Jim, tell me, are you OK with the Obamacare review board taking decisions out of your hands?
83% of u.s. Doctors consider quitting.
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Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
On an emergency care level? That's not how that works.
I know, but as a medical doctor, I'd like to know his opinion.
Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
HIs opinion on a false statement?
If you are talking about insurance review on what procedures will be used and not used depending on the health of the patient, etc. it isn't that much different from what insurance companies do now AND it is the only way to curtail the "last six months of life" expenses that we currently spend far too much money on.
If you are talking about insurance review on what procedures will be used and not used depending on the health of the patient, etc. it isn't that much different from what insurance companies do now AND it is the only way to curtail the "last six months of life" expenses that we currently spend far too much money on.
Why don't we let Dr. EMURPHY and Dr. Jim give us their opinions instead of trying to shut them down with your legalese side stepping?
Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
You crack me up. "Legalese side stepping?"
Who is shutting who down? I'm interested in hearing their opinion(s). You on the other hand seem to want to deny the others the right to offer their opinion. Nice job!
Who is shutting who down? I'm interested in hearing their opinion(s). You on the other hand seem to want to deny the others the right to offer their opinion. Nice job!
I'm asking for an opinion, you are trying to prejudice the witnesses.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
This poll is comically flawed.
This is the poll question that they basen that rediculus 83% of doctors......
First off it does not mention Obama Care at all, does it. These Doctors complaint might be insurance cost, patients without insurance or any number of things.
******************
How do current changes in the medical system affect your desire to practice medicine?
I'm re-energized - 4.6%
Makes me think about quitting - 82.6%************
Unsure/no opinion - 12.8%
*********
That is absurd, only those three options.
I'm energized, I feel like quitting or I'm not sure!!!
What a bunch of bull, first off only 2 or 3% replied, as you can see, very few of the I'm not sure group bothered to vote.
That leaves only two choices
(1) "I'm energized"
(2) Makes me think about quitting.
From those rediculus poll question, led to Mr Fechter post.
Obama Care is not mentioned, is it? What a bunch of liers.
This is the poll question that they basen that rediculus 83% of doctors......
First off it does not mention Obama Care at all, does it. These Doctors complaint might be insurance cost, patients without insurance or any number of things.
******************
How do current changes in the medical system affect your desire to practice medicine?
I'm re-energized - 4.6%
Makes me think about quitting - 82.6%************
Unsure/no opinion - 12.8%
*********
That is absurd, only those three options.
I'm energized, I feel like quitting or I'm not sure!!!
What a bunch of bull, first off only 2 or 3% replied, as you can see, very few of the I'm not sure group bothered to vote.
That leaves only two choices
(1) "I'm energized"
(2) Makes me think about quitting.
From those rediculus poll question, led to Mr Fechter post.
Obama Care is not mentioned, is it? What a bunch of liers.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
This poll is comically flawed.
This is the poll question that they basen that rediculus 83% of doctors......
First off it does not mention Obama Care at all, does it. These Doctors complaint might be insurance cost, patients without insurance or any number of things.
******************
How do current changes in the medical system affect your desire to practice medicine?
I'm re-energized - 4.6%
Makes me think about quitting - 82.6%************
Unsure/no opinion - 12.8%
*********
That is absurd, only those three options.
I'm energized, I feel like quitting or I'm not sure!!!
What a bunch of bull, first off only 2 or 3% replied, as you can see, very few of the I'm not sure group bothered to vote.
That leaves only two choices
(1) "I'm energized"
(2) Makes me think about quitting.
From those rediculus poll question, led to Mr Fechter saying that doctors will quit over Obama care
Obama Care is not mentioned, is it? What a bunch of liers.
This is the poll question that they basen that rediculus 83% of doctors......
First off it does not mention Obama Care at all, does it. These Doctors complaint might be insurance cost, patients without insurance or any number of things.
******************
How do current changes in the medical system affect your desire to practice medicine?
I'm re-energized - 4.6%
Makes me think about quitting - 82.6%************
Unsure/no opinion - 12.8%
*********
That is absurd, only those three options.
I'm energized, I feel like quitting or I'm not sure!!!
What a bunch of bull, first off only 2 or 3% replied, as you can see, very few of the I'm not sure group bothered to vote.
That leaves only two choices
(1) "I'm energized"
(2) Makes me think about quitting.
From those rediculus poll question, led to Mr Fechter saying that doctors will quit over Obama care
Obama Care is not mentioned, is it? What a bunch of liers.
Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
Right Bob, like I'm going to prejudice two educated MDs with an internet question.
Your question (to Jim anyway) made no sense. He's an emergency room doctor. The insurance review panels have nothing to do with emergency care.
i agree that doctors can enjoy complaining but if the aggressive changes in healthcare also applied to organisations that pay for influence I.E. drug companies and device companies as well as the insurance companies (who still are posting excellent profits) then maybe the disgruntled docs might be a little more supportive of CHANGE
I am not worried about the high percentage of MD's who have "considered" quitting.
I don't think there is a single teacher I know who has not considered quitting, too...but they are still at it, working for what probably amounts to minimum wage when you factor in all the "non-contract" time they have to spend on their jobs.
We all get dismayed at our situation from now to then, often wish we had taken different forks in the road, even wonder if it might be too late to begin a new career, but as stated, few of us do, we just complain and "consider" making a change in our lives.
Another statistic that proves you can make a case for anything you want if you can find a statistic that supports your position...the proof is in the "vetting" of your source for the statistical information.
Cheers!
