How do you define a kit car?

[Randy V]

My definition of a Kit-Car;

Collection of parts that are engineered to fit together in a specific sequence accommodated by step-by-step "sequenced" instructions - the end result of the assembly is a product finished to the degree the kit was purchased (I.E. Roller, Turn-Key, etc.)..

When people ask me if my car is a kit - I tell them it is a spec component car that I am assembling to form a replica of a 1965 Ford GT40.

Kit-Car (in my opinion) is not necessarily a BAD thing, but I've been around long enough to associate kit-cars first with Donor based cars. These cars (for the most part) are not donor based.

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

People have asked me whether my GT40 is a kit. I tell them, no, it isn't: a kit comes with all the parts, and instructions.

I've had neither of those.

 

[Eric Johnson]

People have asked me whether my GT40 is a kit. I tell them, no, it isn't: a kit comes with all the parts, and instructions.

I've had neither of those.

Jim, +1 :thumbsup:

 

[Cliff Beer]

What's also interesting about this topic is how many supposedly "production" cars are really more like a well built kit car. Examples are cars like a lotus esprit, a ferrari 308, older lambos and maseratis. These cars are no different than what shows up in a good GT40 kit, it just so happens that the guys building them are sitting in Hethel or Maranello or Bologna.

Seems to me the difference may really lie in the distinction between highly automated production means and, on the other hand (pun!), more hand made cars. If no two cars on the "assembly line" are alike then that's a hand made car, and that includes kit cars made at home by DIYers and also "kit" cars made in factories and shops by guys who aren't the end customer. Everything in my garage is a hand made car, whereas the Suburban out in the driveway for toting the family around is definitely a production car.

Just another perspective.

 

[Darrell]

Pete I with you on this one, calling my DRB a Kit Car makes my hair stand on end. My definition of a kit car is much like buying a plastic model with ALL the parts in the box and assembling it at home.
In my case I purchased very little from Peter at DRB apart from the basic body chassis unit. I then proceeded to manufacture suspension /fuel tanks/ dashmount/ wiper assembly/ gearshift/ wiring harness etc,etc. I feel that a very large proportion of my car is my blood sweet and tears and to me was not a purchased box of parts ready to bolt together in to a car.
Just my thoughts and if some of us disagree lets just agree to disagree but I still detest the words kit car when describing my car.

 

[Chris Simpson]

I would agree with Cliff on this. Even current Rolls Royces are assembled in England from parts manufactured by BMW in Germany.

Chris

 

[David Sturch]

Gent's

My view on this such.

1. Production Car- designed in house, engineered in house,most parts sub contracted
or kited out and meets MVSS for the period produced and Branded.
Produced on large scale.

2. Replica Car- designed by someone else (production or race car) copied and
reproduced on a small scale and can be kited out. There are
variations 100% pure using original parts and design etc.

3. Limited Model Production- designed in house,parts produced in house. Branded and can be kited out does not meet MVSS. Produced on small scale. The RCR SLC for example.

Dave

 

[Malcolm]

Just to confuse, I have a letter from the MSA defining GTDs as Production Kit Cars for competition purposes! Hope that helps.....

 

[Jimmy P]

Fantastic read Gents. All very good points and certainly worth the time to read each post. Obviously an issue we've given thought too. One theme that prevails is that most, not all, of us feel the term "kit car" gives us the creeps. I'm from that line of thinking also. Like others when I hear the term I picture cars from the early 70's and 80's built on VW frames. Not bad cars but not my cup of tea for many reasons. Conspicuous by its absense in this thread is a money value. In reading many car mags from around the world I see exact "copies" of various exotic cars (mostly huge money Ferrari's like the GTO) being built and sold with the price listed as POA. POA to me means big money. When does money factor into the equation if at all? You can't buy one of these "copies" for meager money. You'd better come to the party with a shed load of cash or you'll not get past the door.
I own a CAV and it wasn't cheap...but money is always a relative term. What wasn't cheap for me might be a pittance to others on this forum. Does money play a roll in quietening the person asking the question...is that a kit car. My response might be "Do you think paying "X" amount makes this a kit car?"

