Irish referendum
- Thread starter gtbob
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In that event, then, so is The Word of God. And, given the implied choice, I'd faaaaaaaaaaar rather be on "the wrong side of history", sir.
Wuv you, Doc... :nice:
I have. Have you? (Leviticus 20:13 for starters?)
:nice:(The above scripture is from memory...'deals with man lying with man as with a woman...I think. 'Hope I've recalled it correctly! But, then again, that's "Old Testament"...innit...
)
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I agree, based on personal experience...to a degree. Quite some time ago I had an opinion changing experience. I started seeing a single mother with 3 children still at home. We had a rather intense but short relationship. Her youngest child was ten years old so when she told me she hadn't been with a man for ten years I figured she had just taken some time off from relationships. WRONG!! She meant she had just not been seeing men. As you can imagine, the relationship ended quickly, but not before I decided that notwithstanding her same-gender attractions, she was a delightful person and as deserving of happiness as the next person. I am now in favor of legalizing same-sex marriage, even though I admit to being homophobic. Like you said, Jimbo...the thought of any romantic contact with another man is abhorrent to me, but if those who feel differently would like to formalize their relationship with a marriage ceremony it's no skin off my nose.
Our society changes so quickly...it won't be long before the strict "fundamentalists" are a long-lost breed. The winds of change, they are a-blowin', and the inconceivable will inevitably become the norm.
Our own children will see to that.
Doug
Larry the bible has lost something in the translation. Its probably written by those traveling on the other bus Leviticus 20:13 - Hope Remains: Homosexuality and the Bible.
Last paragraph
This is the correct translation of Leviticus 20:13. It can be seen that, rather than forbidding male homosexuality, it simply forbids two males to lie down in a woman’s bed, for whatever reason. Culturally, a woman's bed was her own. Other than the woman herself, only her husband was permitted in her bed, and there were even restrictions on when he was allowed in there. Any other use of her bed would have been considered defilement. Other verses in the Law will help clarify the acceptable use of the woman's bed. (Lev. 15.)
And a bit more
http://hoperemains.webs.com/samesexmarriage.htm
Bob
Last paragraph
This is the correct translation of Leviticus 20:13. It can be seen that, rather than forbidding male homosexuality, it simply forbids two males to lie down in a woman’s bed, for whatever reason. Culturally, a woman's bed was her own. Other than the woman herself, only her husband was permitted in her bed, and there were even restrictions on when he was allowed in there. Any other use of her bed would have been considered defilement. Other verses in the Law will help clarify the acceptable use of the woman's bed. (Lev. 15.)
And a bit more
http://hoperemains.webs.com/samesexmarriage.htm
Bob
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
It is worth thinking about that all your reference material is rather old, Larry, and evidently some of it mistranslated. Here's a better take on this all: No one in the gay marriage movement is advocating someone marrying an animal, or marrying multiple partners, all of which I think you implied. Civil unions don't confer all the benefits of marriage, or none of this would be an issue.
Although I have gay family members and friends, I'm not gay. I don't pretend to understand how they feel, but there are a lot of things in the world that I don't understand. What I DON'T do is that I don't judge the things I don't understand, and I don't root around in texts of antiquity to find justification for dumping on things I don't like. My view of the entire gay marriage thing is that it's about child-raising, and my gay friends tell me the same thing. Anything that provides more stable homes for kids I consider beneficial to them to to society as well.
Essentially the debate is already over on this, Larry. So you have a choice- declare it irrelevant to you and stop worrying about it, or keep fussing about it and slide backwards into oblivion along with everyone else who thinks there's still a discussion going on. My view is that the discussion really ended a while back. Time to argue about more important stuff.
As far as politicians, they'll whore themselves out to anyone who votes. Because the tide of public opinion has shifted on this, with most Americans in favor of it, the GOP is climbing on the wagon along with everyone else- just like they are with the immigration question. All politicians care about is donors and votes- which works out nicely since they need donors to buy votes.
I don't understand being gay any more than I do parachute jumping, something else I have no desire to do. As long as no one puts a gun to my head and tells me to marry another man or jump out of an airplane, I'm good. If someone else wants to do it, fine.
Although I have gay family members and friends, I'm not gay. I don't pretend to understand how they feel, but there are a lot of things in the world that I don't understand. What I DON'T do is that I don't judge the things I don't understand, and I don't root around in texts of antiquity to find justification for dumping on things I don't like. My view of the entire gay marriage thing is that it's about child-raising, and my gay friends tell me the same thing. Anything that provides more stable homes for kids I consider beneficial to them to to society as well.
