Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Err Jim, it may be he has you on ignore.:stunned:
But obviously one reason is they have no guns.
WTF?
- Thread starter Keith1
- Start date
Err Jim, it may be he has you on ignore.:stunned:
But obviously one reason is they have no guns.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Pete, he has quoted me and asked me questions................
**********************
Pete, yes they have no guns, but they have had similar violence with knives.
In 2004, 37-year-old former janitor Mamoru Takuma entered the school armed with a kitchen knife and began stabbing numerous school children and teachers. He killed eight children, mostly between the ages of seven and eight, and seriously wounded thirteen other children and two teachers.[2]
This was an equally vicious attack, with a similar number of victims, but he only had a knife, the death toll was 1/3rd of our most recent attrocity.
What was the differance?.............He did not have a gun!
Unfortunatlly these things do happen, why make it easier to kill more and more!
**********************
Pete, yes they have no guns, but they have had similar violence with knives.
In 2004, 37-year-old former janitor Mamoru Takuma entered the school armed with a kitchen knife and began stabbing numerous school children and teachers. He killed eight children, mostly between the ages of seven and eight, and seriously wounded thirteen other children and two teachers.[2]
This was an equally vicious attack, with a similar number of victims, but he only had a knife, the death toll was 1/3rd of our most recent attrocity.
What was the differance?.............He did not have a gun!
Unfortunatlly these things do happen, why make it easier to kill more and more!
Last edited:
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Well Dave, Kennesaw's crime rate is much lower
then the national average.
Have a look here. Kennesaw Crime Statistics: Georgia (GA) - CityRating.com
Violent crime is far less than the National average and far less the the average for Georgia.
Last edited:
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
So if we continue your logic should Japan now also ban knives. They use chop
sticks to eat and knives kill people?
None of these situations are "like for like" and I do not believe they can be compared to reinforce a particular point of view, because that skates around the main issues:
Guns are a fact of life - they are here to stay.
The proliferation of guns is part of the problem.
The care and security of guns in the home is part of the problem.
Poverty and social detachment is part of the problem.
The main issues, to me at least, are the propensity of certain people to use them and the exposure to the concept of extreme violence via media from an early age where guns are seen to be the big equaliser or force multiplier.
May I cite a specific and prolific scenario from just about any movie?
Two guys are fighting. One has a gun and drops it. They continue fighting but now the fight has shifted from a personal battle to a battle to get to the gun first. The fight continues in that vein until one or other has the gun and the fight either stops through a gunshot, or the immediate surrender of the non weapon holder.
"So what?" In this seemingly innocent & common scenario the key element is the subliminal message that the gun has to be acquired to finish the job. The gun is key. The gun is the answer, never mind they could batter each other senseless with their fists.
Repeat these subliminal messages enough and you have a deep rooted and unrecognised addiction to the point that you could not imagine life without a weapon.
I believe this has been an interesting debate and unusually civil in the main although the usual suspects in the to-be-expected hectoring style that will be the death of this forum have chimed in with their 1 cent.
The death of our children and violence in particular is a problem that affects us all, and, as usual, the answer lies with us all, not a lump of cold steel.
Guns are a fact of life - they are here to stay.
The proliferation of guns is part of the problem.
The care and security of guns in the home is part of the problem.
Poverty and social detachment is part of the problem.
The main issues, to me at least, are the propensity of certain people to use them and the exposure to the concept of extreme violence via media from an early age where guns are seen to be the big equaliser or force multiplier.
May I cite a specific and prolific scenario from just about any movie?
Two guys are fighting. One has a gun and drops it. They continue fighting but now the fight has shifted from a personal battle to a battle to get to the gun first. The fight continues in that vein until one or other has the gun and the fight either stops through a gunshot, or the immediate surrender of the non weapon holder.
"So what?" In this seemingly innocent & common scenario the key element is the subliminal message that the gun has to be acquired to finish the job. The gun is key. The gun is the answer, never mind they could batter each other senseless with their fists.
