What to look for in a salvaged 302

Randy Folsom

Supporter
I hoping for some guidance on what to look for in a salvaged 302 block. I am thinking I might try to build my own 347 for an RCR40. Certainly a crate engine would be easier, but not nearly as much satisfaction. YouTube seems to favor late 90's Ford Explorers as a source. Not sure if it makes a difference for a bored and stroked build. In addition to the roller assembly, probably also upgraded heads, cam, induction, timing chain, oil pan/pump, ignition, etc. Wondering if buying a wrecked/crappy car or truck might be cheaper than buying just an engine from a salvage yard. If I do go the salvage yard route, what to do a I say so that they think I know what I am talking about and don't take me to cleaners.
 
For all of the extra work and filth, you might consider the price of a new aftermarket block a bargain. Sounds like all you're really going to use is the block and timing cover. Then you have to dismantle and dispose of the other 2800 lbs of carcass. In the aftermarket realm, I think you can get a 302 based block with 4.125 bore and have closet to 360CI.

If a gt40 was a budget build that could use a large portion of the drive train that might be different.
 
I would say it depends on the budget for the engine build.
Going beyond a certain budget, it seems to make sense to get a newer aftermarket block.

If you can achieve what you want with a factory block, then something that has not had a hard time previously, and something that is still on or very close to the factory bore size. Would be a shame to put a lot of effort into something that is on its last overbore size.
 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
For all of the extra work and filth, you might consider the price of a new aftermarket block a bargain. Sounds like all you're really going to use is the block and timing cover. Then you have to dismantle and dispose of the other 2800 lbs of carcass. In the aftermarket realm, I think you can get a 302 based block with 4.125 bore and have closet to 360CI.

If a gt40 was a budget build that could use a large portion of the drive train that might be different.
If I go the aftermarket route, is there a specific block that would best serve the purpose? What should I search for in google? Maybe I could get lucky and find an abandoned project for sale.
I would say it depends on the budget for the engine build.
Going beyond a certain budget, it seems to make sense to get a newer aftermarket block.

If you can achieve what you want with a factory block, then something that has not had a hard time previously, and something that is still on or very close to the factory bore size. Would be a shame to put a lot of effort into something that is on its last overbore size.
thx much. Yes, I agree I should be looking for a block that hasn’t been there and back again. Hoping for a never been bored from a wrecked late 90s mustang or explorer. Do you know what I can expect to pay? I was checking Summit and unless I am looking at the wrong type of block, they want north of 3k. I can probably get an aluminum block for not much more.
 
Try here for prepped stroker block
 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
Try here for prepped stroker block
Thx. Their website is currently not working for me except the home page, but from what I can see, they have a unique CNC fixture system which makes a lot of sense. I will definitely check them out.
 
Wow, yea, looks like the price of blocks has gone up since I bought.

A Dart or World Products is around 3K, but I don't think you can get an aluminum block for under 8K

I don't have any experience, but I wouldn't trust speedmaster for a block. I have their 8 stack, and it works fine, but it is a sloppy casting that took a lot of clean up to get the ports to align with the heads. But there's no real stresses on an intake like you have in a block.

But truth is, I know it takes a lot of the fun (and frustration) out, but a crate motor is a bargain if you're looking for something to run on pump gas and be naturally aspirated.
 

Neil

Supporter
If you are not wedded to a Ford engine, you might have a look at the line of Donovan aluminum blocks. They offer a number of choices mainly based on the Chevrolet design (Big Block & Small Block) and one on Chrysler. These are not inexpensive choices but they have been making aluminum blocks for racing since 1970 and Donovan knows what they are doing.

 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
Wow, yea, looks like the price of blocks has gone up since I bought.

A Dart or World Products is around 3K, but I don't think you can get an aluminum block for under 8K

I don't have any experience, but I wouldn't trust speedmaster for a block. I have their 8 stack, and it works fine, but it is a sloppy casting that took a lot of clean up to get the ports to align with the heads. But there's no real stresses on an intake like you have in a block.

But truth is, I know it takes a lot of the fun (and frustration) out, but a crate motor is a bargain if you're looking for something to run on pump gas and be naturally aspirated.
Yep, it seems that building your own only makes financial sense if you are in the business and have access to parts and tools. I just ran a tally of parts and tools. Even with HF tools and questionable parts, the savings is marginal.
 

Bill Kearley

Supporter
First you have to decide what you want to do with the car. For street use the best rout to take is a 302 based crate motor.
It will be cheaper than building your own from the junk yard supply. Not to mention a warranty that will cone with it.
 
The block i got for my 3d scan came from FB market place.

you will need to set your location and find something suitable
 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
First you have to decide what you want to do with the car. For street use the best rout to take is a 302 based crate motor.
It will be cheaper than building your own from the junk yard supply. Not to mention a warranty that will cone with it.
Thank you. I am planning a 347 stroker that is street friendly.
The block i got for my 3d scan came from FB market place.

you will need to set your location and find something suitable
thx much. I will start searching on a regular basis. I have a few months before I need to start working on it.
 

