Steering Play - whats normal/excessive

[Dan Carter]

Gents

I have the Oldsmobile unit in the SLC and I seem to have more play in the steering then I would expect. Not sure how much is "normal". It appears the two universal joints have a lot of play and even though they are tight on the steering shaft and column shaft the universals move up and down the steering and steering rack input shafts about 1/8 inch. They wont fall off, just not sure.

The steering wheel moves about 1/4 to 3/8 inches prior to the steering actually engaging. This just seem like to much play. Has anyone else encountered an excessive amount of play in the wheel and is there a recommended solution to get rid it?

Thanks

 

[Cam]

Something sounds wrong - there should be zero play. Any kind of play would mean your car would be wandering if the wheel were held straight. Start at your steering wheel and move down towards your rack. Whatever has play between two components means one of those has an issue.

 

[Randy V]

Any movement in the shaft other than rotational will manifest itself in play in the steering. On a road car, that would be considered tight as I have commonly seen an inch in many cars..

 

[Cam]

Sounds to me like the universals need some type of set screw to prevent this slop.

Dan - is there zero resistance back and forth in the wheel or do you mean you're able to rotate the steering wheel by that amount before the wheels physically move, but there is a good amount of resistance at all times?

 

[Cam]

This is a bimmer board but what's interesting here is one of the posters measured free play on multiple cars, I'll paste it below but the OP fixed his free play issue by tightening down on a set screw in the universal.

Quick question on steering wheel play...
"
Car stationary, I have 6mm movement on the rim of the steering wheel before the road wheels (measured at the road wheel rim with a dial gauge) move at all with engine on or off. Checked out other cars too:

Ford Focus ’05: 2mm (hydraulic PAS)
Honda Integra DC5: 0 mm (hydraulic PAS) (FANTASTIC steering in all respects)
E90 325i 2009: <1mm (electric? PAS)
325d 2009: <1mm (electric PAS)
118d 2009: <1mm (electric PAS)
E91 318i 2007: 0mm (hydraulic PAS)
"
On my old mustang I recall upgrading to a flaming river universal joint steering shaft which deleted the rubber damper between the universals. This was a dramatic improvement in road feel.

A certain amount of squishiness/play in the wheel is normal for road cars but there shouldn't be any dead movement where the wheel can bounce back and forth with zero resistance.

Yes, squishiness is a technical term

 

[PeteB]

I've got about 1/4" play in mine. It seems to be in the joints in the column. More play than my Cobra had for sure.

 

[Alex]

Grow a sack and toss the power unit and use a manual steering column (i.e., hollow DD tube). 0 play here, nice and solid :thumbsup:

 

[Dan Carter]

To add some clarification about my steering column.

It is 100% manual. The steering column itself has zero play in it. Once the u joints are hooked up (double D) style, the steering wheel will move about 1/4 or more in either direction before transfering any rotation to the steering box unit shaft.

The universals have a bolt which slides over a slot in the Double D rod to prevent it from slipping out of the u joint slot. The rotation moment of the shaft on the u joint seems to be minor, but it is not zero. There are four unions in the two u joints so I believe the total 1/4 movement in the steering wheel must be the combination of tolerances from the four slots in the u joints with the D shaft and the slotted end on the steering box shaft.

I presume that there is some torque value that the bolts in the u joint must have to squeeze the u joint slit to eliminate the rotational moment of the D shaft. This particular u joint does not have a set screw to eliminate any shaft movement.

The bolts are labeled 12.9 and it appears the u joints are stainless and rather thick. I can obviously start applying torque to see if this theory works, but someone must have already solved this........anyone?:idea:

 

[Cam]

Dan - the new online manual has some references to the pinch bolts at the universals and there's some pretty strong language about ensuring they are secured and safety wired (steering column safety section). I would try going a smidge more than wrist tight on these to see if that knocks down the free play you're seeing. If yes, keep going.

Not sure this is good advice but for a non structural bolt like this I would go "good-n-tite" for torque level if there isn't a comparable bolt somewhere else in the chassis with a torque callout. It sounds like the bolt and components are relatively beefy so you're not likely to yield anything by this method. I'd recommend loctite at a minimum.

I've been thumbing through the build manual and it doesn't seem to me very many of the bolts on this car are high strength/torque to yield type bolts. Seems they're all over spec'd and the good-n-tite torque is probably good for a majority of locations (use some discretion based on location). Other than engine related components you're probably 90% covered using rule of thumb torque values based on thread size.

 

[Dan Carter]

Sometimes the answer is staring you right in the face and you just cant see it......so
I am going to put this one to bed for all future builders. If you receive the U joints seen in the picture and like I did, and discover play in the steering wheel, you can isolate it to the U joints. The key to remove the play is to tighten the 4 bolts in the U joints with sufficient torque to squeeze/pinch the U joint onto the double D shaft, the end of the steering column and the steering shaft. The bolts are cap screws embedded into a hole so putting a safety wire is pretty much impractical so red stuff or blue stuff seems the best option. Once I "pinched it tight" the play went to zero (seems the theory that a little play at each point add ups, is true)...all's good now.