Repeat these subliminal messages enough and you have a deep rooted and unrecognised addiction to the point that you could not imagine life without a weapon.
I believe this has been an interesting debate and unusually civil in the main although the usual suspects in the to-be-expected hectoring style that will be the death of this forum have chimed in with their 1 cent.
The death of our children and violence in particular is a problem that affects us all, and, as usual, the answer lies with us all, not a lump of cold steel.
Pete
Lifetime Supporter
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Pete,
So you have joined the straw man gang. We have had folkes here try and deflect gun murders by saying we should also ban:
Cars
Trucks
Curbs
Diesel fuel
Doctors
Fertilizer
Alcohol..............................
Because they also kill people.
Now its knives?
Pete, this is fairly simple, all those things have are not designed to kill, all those things when used as intended have a peaceful and positive use. 99.99% of the time they are used as designed and have a positive effect on humanity.
Guns are designed to kill and intimidate, when used as designed, they kill and intimadate!
Last edited:
Would one of our Austrailian members do me a favor and check the most recent gun related crimes over there. It has been reported that since the ban GUN CRIME HAS SCKYROCKETED AND THE POLICY IS A FAILURE!!!!! Problem is that only the criminals have them and thus the increase. I'm not starting crap it has been all over the news and I would like to hear from anyone that lives there. BTW wasn't the ban only on assault rifles.
http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp
http://dailycaller.com/2011/01/19/america-dont-repeat-australias-gun-control-mistake/
This was just after a quick google search but if true some on here that used the land from down under shure have some egg on their face!!!!\
Now to make fun of the IDIOTIC congress woman who said that assault rifles were meant to kill at "close range" and there for should be banned. UMMMMMM what the hell were hand guns created for then. Can anyone say MORON!!!! Yep she was a democrat!!!!!!! Those of us in the U.S. have seen her mug all over the TV as of late
http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp
http://dailycaller.com/2011/01/19/america-dont-repeat-australias-gun-control-mistake/
This was just after a quick google search but if true some on here that used the land from down under shure have some egg on their face!!!!\
Now to make fun of the IDIOTIC congress woman who said that assault rifles were meant to kill at "close range" and there for should be banned. UMMMMMM what the hell were hand guns created for then. Can anyone say MORON!!!! Yep she was a democrat!!!!!!! Those of us in the U.S. have seen her mug all over the TV as of late
I did not answer for two very good reasons.
1. You never ask questions - you make statements disguised as questions. It is an immature method of debating.
2. If you bothered to read posts properly, you will see that I posited the same theory many posts back, both on this thread and the "right to bear arms thread" so no answer is needed as I already gave one.
I see this is all turning out like all the other "political" threads - a Liberal/Conservative/Left/Right Gob Fest. In the meantime people are still dying.
If I was Jim Crack I would ask: "How's that working for you?"
I don't condemn you if you don't care. Not everybody is capable of caring - usually about anything outside their four walls or their own sphere of influence.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Jim, I was trying to point out that your logic may be a tad flawed. Banning an object even one designed to kill is not the answer. Btw some knives are designed to kill.
The answer is to change the mind set of the people. I'm old enough to remember a time when one could have a fist fight and when a person was knocked down, that would be the end of it. Imagine that happening today?
I think not.
The disciplines of life, respect for others as well as the elderly have been eroded
By successive generations of no discipline. The Japanese culture has been mentioned, they display today the respect for others and the self discipline
That our society had four generations ago, but it is sadly lacking today.
I know I'm sounding like an old white guy, well guess what? That is exactly what I am.
Banning guns won't happen in America in our life time, better you start working at bringing back respect for others and self discipline into your society.
Sorry Mr Crake - it's word blindnes.
Apologies Randy - you are quite correct. I think I'll put the problem back on ignore.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Pete,
Fair enough,
I agree, unfortunally guns will most likely not be banned in my lifetime. Assault weapons(designed to kill lots, quickly) hopefully will, just my opinion.
Yes, there may have been a time when a fight could end with a knock down. Today, you would most likely have a felony arrest, possably gun fire or both.
Yes, today the Japanese people do display an unusual anount of self control, but then they banned and carefully collected virtually all guns in 1945. It seems to be working for them.
You are wrong Jim. Guns are designed to fire a projectile of a specific caliber. Nothing more. It is up to the user how they will be pointed...just as in the case of a knife.
You always fail to mention how many instances where they are used to save a life or prevent a violent crime. Imagine if you will a 105lb women against a 225lb man. Without a gun, well, it's pretty much a foregone conclusion. It has been pointed out here that over 2 million violent crimes are prevented in the US each year by law abiding citizens using a gun but you refuse to care about them in order to push your agenda. I truly believe you would have rather seen 100s of thousands more accosted and worse just to take the guns away.
Jim I REFUSE to believe that you are as stupid as you are coming off so in an attempt to help me clarify are you actually saying this "Assault weapons(designed to kill lots, quickly)". Assault weapons are designed to land a projectile at a distance greater than the range of a hand gun. Killing isn't the issue. Again the .223 round (AR15 in question) was designed (well one of the MANY factors) NOT TO KILL BUT MAME. What I mean is that a military round is designed NOT TO KILL BUT HURT. It works like this. Shoot and kill a man he is out of the fight period. Shoot and hurt a man and two have to carry him back to safety taking three men out of th fight with one bullet. I keep asking and now begging you to either admit you have no clue what you are talking about and ask those of us that do for information or just stay out so that others don't jump all over you. If you have me on the ignore list than would someone please relay this information to him.
A second question is if you honestly think that asault guns were designed to kill lots of people as quickly as possible and that's your reason to ban them well then sir what about a hand gun. Under your stance a hand gun is designed to kill many as many people as possible JUST LIKE AN ASSAULT RIFLE BUT AT CLOSE RANGE SO YOUR ARGUMENT WOULD ALSO BAN HAND GUNS!!!!!!!! PLEASE educate yourself about the topic as you usualy come at us with a little more insight that you are showing.
A second question is if you honestly think that asault guns were designed to kill lots of people as quickly as possible and that's your reason to ban them well then sir what about a hand gun. Under your stance a hand gun is designed to kill many as many people as possible JUST LIKE AN ASSAULT RIFLE BUT AT CLOSE RANGE SO YOUR ARGUMENT WOULD ALSO BAN HAND GUNS!!!!!!!! PLEASE educate yourself about the topic as you usualy come at us with a little more insight that you are showing.
Last edited:
Chris Kouba
Supporter
Well said Mark. If that happened, maybe the Paddock would go back to what it was when I joined the forum: an interesting place to talk about interesting, non-car related topics instead of the shitstorm it has become.
Do people really think they're going to change each others' long standing opinions by typing some stuff on the web?
I frequent the forum much less than I did when I joined (even since my build started) and I guess I'll just go back to skipping out of the Paddock. I check in every now and then but signal to noise seems to be still out of whack.
Merry Christmas...
Chris
Jim Rosenthal
Supporter
I liked the Paddock better when it was full of pictures of naked women. Can't we please go back to that? and can't we agree that we're NOT going to agree on guns etc and just give it up?
MY New Years' Resolution: no more posts on gun threads. You saw it here. Like anyone's reading them, anyway? We who are posting on these threads are just wanking at this point. I'd rather look at pictures of naked women, as an old guy, I figure I only have so much time to do it in.....
MY New Years' Resolution: no more posts on gun threads. You saw it here. Like anyone's reading them, anyway? We who are posting on these threads are just wanking at this point. I'd rather look at pictures of naked women, as an old guy, I figure I only have so much time to do it in.....
