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Old 24th March 2006, 02:06 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I received a call from Oliver stating that he had posted. It was confirmed that the posting was seen by 2 people. I will not state what it was about.

Why was it erased? I propose anyone associated with RF have their admin revoked. This way open discussions can occur.

This is very dangerous to erase posts.

Ben
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Old 24th March 2006, 03:32 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I saw that post too. The plot thickens. If there has been any of the stated dubious activity anywhere in the RF supply and distribution chain the perpetrator/s need to be exposed and held accountable. And quickly too if he/they are on the run.

This is the second deleted post of Olivers that I have seen, must be a time zone thing!

What's to stop Oliver reposting?

Regards
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Old 24th March 2006, 03:38 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Ben

If it's the post that I read, I imagine it was removed because there was a fear it may have been actionable. The alleged facts may have been there, but accusals of fraud etc, etc are very dangerous. Why not just post the 'facts' again???

While posting, I notice that Ron's original post on these issues, headed "Roaring Forties Information, March 2006" also appears to have 'gone missing'. I can't access it. Any reason?

Post moved/access denied

Cheers.
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Old 24th March 2006, 03:39 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I too saw the post

I believe the count was in the 20's when I saw it

I believe Mark Worhtington replied - I could be wrong on this.

Post by oliver was harsh / blunt but did raise a few questions

Ian
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Old 24th March 2006, 08:14 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I pulled the thread Oliver started. It was slanderous and second hand info and I know the sources of the information. The thread is in storage thus not deleted. I am off site on a job and did not have time to deal with "is this right or is this wrong" thus needed to remove the post before the entire forum got out of hand. I'll write and comment on it this weekend after talking with both principals and if it should be re-activated, it will. I don't want to edit or censor anything on the forum but I've been burnt once with Oliver and his postings and don't want that happening again.

This is no "plot". The RF March 2006 thread I started and I put in storage to replace it with threads with real info I got from our attorney. I didn't think the forum needed second hand info on the situation. So, the newer threads that I've written have true, factual, and real information that is provided by our attorney and is matter of public record. When I return home I have some more info to post on RF as well, although it doesn't tell us any more than what has been said.

I'll be working all day this I cannot reply to this thread or others but will return this weekend.

Ben, I'm not protecting RF or anything like that. I was too trusting in the past, clearly, thus I'm open to the fact that anything can happen. If you guys want to start that thread again then be my guest - I won't stop you and can't, I'm in a sales meeting all day and can't write or post until 10pm EST. I'll leave it there and the chips can fall where they may.

To confrim Paul, yes, I have that thread and others in a storage forum. And, I deleted it not on advice but under the only judgement that I could make in the free minute I had to look at the forum - mine. I'd like to talk to Hershal about it and the other person involved. I can also confirm Oliver posted and emailed me to have the post removed.

This entire RF thing has really hurt the GT40 community and badly. What a shame.

Best,
Ron
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Old 24th March 2006, 08:15 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Rob and all

I too saw the posting you refer to and I susect you're right. The wording was 'harsh' but IF correct, would open many other questions as suggested.

IF RON has moved it on advice, then fair enough and I guess he will inform when he see's fit, however, IF it was deleted by 'A N OTHER' for other reasons, then the integrity of the forum's content/independance will, at the very least, be questionable..

For what it's worth I would not be surprised if 'DELETED' items were actually just moved to another area by the controlling software and that RON may still have access to 'EVERY WORD POSTED', not a bad thing in my opinion.
[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soapbox.gif[/img]

EDIT - looks like Ron beat me to the keyboard by a minute..
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Old 24th March 2006, 08:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I saw the post before it was removed. Mark's comments were emotional. Mark don't leave the forum on account of one person. In fact, I believe that Oliver asked Ron to remove said post. With that said, my [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twocents.gif[/img] is why has Oliver appointed himself as representative of all the members affected by RF's. He has not been affected but continues his assault on Robert and RF. Oliver if you haven't been banned again, a reply would be nice. A NICE reply. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] I am not saying that the truth should not be uncovered by any means. I believe that Robert's feet should be held to the fire and that this matter should be fully investigated and the facts made public. My big problem is that Oliver continues to insinuate that others are pulling his strings because they are too afraid too post and ask "the hard questions". If this is true than my comments are directed to said individual(s). Be a man or if the case may be, a woman than, and post the facts and questions yourself. Show some backbone and stop hiding behind Oliver. If Oliver has been banned, you will have to come out of the closet eventually. Howard just came out. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/1poke.gif[/img] Double ditto. Good for him. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] As a last note, as the forum is open to the public, why would you want to broadcast your strategy and intentions of how you intend to recover your lost funds? It only gives your adversary an oppurtunity to counter your move prior to it's execution. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soapbox.gif[/img] Off rant, As I said before, Good luck to all members affected.

Edit: the price of slow typing Ron and Paul passed me.
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Old 24th March 2006, 09:57 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Ron,

Thank you for explaining. However, I will keep in place the request to eliminate all admins who have business ties to RF.

