The American National Anthem

[Tom P]

I think Veek is correct, I've had my quota of acid. Bye

 

[Jim Craik]

So Tom,

Let me see if I understand the progression here.

In the thread about the Royal Wedding, Graham mentioned that he was not fond of their National Antham.

I then said that I liked it very much, and went on to say that our's "sucks", it's hard to sing and not a Very nice tune.

Tom then said that I was un-patriotic and hated America! A load of crap! But then disagreeing with concervaties automatically makes you un-American, right?

Tom then started this thread with a patriotic history lesson, covering the story behind our Anthem, conveiniently leaving out the part about the tune being an old British drinking song.

After several folks here pointed this out, and informed him that just not liking a song does not make you un-patriotic.

He has taken his patriotism and gone home!

 

[Jim Craik]

Tom,

You started this disagreement by out of the blue, bravely questioning my patriotism because I do not like a tune.

You can dish it out, but you can not take it!

I see that Tom who has a unique ability to judge others patriatism, has now confirmed his own by replacing his Mexican flag with the Stars And Stripes.

Tom, please tell us about Betsy Ross

 

[Jac Mac]

This paddock is no different from most others, once you remove all the animals the paddock is still covered in shit, takes a while for nature to do its bit & convert that into grass before all the animals come back to repeat the process !!

 

[Jim Craik]

Jac Mac,

I know this can be tedious, but what would your reaction be to someone questioning your patriotism because you do not like an Anthem or Flag?

 

[Tom P]

Jac Mac,

I know this can be tedious, but what would your reaction be to someone questioning your patriotism because you do not like an Anthem or Flag?

You don't like the flag either? Why stay in a country that's so distasteful to you? Maybe BO can change everything and make you happy. That's what he's all about, hope and change. What a joke!

 

[Jim Craik]

Tom, more big talk about flags from someone flying the Mexican Flag.

Your paranoia is showing, you see commies under the bed.

Tom, I was talking to JacMac, had you been paying attention, you would know that he is from New Zeland, they are having a discussion about THEIR flag.

 

[Jim Craik]

Tom,

You still have not answered the question....

Graham said the he does not care for their Anthem, God Save the Queen. Does that mean that he is un-British and that he hates Brittan?

 

[Graham]

You make things difficult by overthinking. People who like or dislike Obama are different just for that reason, in their "likes" and "dislikes". Nothing arrogant about it.

Tom,

I think you'll find that "overthinking" is always better than underthinking...

Look over my previous posts on just about any topic. I always try to take the crap out of a discussion, and create a reasoned debate (where possible). Your statement was one of haughty prejudice - not conducive to reasoned debate.

Oh, and you still haven't anwered Jim's question. it was, after all, a point that he made about my statement that set you off.

just because a man doesn't like his national anthem, it doesn't stop him from being a patriot. it simply means that he doesn't like his national anthem...

repeat after me, Tom.... " I don't have to follow the crowd to be a patriot. I am allowed to dig my own groove without being a non-believer"....

 

[Jim Craik]

(quote) I am patriotic because it's something I believe in, sure I question what goes on in this country, but I believe in the concepts that brought our country about. Posted by Tom

Your saying that you are patriodic and that's why you think the National Anthem is sacrosanct and

MUST BE LOVED!!

This song was not even written until 1814, many years after our country came about. Additionally it did not become our Anthem until 1931. Hardly a song blessed by the founding fathers.

But Tom, here are some "concepts that brought our country about":

Women and Blacks can't vote, and slavery is OK. Are these also sacrosanct? Or do you pick and choose your patriotic concepts.

 

[Jim Craik]

Thanks Graham


The United States is a wonderful Country. It has a long history of wonderful songs and song writers. I just feel that we should have a beautiful, well written Anthem that all would be proud to sing.

 

[Tom P]

Thanks Graham


The United States is a wonderful Country. It has a long history of wonderful songs and song writers. I just feel that we should have a beautiful, well written Anthem that all would be proud to sing.

Thankfully most of us are proud to sing the National Anthem, and we like our flag.

 

[Nick]

Oxford dictonaries online (because we invented the bloody language)

Definition of patriotic : having or expressing devotion to and vigorous support for one's country:

Nothing about having to express devotion of have vigorous support for a flag or a song.

 

[Jim Craik]

Tom,

I see from your post that you "like" our Flag. Do you like it as much as you like the Mexican Flag?

Tom you may just get in trouble with the "Toms" of the world, because according to you the Flag must be not just liked, but LOVED!

By the way, I am very proud to sing our National Anthem, I just wish Mr Key had picked a better tune. You may love the old British drinking song, but I find it hard to sing.

 

[Jack]

Hi Jim,
For one, I do not question your loyalty. Look to any major sporting event and you can hear several bastardizations of our Anthem! I happen to like it anyway!

 

[Jim Craik]

Thanks, Molleur

Professional singers say it is one of the hardest songs to get right. Next time you are in the shower, give it a try, you'll see.

 

[Jim Craik]

So what was the United States of America's national anthem twixt 1814 and 1931?<!-- google_ad_section_end --> <!-- google_ad_section_start(weight=ignore) -->

Posted by JimmyMac

Jimmy, thats a good question, I Googled it, and they say that for a while at State functions it was "Hail Columbia" and later "My Country Tis-Of-Thee" which ironically is the same tune as "God Save The Queen".

 

[Jason]

Posted by JimmyMac

Jimmy, thats a good question, I Googled it, and they say that for a while at State functions it was "Hail Columbia" and later "My Country Tis-Of-Thee" which ironically is the same tune as "God Save The Queen".

The tune to God Save the Queen is interestingly called "America"

 

[Tom P]

Oxford dictonaries online (because we invented the bloody language)

Definition of patriotic : having or expressing devotion to and vigorous support for one's country:

Nothing about having to express devotion of have vigorous support for a flag or a song.

I believe that the National Anthem and American Flag are part of ones
"vigorous support for one's country"

 

[Jim Craik]

The tune to God Save the Queen is interestingly called "America"<!-- google_ad_section_end -->

Posted by Jason,

Really? I did not know that. Our two Countries are strangly intertwined.

By the way Jason, I really liked your post from yesterday:

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel

by which I mean defending something just because you are told it's correct to do so without actually bothering to question it and figure it out for yourself produces ignorant bigotry rather than intelligent reasoned argument.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->

Very nice, and as this thread shows, oh so true!