a wider clear area (good if the truck will used for a business on non-automotive days, damn that IRS!) and such.

This allows storage under the car from mid-point forward and if you have a "cab-over attic" you have room for storage or fold out bunks, etc. You will have some compromises to deal with but unless you have a big checkbook and buy a custom built or expensive "toterhome" you will have issues to deal with. If you prioritize your needs, you can build a unit like this for trailer money and have a very effective truck.

Rick

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 02-16-07, 08:51 AM

I have checked my Ford spec book and the "wide track" axle is on an F350 chassis with the ambulance prep option. The axle is 12.7" wider than the standard axle so it will possily allow the wheelhouses to be outboard of the width of the car.

This axle is only on F350 (conventional cab, NOT the van cutaway) with the ambulance prep option so they will not be dime a dozen in the boneyards.

Rick

Ron Earp · 02-16-07, 09:02 AM

Got any idea of how wide the standard axle is?

Simon · 02-16-07, 09:24 AM

Ron, how about just building a box on one of these.

eBay Motors: 99 FORD F550 POWERSTROKE XLT 6SP CREW 21 KILAR ROLLBACK (item 170080836564 end time Feb-19-07 08:46:51 PST)

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 02-16-07, 09:27 AM

Standard axle on a E350(van cutaway chassis) is 73.2" track (center of DRW) and an E450 is 77.7" track.

Also be mindful of the GVWR of the truck you start with, that is the max capacity of total weights of chassis, body, cargo and passengers. Most E350 DRWs are 11,500# and E450s are 14,050#. That is for the last few model years. Older units are less. If anyone needs exact GVWR info, contact me and I can look it up. It does not take long to exceed the rating. A diesel E350 with a 176" wheelbase (the longest) has a bare chassis weight of around 5700#. A 16/17 foot body with a roll up door will add about 2200/2400# leaving about 3600# for the ramps, equipment, cargo (car) and your own self and "crew." An E450 would be preferred.

Rick

Ron Earp · 02-16-07, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPHameka

Ron, how about just building a box on one of these.

eBay Motors: 99 FORD F550 POWERSTROKE XLT 6SP CREW 21 KILAR ROLLBACK (item 170080836564 end time Feb-19-07 08:46:51 PST)

Thanks for the link but that one is not different from about everything else on the thread - the platform for the box would be 3ft off the ground and just about impossible to load a race car on without 25 ft long ramps. Of course that one down rollback and off load so could use short ramps, but it'd offload everything in the box too!!!!

What we need is like what is in the drawn picture, a box sitting the box down inbetween the tires to get the box floor low.

3600# would be enough for load I think since the cars are about 2200lbs. And those loads are recommendations, not points where things break if you go a pound over. My Lightning is only good for towing 5000 lbs. But don't tell it since we tow about 7200-8000 lbs around all the time.

hmmm 77.7" is center of wheel? Is that what DRW means? That would mean less than 6ft between the wheels then and not enough to load some cars for sure. Axles get widened all the time at various places though. I should measure the road and see how car we can open it up.

R

Richard Timte · 02-16-07, 11:41 AM

Ron,

One thing you might think about is some transport wheels and tires like the one below.

I know it would be a pain, but the car would then fit between the wheel wells. If you run pin drives it would be a lot faster to change out.

Just a thought.

Simon · 02-16-07, 12:02 PM

Ron, the only truck that I've seen that you can drive between the wheels is one of these. There was a company doing Toronado/ Cadilac front wheel drive conversions on later model Chevy/ Ford but I can't seem to be able to find them now.

Ron Earp · 02-16-07, 12:05 PM

Simon, that would be perfect! Put a low box on it, about 5ft high, and I'm looking for something similar. Is that one front wheel drive? Looks like it'd have to be.

Ron

Rick Muck- Mark IV · 02-16-07, 12:12 PM

Ron,
Keep in mind you cannot exceed 102" overall width without requiring a permit. Yes, the 77" is the center of the dual rear wheels so add 12-14" each way to allow for the wheel/tire and clearance.

A cube van will have a deck height of about 28-32" with a low floor/wheelbox setup. That means you need to get the car over the wheelboxes where the angled interior ramp setup I referred to comes in. Or you could just race a first generation Mini and carry it in a long bed pickup! I do see guys with Legends cars in pickups.

Rick

Ron Earp · 02-16-07, 12:24 PM

All we need is 6.5ft between the wheel wheels and we can carry dang near anything. I think this completely doable without a 102" overage.

Those cube trucks, vans, straight trucks, box truck are all out - just too high.

Not only am I trying to get one that has a low floor, around 20 inches, I also don't want the truck to be over 7.5 ft tall overall or thereabouts.

Picky, I know, but I'm not the only one who thinks this is a useful piece of tool.

Ron