Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Just as well Ron didn't leave when he sold his RF40!
Just as well Ron didn't leave when he sold his RF40!
Advertising Cars For Sale on GT40s.com
- Thread starter wealdenengineer
- Start date
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Interesting. Greedy huh? I don't think $25.00 U.S. is going to go very far. The simple fact is that it is a forum policy to pay a fee to advertise. Didn't we all agree to abide by the rules when joining? I know that in every medium I have advertised items for sale, I paid a fee. If the seller wants to advertise here, let him pay the few pennies the forum rules mandate. Ron provides his services at NO charge. I don't think the policy is greedy by any warped sense of the intellect. As far as serving buyer/seller, I was unaware of any obligation to serve anyone. The forum is voluntary and open to all to enjoy, or not. As you consider the forum a "dying corpse", will you be leaving anytime soon? I doubt it. Your last comment about "enthuse the kindergarten and buy flowers to go on the coffin" has me totally confused. Were you going for "euthanize" as it would make more sense. Ask your client to forego two warm beers and pay the $25.00 as their really is nothing to discuss.
Interesting. Greedy huh? I don't think $25.00 U.S. is going to go very far. The simple fact is that it is a forum policy to pay a fee to advertise. Didn't we all agree to abide by the rules when joining? I know that in every medium I have advertised items for sale, I paid a fee. If the seller wants to advertise here, let him pay the few pennies the forum rules mandate. Ron provides his services at NO charge. I don't think the policy is greedy by any warped sense of the intellect. As far as serving buyer/seller, I was unaware of any obligation to serve anyone. The forum is voluntary and open to all to enjoy, or not. As you consider the forum a "dying corpse", will you be leaving anytime soon? I doubt it. Your last comment about "enthuse the kindergarten and buy flowers to go on the coffin" has me totally confused. Were you going for "euthanize" as it would make more sense. Ask your client to forego two warm beers and pay the $25.00 as their really is nothing to discuss.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
I don't see what the issue is here really, If paid advertising brings in more revenue is that the sole aim of the site?
Supporting GT40 owners and builders seems to me to be the whole point. I think the whole "who pays" argument is a moot point really. if the cars are advertised via a paid advert and the forum members can see them for free, what's the difference if the cars are advertised free and paid up subscribers can access the for sale contact details? surely the forum benefits both ways (and possibly more so if the ads are free as there will be more of them to attract subscribers)
I am NOT saying free ad - free contact just think it could be turned around for the benefit of all.
Simon
I don't see what the issue is here really, If paid advertising brings in more revenue is that the sole aim of the site?
Supporting GT40 owners and builders seems to me to be the whole point. I think the whole "who pays" argument is a moot point really. if the cars are advertised via a paid advert and the forum members can see them for free, what's the difference if the cars are advertised free and paid up subscribers can access the for sale contact details? surely the forum benefits both ways (and possibly more so if the ads are free as there will be more of them to attract subscribers)
I am NOT saying free ad - free contact just think it could be turned around for the benefit of all.
Simon
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Simon, although your intentions maybe noble, your idea unfortunately would not work. Lets say that the seller posts his ad and the contact info is hidden from all who don't subscribe. Wouldn't you still be able to click on the seller's profile and send him a private message, thereby circumventing the need to pay for contact info? I believe so. Asking Ron to adjust the software is more time consuming and costly, (even if it could be done which I am not sure it can) than having the seller pay the $25.00. And no, the sole aim of the site is not to generate revenue, however, revenue is needed to maintain the site and charging a small fee to advertise your car for sale is not asking too much. Just my opinion.
Simon, although your intentions maybe noble, your idea unfortunately would not work. Lets say that the seller posts his ad and the contact info is hidden from all who don't subscribe. Wouldn't you still be able to click on the seller's profile and send him a private message, thereby circumventing the need to pay for contact info? I believe so. Asking Ron to adjust the software is more time consuming and costly, (even if it could be done which I am not sure it can) than having the seller pay the $25.00. And no, the sole aim of the site is not to generate revenue, however, revenue is needed to maintain the site and charging a small fee to advertise your car for sale is not asking too much. Just my opinion.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
I don't think that the issue here is really about 25 Bucks is it? No-one is likely to go to bed at night happy that their life has been changed for the better if they managed get away without paying that little amount?
I was simply pointing out that the 'service' provided by this excellent site could be muffled to a degree, if person (a) knows of an item (car or otherwise) that is for sale and doesn't mention it to person (b) the forum members, be they subscribers at the time or not.
There is a strong chance that the seller will no longer visit or subscribe once their 40 has been sold. I also believe that the new owner is likely to become a subscriber (if not already), once he /she becomes an owner.
For the record, I am not interested in the car Frank mentioned. I would have been pi**ed if it had have been the right car for me but no-one mentioned it!
The issue here (as far as I can see it), is that the OP is not the seller. Shame if there were to be a ban on posts like this, but I bow to Ron, who after-all is recognised universally in this group to have provided a most excellent forum. Long may he reign.
I don't think that the issue here is really about 25 Bucks is it? No-one is likely to go to bed at night happy that their life has been changed for the better if they managed get away without paying that little amount?
I was simply pointing out that the 'service' provided by this excellent site could be muffled to a degree, if person (a) knows of an item (car or otherwise) that is for sale and doesn't mention it to person (b) the forum members, be they subscribers at the time or not.