Doug
I don't think there is a single teacher I know who has not considered quitting, too...but they are still at it, working for what probably amounts to minimum wage when you factor in all the "non-contract" time they have to spend on their jobs.
We all get dismayed at our situation from now to then, often wish we had taken different forks in the road, even wonder if it might be too late to begin a new career, but as stated, few of us do, we just complain and "consider" making a change in our lives.
Another statistic that proves you can make a case for anything you want if you can find a statistic that supports your position...the proof is in the "vetting" of your source for the statistical information.
Cheers!
Doug
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
Actually the process of taking decisions out of our hands has been going on for decades. Not too many decisions are still left in our hands. So it probably won't feel a whole lot different than it does now.
Of course the liability for those decisions still rests with us. Naturally.
Of course the liability for those decisions still rests with us. Naturally.
We "patients" like to think the doctor's judgement is the last word, but I understand managed care and the insurance company's insistence on following a certain sequence in treating a condition...Rx before surgery, that sort of thing.
However, when an MD follows a sequence of treatments insisted upon by the insurance company and it results in a lawsuit, IMHO the insurance company ought to be on the hook, not the MD.
We desperately need tort reform, gentlemen :thumbsup: .
Cheers!
Doug
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
I am amazed and heartened that you and others in your profession continue to
Carry on under ever increasing pressure from all around you.
Thank you for your dedication and service.
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
Very kind of you, Pete, to say that. I'm touched. You will receive a certificate in the mail shortly good for a free lower GI endoscopy here in the USA. AKA, thank you.
In my experience, managed care and insurance companies are very careful not to tell doctors what to do. Otherwise they would be making medical decisions, and therefore be on the hook for the liability generated by the consequences of those decisions, as I understand it.
So they just refuse to pay for certain things that in their opinions don't work. Now- some of those financial pressures are based on the best evidence available- for example, bone marrow transplant therapy for recurrent breast cancer, which hasn't been shown to relieve suffering, prolong life in patients, or cure anyone. And it is very expensive. Insurance companies and managed care organizations tend to target expensive therapies which don't have a solid evidence base. Of course, as time goes on, some of those therapies WILL accumulate an evidence base which supports their efficacy. But by delaying and stalling, the insurance companies will have at least spared themselves having to pay for some of those treatments. Really for them it is about nothing other than the bottom line. Period, that's it.
This kind of maneuver, of course, leaves the patient with a lot of debt, and the physician or hospital with no payment, etc etc. The insurance company simply steps out of the middle and leaves the other players to fight it out.
Arguably, the kind of huge financial pressure they bring to bear really DOES constitute indirect medical decision-making. At least I think it does. But, at least at our hospital, we have a lot of patients trying to get in for inappropriate reasons, and frankly I welcome a situation in which social service or utilization review comes to the ER and tells us that the patient can't be admitted, but they will help make other arrangements. As long as the patient gets taken care of, it's fine with me.
In my experience, managed care and insurance companies are very careful not to tell doctors what to do. Otherwise they would be making medical decisions, and therefore be on the hook for the liability generated by the consequences of those decisions, as I understand it.
So they just refuse to pay for certain things that in their opinions don't work. Now- some of those financial pressures are based on the best evidence available- for example, bone marrow transplant therapy for recurrent breast cancer, which hasn't been shown to relieve suffering, prolong life in patients, or cure anyone. And it is very expensive. Insurance companies and managed care organizations tend to target expensive therapies which don't have a solid evidence base. Of course, as time goes on, some of those therapies WILL accumulate an evidence base which supports their efficacy. But by delaying and stalling, the insurance companies will have at least spared themselves having to pay for some of those treatments. Really for them it is about nothing other than the bottom line. Period, that's it.
This kind of maneuver, of course, leaves the patient with a lot of debt, and the physician or hospital with no payment, etc etc. The insurance company simply steps out of the middle and leaves the other players to fight it out.
Arguably, the kind of huge financial pressure they bring to bear really DOES constitute indirect medical decision-making. At least I think it does. But, at least at our hospital, we have a lot of patients trying to get in for inappropriate reasons, and frankly I welcome a situation in which social service or utilization review comes to the ER and tells us that the patient can't be admitted, but they will help make other arrangements. As long as the patient gets taken care of, it's fine with me.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Err, thanks Jim but no thanks.:stunned:
30,000,000 uninsured to be added to obamacare and a projected shortage of 45,000 doctors equals, what?
Nurse-Practitioners: The Answer to the Doctor Shortage? – AARP
Nurse-Practitioners: The Answer to the Doctor Shortage? – AARP
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Typical,
Those numbers make it seem like those 30,000,000 people just apeared out of nowhere.
Are you saying that those 30,000,000 have never been seen by a doctor?
Are you saying that the medical industry needs to expand because suddenly 30,000,000 people just discoved something called medicine?
Thats rediculus, the major differance is now those people will be in a position to pay for the medical care they receive!
Those numbers make it seem like those 30,000,000 people just apeared out of nowhere.
Are you saying that those 30,000,000 have never been seen by a doctor?
Are you saying that the medical industry needs to expand because suddenly 30,000,000 people just discoved something called medicine?
Thats rediculus, the major differance is now those people will be in a position to pay for the medical care they receive!
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Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
Now THIS is going to be a problem. NPs should not be independent practitioners in my humble opinion. I think they are great in supervised practice venues. I remain to be convinced on anything else. I think we are headed for trouble, but I am open to seeing what happens. However, for me, I want a physician taking care of me.
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