Hi, Pete!
While I do sometimes think of my self as left-wing, I do not advocate apologizing for the torturous techniques in which the U.S. engaged at Gitmo...and for much the same reason you mentioned, that those in ISIS would commit tasks far beyond the egregious nature of those committed at Gitmo.
My point is that we should have never used torture. I understand Larry's comment regarding drone strikes killing innocent women and children...but in any war that is going to be the case. However, IIRC there is a thing called the Geneva Convention that defines how prisoners must be treated (not that ISIS is a signatory, of course they were never around when the document was created), and torture was not, AFAIK, ever one of the recommended interrogation techniques.
What we really ought to do is declare war on these assholes...then appoint David Morton to direct the strikes. Two nukes dropped on Japan ended WWII, perhaps David could direct a few toward ISIS and demonstrate what they have in store if they continue. At that point our actions would be an act of war and the issue of "collateral damage" would not be an issue, although I do believe that any honorable military entity would do what they could to avoid unnecessary casualties involving women and children. Unfortunately, ISIS isn't a "country", so to speak, so it's difficult to declare war against them, but Howard had a great idea...inform all governments that should they harbor ISIS and facilitate their acts of terrorism, they will become targets for our wrath. We might NEED to declare war against multiple countries, in fact I can't see how that could be avoided. In my mind I compare ISIS with the Nazis....and that is the reason I so despise the fact that the U.S. has used torture techniques, because in my mind that puts us at the gunwale of the same boat in which I place the Nazis.
In my mind, the answer was one of our options...try those detainees in military courts of law and if found guilty execute them. At least then they would have been offered a trial, which is something I can't say I believe that those beheaded by ISIS were given. Why we did not choose that option is a mystery to me...although one of the reasons I think Gee-Dub authorized the torture of the detainees was that he viewed them as possible sources of information. IMHO that was a wrong assumption, and just because one of his advisors told him what he WANTED to hear, that the techniques used at Gitmo did not rise to the level of torture, does not make it so. Gee-Dub should have used better discretion, and his failure to do so IMHO should have led to him being tried as a war criminal. There is still time...think of how long we have searched out the Nazi leadership in their hiding places throughout the world, and when we find them we put them on trial. Will Bush suffer the same treatment? I think not, but in my mind there is SOME level of belief that Bush authorized actions bordering on those adopted by the Nazis during WWII, and for that I am ashamed for our country...and proud of Obama for having stopped it.
But....apologize to ISIS.....HELL NO!!!!!
Doug
While I do sometimes think of my self as left-wing, I do not advocate apologizing for the torturous techniques in which the U.S. engaged at Gitmo...and for much the same reason you mentioned, that those in ISIS would commit tasks far beyond the egregious nature of those committed at Gitmo.
My point is that we should have never used torture. I understand Larry's comment regarding drone strikes killing innocent women and children...but in any war that is going to be the case. However, IIRC there is a thing called the Geneva Convention that defines how prisoners must be treated (not that ISIS is a signatory, of course they were never around when the document was created), and torture was not, AFAIK, ever one of the recommended interrogation techniques.
What we really ought to do is declare war on these assholes...then appoint David Morton to direct the strikes. Two nukes dropped on Japan ended WWII, perhaps David could direct a few toward ISIS and demonstrate what they have in store if they continue. At that point our actions would be an act of war and the issue of "collateral damage" would not be an issue, although I do believe that any honorable military entity would do what they could to avoid unnecessary casualties involving women and children. Unfortunately, ISIS isn't a "country", so to speak, so it's difficult to declare war against them, but Howard had a great idea...inform all governments that should they harbor ISIS and facilitate their acts of terrorism, they will become targets for our wrath. We might NEED to declare war against multiple countries, in fact I can't see how that could be avoided. In my mind I compare ISIS with the Nazis....and that is the reason I so despise the fact that the U.S. has used torture techniques, because in my mind that puts us at the gunwale of the same boat in which I place the Nazis.
In my mind, the answer was one of our options...try those detainees in military courts of law and if found guilty execute them. At least then they would have been offered a trial, which is something I can't say I believe that those beheaded by ISIS were given. Why we did not choose that option is a mystery to me...although one of the reasons I think Gee-Dub authorized the torture of the detainees was that he viewed them as possible sources of information. IMHO that was a wrong assumption, and just because one of his advisors told him what he WANTED to hear, that the techniques used at Gitmo did not rise to the level of torture, does not make it so. Gee-Dub should have used better discretion, and his failure to do so IMHO should have led to him being tried as a war criminal. There is still time...think of how long we have searched out the Nazi leadership in their hiding places throughout the world, and when we find them we put them on trial. Will Bush suffer the same treatment? I think not, but in my mind there is SOME level of belief that Bush authorized actions bordering on those adopted by the Nazis during WWII, and for that I am ashamed for our country...and proud of Obama for having stopped it.
But....apologize to ISIS.....HELL NO!!!!!
Doug