Howard Jones

Supporter
Here's an odd engine question. What does the rest of the power train you are planning look like? Gearbox, limited slip, 4.5.6 speed? Some free advice. Start with the gearbox and then build the engine to suit.

Otherwise the least expensive way to get all the parts and not throw anything away as you build the engine is to buy a crate motor and then take it apart and balance it. 375Hp is perfect for a moderate street-friendly pump gas motor. A 302 with a hyd cam, aftermarket aluminum heads and 10 to 1 compression ratio will do that for the life of the car.

I would be looking for a crate motor with those specs and go from there.
 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
Here's an odd engine question. What does the rest of the power train you are planning look like? Gearbox, limited slip, 4.5.6 speed? Some free advice. Start with the gearbox and then build the engine to suit.

Otherwise the least expensive way to get all the parts and not throw anything away as you build the engine is to buy a crate motor and then take it apart and balance it. 375Hp is perfect for a moderate street-friendly pump gas motor. A 302 with a hyd cam, aftermarket aluminum heads and 10 to 1 compression ratio will do that for the life of the car.

I would be looking for a crate motor with those specs and go from there.
Thx for your advice. I agree 375 is probably plenty of HP. My heart wants a 400+ HP stroker, but my wallet says stick with a 302. Aluminum heads will allow for higher compression, so that seems cost effective and less complicated. Don’t need solid lifters at steerable RPMs. Induction is probably 650 four barrel on a low profile intake manifold. Eventually, I would like a EFI eight stack, but I will have to sell a kidney first. I like the idea of buying the crate engine and immediately taking it apart for machining. I get the fun of building with a lot less frustration and money wasted on parts I don’t need. I would like a wide power band and some torque. Maybe not tree stump pulling torque but close. Thinking of going with a Grazino transaxle. My understanding is the Audi is not geared well for V8s on the street and only the more expensive ZFs can handle a lot of torque.
 

Howard Jones

Supporter
Here is an example of what I am talking about. It is an example for you to get some specs from as you do your research. I have no experience with this brand of crate motor. However, I have spent 10s of thousands of dollars with Summit Racing and have never been disappointed. Once in awhile the wrong part showed up but they made it right the first time I asked.

The reason I suggest you rebalance and blueprint any crate motor when new is I use my cars on track and I don't believe crate motors persay are dynamically balanced or carefully measured before assembly. Generally, crate motors as well as assembly line OEM engines are balanced mostly by selecting parts such as pistons, rods, etc. that match weight/ measurement specs and then assembled on a crank that has been pre-balanced.

Race engines need all the final assembly pieces balanced as a unit as well as the careful measurement of all the contact points such as crank journals, ring gaps, bearing sizes, etc. There can be significant differences in results between the two methods. But a carefully balanced and assembled engine will live a long happy life and stay together if stressed.

Street use simply does not stress an engine like 5 or 6 30-min high rev, hard as you can go, sessions in one day does.

I would ask around your area for a crank balance shop that you can work with. Let them know what you are thinking and get their opinion as well as the cost of working with a brand-new motor.

Ultimately, you might decide to not redo the crate motor because you are satisfied with the warranty and reputation of the vendor. In any case, you have some information to start with.

 

Randy Folsom

Supporter
Here is an example of what I am talking about. It is an example for you to get some specs from as you do your research. I have no experience with this brand of crate motor. However, I have spent 10s of thousands of dollars with Summit Racing and have never been disappointed. Once in awhile the wrong part showed up but they made it right the first time I asked.

The reason I suggest you rebalance and blueprint any crate motor when new is I use my cars on track and I don't believe crate motors persay are dynamically balanced or carefully measured before assembly. Generally, crate motors as well as assembly line OEM engines are balanced mostly by selecting parts such as pistons, rods, etc. that match weight/ measurement specs and then assembled on a crank that has been pre-balanced.

Race engines need all the final assembly pieces balanced as a unit as well as the careful measurement of all the contact points such as crank journals, ring gaps, bearing sizes, etc. There can be significant differences in results between the two methods. But a carefully balanced and assembled engine will live a long happy life and stay together if stressed.

Street use simply does not stress an engine like 5 or 6 30-min high rev, hard as you can go, sessions in one day does.

I would ask around your area for a crank balance shop that you can work with. Let them know what you are thinking and get their opinion as well as the cost of working with a brand-new motor.

Ultimately, you might decide to not redo the crate motor because you are satisfied with the warranty and reputation of the vendor. In any case, you have some information to start with.

Really appreciate your guidance. The blue print looks like a good fit for my project. I agree, balancing might not be necessary, but if the cost is not ridiculous, and does not void the warranty, then I may opt for it anyway. I am in Austin, surely there must be a good engine shop in Houston or San Antonio. Thx again.
 

Davidmgbv8

Supporter
I bought a 1998 out of an Explorer. GT40P heads (they turned out cracked un repairable) but for $400 plus shipping and they gave me back $200 for the heads. My build still was $10k with AFR heads. Small Essex flywheel was a part of that. Good thing is modern fuel injected motor was still standard bore and round!!!
 
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