On a separate note, I hope everyone understands what Ron has done for all of us in a very positive way on this forum and with his initiatve to get at answers. I commend him.

Ben
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Old 24th March 2006, 10:10 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Hey guys, some of you must be real fans of the X Files - The Truth Is Out There! As Ron said, there is no plot to thicken, Ron simply moved or hid the thread.

What happened was that OLIVER started a thread with a post about Hershal and his relationship as an agent for RF that contained factual information, yet spun it in a manner that was, IMO, slanderous. I admit to having had a couple beers when I read his post and I responded harshly (OK, maybe I shouldn't drink and post [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] ).

It seems that a forum member and someone involved in the RF mess (you know who you are) has been feeding OLIVER information and using him as a mouthpiece for his gripes. OLIVER would then post and insert his own misspelled, gramatically incorrect conspiracy-theory twist on things. I suspect the reason OLIVER asked to have his post removed was because he realized what he had posted was indeed slanderous.

I asked Ron in the post and in a PM to reboot OLIVER; I'll let Ron comment on OLIVER's status. Hershal said he was ready to come back to the forum but stayed away when OLIVER reappeared. Hopefully Hershal will be back soon and I'll let him give the facts related to his relationship with RF. It looks like I misjudged Robert, but I know Hershal a lot better and I am certain that he did no wrong in the RF matter - he got burned like everybody else. However, I'm afraid he will, nonetheless, be dragged into some sort of legal proceedings by the same individual who has been using OLIVER as his mouthpiece.
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Old 24th March 2006, 10:58 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!


To all parties.


I asked Ron to romove the post not because I thought it was slanderous but only because the infomation was to sensitive for the public forum. Please do not fault Ron for the removal.
I made a bad mistake posting the information and should have consulted Ron first.The information was fowarded to Ron and will be investigated and commented by Ron only.


As for the harsh comments by Mark. Surly understandable. However, when he sent me a threatining Pm, this I will not tolerate. I will take into considertation that he was drinking. But future threats will be fowarded to Ron.

Regards
Oliver
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Old 24th March 2006, 11:12 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I did not threaten OLIVER in my response to his PM, but to avoid further confusion, I will never again waste my time by communicating with him directly via email or PM.

I don't drink often, but I'm a happy drunk when I do. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Edited my post to add that I RESPONDED to OLIVER's PM.]
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Old 24th March 2006, 06:04 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Pulling posts and threads etc in this way seems to conflict with the stated reasons for stopping people changing/deleting their posts after 1/2 an hour (or whatever the limit is. I couldn't find the thread concerning this but it was catalysed by someone deleting all their posts on an issue).
I'm sure there are many contributors who in hindsight would like to change or remove posts they've made in the past - second hand info or not. With great respect, these are slippery slopes Ron.
Clarification (with a later post) is always possible, but removal and replacement, that makes me uneasy, especially when that ability is not available to all.

Tim.
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Old 24th March 2006, 10:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Fellows,

What I did might not have been right, but, I wasn't sure how to deal with it. I was in the middle of a company sales meeting, checked the forum and saw that mess and then emails from Oliver asking for me to pull the thread. After reading it, I thought the post was slanderous and something that didn't belong on the forum. First time I've done it, but, realize in the five years I've moderated this forum and years of moderating UUnet groups I've always had the ability to do that - so it is not new. And I've never abused that power in the past.

What is new is that I felt the need to do something about the thread. IT is 10PM EST and I just returned from Nashville so as soon as I can sort through email and talk to the people involved I'll make a decision, with input, on what to do with the thread. If it wasn't tied up in the legal RF mess it might be a bit easier, but, unfortunately I can't change that. Tim, you might see it a bit different if you were in my shoes, but so be it.

Best,
Ron
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Old 24th March 2006, 11:37 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I don't mean to seem to make light of this, nor am I trying to complicate matters, I just hope everybody manages to maintain their principles through this. It's sometimes easy to let principles go by the wayside in individual circumstances but it is usually for the worse.
In my post above I was thinking less of the Hershal thread and more of others. If only to keep things in context I think it's important to keep what was there to start with.

On dealing with totally inappropriate posts including spam and troll behaviour I consider you to be doing a fine job.

Tim.
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Old 25th March 2006, 04:58 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Ron, I sent you a pm regarding this situation which you should read prior to your decision.
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Old 28th March 2006, 07:23 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

I noticed while searching through another thread that "Roaring Forties" has been locked out. Why was that necessary and how does it help?
I'm guessing/hoping that it's legal but I'd like to know for sure. I wouldn't have thought that a username on a forum would be a real problem.
Apologies if I've missed an explanation somewhere.

Tim.
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Old 28th March 2006, 07:24 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Where?
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Old 28th March 2006, 07:27 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Here.
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Old 28th March 2006, 07:56 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: Who has admin to erase things? This is bad!

Ah, you mean Roaring Forties the company, aka, Robert Logan. Failed attempt to get him to try and contact me since calls and emails go unanswered. I should have known better. I'd forgotten about it and left it the way it was set a week ago. I'll reset it, he's free to post all he wants.
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