There is a strong chance that the seller will no longer visit or subscribe once their 40 has been sold. I also believe that the new owner is likely to become a subscriber (if not already), once he /she becomes an owner.
For the record, I am not interested in the car Frank mentioned. I would have been pi**ed if it had have been the right car for me but no-one mentioned it!
The issue here (as far as I can see it), is that the OP is not the seller. Shame if there were to be a ban on posts like this, but I bow to Ron, who after-all is recognised universally in this group to have provided a most excellent forum. Long may he reign.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Just to chuck my tuppence in:
I agree with Ron. The "For Sale" section once was free, but it was decided that
only members should be able to advertise in it since they were getting the
exposure and trying to make a sale. As others have mentioned, $25 US/yr is
really very cheap advertising. How much is a classified ad that runs a week in
the local paper, with limited word count and no pictures, much less full color.
Or, how much is a month long color ad in a local ad magazine?
However, I can understand someone not wanting to register "just" to sell a
car. So, how about an advertising fee of $5 US or so for an ad that runs for
a month? Ron, maybe you can set up a "Classifieds" section where after a
month the sale thread is deleted unless renewed? That would take care of the
sellers who don't want to support the site for a year for whatever reason, but
also satisfy the feeling that if you want to sell something here, you should
support the site in some manner.
Ian
Just to chuck my tuppence in:
I agree with Ron. The "For Sale" section once was free, but it was decided that
only members should be able to advertise in it since they were getting the
exposure and trying to make a sale. As others have mentioned, $25 US/yr is
really very cheap advertising. How much is a classified ad that runs a week in
the local paper, with limited word count and no pictures, much less full color.
Or, how much is a month long color ad in a local ad magazine?
However, I can understand someone not wanting to register "just" to sell a
car. So, how about an advertising fee of $5 US or so for an ad that runs for
a month? Ron, maybe you can set up a "Classifieds" section where after a
month the sale thread is deleted unless renewed? That would take care of the
sellers who don't want to support the site for a year for whatever reason, but
also satisfy the feeling that if you want to sell something here, you should
support the site in some manner.
Ian
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
And it started as five small words !! Perhaps you should read my third post on this subject " no fee, no benefit of any kind", I just put people in touch with each other, no more than that, this NOT part of my business in any way, it just a free service because people know I get results. I have NO input or knowledge of resultant negotiations between sellers and buyers at all, just aknowledgement when the deals are done.
And it started as five small words !! Perhaps you should read my third post on this subject " no fee, no benefit of any kind", I just put people in touch with each other, no more than that, this NOT part of my business in any way, it just a free service because people know I get results. I have NO input or knowledge of resultant negotiations between sellers and buyers at all, just aknowledgement when the deals are done.
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Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Frank, I read the whole thread. It is the "seller" in this case who is benefiting, not you.
The "seller" should be the one to either pay the membership, or pay an advertising fee.
I can understand both sides of the picture, and I also admit to the grayish area of a
forum supported posting on behalf of another. As a matter of fact, if you were acting as
a paid agent to sell the car, this would be more black and white. But, posting it gratis,
as a favor for the seller, I can understand Ron's position that this circumvents a policy
that has been put in place. One reason this policy was put in place was at one point
there was a deluge of people offering cars, parts, and services for sale, and many
agreed that if people wanted to "profit" (I put that in quotes since we all know that
resale of a replica is more than likely not a good way to turn a profit) by using the
site, they should pay for the right to do so. You are not directly profiting from this
sale, nor are you profiting monetarily at all, but the seller is.
I have had private conversations with you in the past, and you also receive great
recommendations from others on this board. In my estimation, you are an honest,
stand up kind of guy, and you offer plenty of advice to just about anyone who asks.
And, you obviously do a lot of favors for people and expect nothing in return. Which
made my decision to post my comments a difficult one. But, in the end, a policy was
set, and most on the board agreed it was a good idea.
Ian
Frank, I read the whole thread. It is the "seller" in this case who is benefiting, not you.
The "seller" should be the one to either pay the membership, or pay an advertising fee.
I can understand both sides of the picture, and I also admit to the grayish area of a
forum supported posting on behalf of another. As a matter of fact, if you were acting as
a paid agent to sell the car, this would be more black and white. But, posting it gratis,
as a favor for the seller, I can understand Ron's position that this circumvents a policy
that has been put in place. One reason this policy was put in place was at one point
there was a deluge of people offering cars, parts, and services for sale, and many
agreed that if people wanted to "profit" (I put that in quotes since we all know that
resale of a replica is more than likely not a good way to turn a profit) by using the
site, they should pay for the right to do so. You are not directly profiting from this
sale, nor are you profiting monetarily at all, but the seller is.
I have had private conversations with you in the past, and you also receive great
recommendations from others on this board. In my estimation, you are an honest,
stand up kind of guy, and you offer plenty of advice to just about anyone who asks.
And, you obviously do a lot of favors for people and expect nothing in return. Which
made my decision to post my comments a difficult one. But, in the end, a policy was
set, and most on the board agreed it was a good idea.
Ian
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Very true Frank. And I am sure there have been other arguments and then some which have started with less words. However, it was you who started this thread and then "fanned the flames" by challenging Ron and the policy of the forum. In my case, it was your replies to Ron, which in my opinion were disrespectful and disingenuous, which prompted my posts. