F-22 Raptor Makes Its European Debut

K

Keith

Moderator
fsts2k said:
Mike, I agree with almost all of your points and was beginning to formulate a response until I saw your post. I like firetrucks.

The one point I disagree with is this:

"While doing so has enabled us to emerge victorious from virtually ever tactical encounter.."

Maybe I am interpreting this wrong but I do not think we have or will ever be successful in Iraq or Afghanistan. Sure, maybe in most individual firefights we come out winning but there is little clear solution to the overall war. Therefore I don't think we will emerge victorious.

I do like the F-22, I like that we continue to push the envelope and advance technology. I am a bigger fan of spending money on defense and infrastructure than giving money away for social programs that equate to little return.

Kevin
Click to expand...

Does there always have to be a "return?" Is this what the fundamental difference is?

America led the way demonstrating that the power of the individual and their choices could comprehensively trounce the philosophy of dictatorship and uber state control. "Power to the People" is an oft quoted and probably quite Socialist concept, and yet, that is what you brought to the table.

Other, developing nations have learned your lessons well and now seemingly have your nuts in a vice because the philosophy has not developed beyond "return" and I sense that it is this "weakness" that is being used against you.

I say you and of course it's "us" but GB is no longer a player on this stage amply demonstrated by China's recent "slap and, (and who would have thought it) your best friends are, or should be the Russians, as you share so much commonality.

America perhaps, needs to find a new way forward which doesn't necessarily involve sabre rattling at every level. Guys I am not a pinko liberal anti-american, it is New Years Eve and the start of a new one. AS always at this time, I pray to God that we will, eventually, stop killing each other and work towards some kind of global harmony.

It can be done - we just need some believers and some Good Men..

HNY guys... :)
 
F

Kevin L

Keith1 said:
Does there always have to be a "return?" Is this what the fundamental difference is?
Click to expand...

Keith, I think there should always be a "return" but a "return" does not need to be monetary. I don't like watching money burn for no good reason, therefore I think we should always strive to identify and exploit the beneficiaries of spending, especially the public spending. The F-22 had a return, I see a couple of things:

1) Meaningful jobs created for a significant number of people
2) Knowledge development in the science and mathematics fields, something the US is lacking in
3) Advancement of technology that can be applied to other fields
4) Continued development of our military, even if it is a firetruck that may not be used

The genesis of my comment is really rooted in things like welfare where individuals are provided for without the government requesting anything back from them. Before anyone jumps on my comment, let me explain. My family has been involved with mentoring programs for homeless. In these programs the homeless individuals need to "sign-up" for assistance and when they do they are provided with a very low rent apartment, job assistance, food stamps, free utilities, etc. In addition when they are in this program they have to have two years mandatory mentoring sessions twice a week, they must pay some form of rent, they must hold a job, they cannot commit any crimes, etc.

I am a huge fan of this mentoring program because at the end of the program 85% of the participants become a meaningful contributing part of society; that is a return to me. I do not think that giving someone food stamps on a weekly basis without requiring anything from them provides any return.

I hope this explains what I meant by the statement of a return.

I apologize for getting this thread off topic, to bring us back here is a sweet picture of the F-22.

http://1000pictures.com/aircraft/F-22/070401-f-6701p-049_1280x1024.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top