 

[Dalton Veitch]

A really inexhaustible topic. But there is no satisfactory definition. There are many categories, ranging from a box with all the brand new bits to completely assemble a car, to something using scrounged parts except where a new body was needed. Many grey areas in between. I think it is more accurate to describe the end product with a better, slightly longer descriptor, covering the "limited model production", etc. as suggested above as an example. "Kit Car" seems belittling in many ways, and I don't like the term in connection with the high quality products people on this forum are driving and/or working on.

 

[David Sturch]

Dalton,
I think most race cars fall in the LMP category. Even the high end road exotic's. They skirt the MVSS (Motor Vehicle Safety Standard) crash testing by producing less than a thousand proto-types.
All the F1 manufacturing teams build limited cars to F1-FIA spec's and parameter's for engineering and safety with their own designs in house for the racing season. They are Branded (Trade Marked)
My term for kitting reffered reproducing your own design or someone elses, parts on a small scale for assembly. It was basicly an old automotive term for stock kitting of parts for sub assembly. Hence the Kit Car moniker.
Dave

 

[Bill Hara]

All valid, except that as Dalton said the term "kit car" has a negative connotation, especially when used by the uninformed.
For that reason, I don't believe the GT40 replica regardless of producer should attract a negative term like "Kit car".....
Now REPLICA is a much nicer term that seems to echo the prestige and expense of the original vehicle.
I once responded this way to the kit car question and was told "hey man, they're all just words" My reply was "yeah, ignorant f##kwit are just words too"

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

I guess what really bothered me about the "kit car" label or people asking if my Kirkham was "real", was the fact that Shelby is using the same car for his continuation series! I had o lot more into my car than the continuation 427 Shelby. I think part of the reason I sold the car was my dislike of Shelby as a person. And if you want to call what we make a kit car, then I guess you could call the original Shelby cobra a kit car. It was a bunch of aftermarket parts stuffed into a AC Bristol.

 

[Allen English]

I guess what really bothered me about the "kit car" label or people asking if my Kirkham was "real", was the fact that Shelby is using the same car for his continuation series! I had o lot more into my car than the continuation 427 Shelby. I think part of the reason I sold the car was my dislike of Shelby as a person. And if you want to call what we make a kit car, then I guess you could call the original Shelby cobra a kit car. It was a bunch of aftermarket parts stuffed into a AC Bristol.

Soooo does this mean the old fart can go after us if we call our cars kit car?:dead:

The AC Cobra the original kit car :laugh:

 

[Al Wohlstrom]

Soooo does this mean the old fart can go after us if we call our cars kit car?:dead:

The AC Cobra the original kit car :laugh:

He goes after people for breathing, he's a sue happy obnoxous old fart!

 

[Doug S.]

He goes after people for breathing, he's a sue happy obnoxous old fart!

Once again, Al, you and I are in total agreement :shocked: !

Doug

 

[Jim Craik]

Just a thought,

I know they are not all available and even if they were the cost would be prohibitive but, suppose you went to Ford and bought all the parts to make a 1965 Mustang and assembled them, what would you have?

Would it be a 1965 Mustang? None of the parts ever saw the 60s'.

If its not a 1965 Mustang then what is it?

 

[Dave P]

Building from scratch I have even been asked who's kit did you buy!

I must admit it does ruffle my feathers a bit.

 

[Doug S.]

Dave, I've followed the custom assembled replica market for over 40 years and until I joined this forum a few years ago I had no idea people built from scratch (except for the occasional one-off or prototype). It really is an esoteric niche, and considering how incredible the average Joe must think the GT40 is, to even conceptualize that one could be built by anyone using their own ingenuity is not at all incomprehensible to me. I assure you that if I had asked anyone that question (and I have!! :shy: ), it would absolutely have been with no harm meant, it would have been strictly an indication of my own ignorance (which, thankfully, is different from stupidity :happy: ).

An honest mistake, to be sure!

Doug

 

[Dave P]

Doug: You are right and I understand. Most people can not believe someone would try a scratch build.
Truthfully my Idea of a Kit car is one that converts say a VW or a fiero to a Aston martin or lambo look a like.