Essentially the debate is already over on this, Larry. So you have a choice- declare it irrelevant to you and stop worrying about it, or keep fussing about it and slide backwards into oblivion along with everyone else who thinks there's still a discussion going on. My view is that the discussion really ended a while back. Time to argue about more important stuff.
As far as politicians, they'll whore themselves out to anyone who votes. Because the tide of public opinion has shifted on this, with most Americans in favor of it, the GOP is climbing on the wagon along with everyone else- just like they are with the immigration question. All politicians care about is donors and votes- which works out nicely since they need donors to buy votes.
I don't understand being gay any more than I do parachute jumping, something else I have no desire to do. As long as no one puts a gun to my head and tells me to marry another man or jump out of an airplane, I'm good. If someone else wants to do it, fine.
Bob/Jim,
In the end it all boils down to one's core beliefs, doesn' it, guys.
In your case, Doc, I would assume (being Jewish) you don't believe Jesus is the Messiah/Son of God? 'Not going to change the mind of anyone who holds strong beliefs on either side of that 'argument' either, right? 'See what I mean? Who translated what HOW means diddley.
It's the same thing when 'debating' things like "(The Founders) didn't anticipate that guns would ever progress past muzzle-loaders." I contend they DID. That's why they used the word "arms" instead of muzzle-loaders. They obviously wanted "the people" to be able to "keep and bear" whatever "arms" might come down the pike later.
I think we've sufficiently beaten all this to death at this point...no?
In the end it all boils down to one's core beliefs, doesn' it, guys.
In your case, Doc, I would assume (being Jewish) you don't believe Jesus is the Messiah/Son of God? 'Not going to change the mind of anyone who holds strong beliefs on either side of that 'argument' either, right? 'See what I mean? Who translated what HOW means diddley.
It's the same thing when 'debating' things like "(The Founders) didn't anticipate that guns would ever progress past muzzle-loaders." I contend they DID. That's why they used the word "arms" instead of muzzle-loaders. They obviously wanted "the people" to be able to "keep and bear" whatever "arms" might come down the pike later.
I think we've sufficiently beaten all this to death at this point...no?
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Well lads I thought I'd better come out as they say.
I'm a lesbian! Yep I've seen what they do and I do all of that.
Seriously though I don't give a shit what people do in private to each other as long as it doesn't hurt anyone. And then if they want to go through a ceremony they call marriage who cares?
However marriage may lead to wanting to adopt a child and I have serious doubts about that, as I believe a child should have a Mother as well as a father.
I'm a lesbian! Yep I've seen what they do and I do all of that.
Seriously though I don't give a shit what people do in private to each other as long as it doesn't hurt anyone. And then if they want to go through a ceremony they call marriage who cares?
However marriage may lead to wanting to adopt a child and I have serious doubts about that, as I believe a child should have a Mother as well as a father.
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
How about two mothers?
Me, I'm a lesbian, too. Glad I figured that one out.
Me, I'm a lesbian, too. Glad I figured that one out.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Jim, I feel the same about two mothers, IMHO ideally a child should have the input of a Father and a Mother. I guess that makes me old fashioned.
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
Oh, it'll probably happen anyway, Your Woggship. You'll go to the chemist's and next thing you know you'll be set upon by men in burkas.
Well...just like I said (on this site as well as others) would be the case if gay marriage were legalized...heeeeeeeere we go:
Polygamous Montana trio applies for wedding license | Fox News
...and they'll WIN because of the "equal protection clause". I doubt even Emperor Roberts' Supreme Court will be able to find a way to 'B.S.' and 'slither' its way around it.
You may laugh, but, Ziggy and his goat could very well be the next to file.
I'll say it again: This isn't going to stop with gays.
Polygamous Montana trio applies for wedding license | Fox News
...and they'll WIN because of the "equal protection clause". I doubt even Emperor Roberts' Supreme Court will be able to find a way to 'B.S.' and 'slither' its way around it.
You may laugh, but, Ziggy and his goat could very well be the next to file.
I'll say it again: This isn't going to stop with gays.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Boom Boom
For those who haven't heard, Washington State recently passed two laws.
They legalized gay marriage and legalized marijuana.
The fact that gay marriage and marijuana were legalized on the same day makes perfect Biblical sense.
Leviticus 20:13 says: "If a man lies with another man they should be stoned."
Apparently we just hadn't interpreted it correctly before!
Just saying :lipsrsealed:
Bob
They legalized gay marriage and legalized marijuana.
The fact that gay marriage and marijuana were legalized on the same day makes perfect Biblical sense.
Leviticus 20:13 says: "If a man lies with another man they should be stoned."
Apparently we just hadn't interpreted it correctly before!
Just saying :lipsrsealed:
Bob
Charlie Farley
Supporter
Dried up ' old fruits ' do nothing for me... except make me regular.
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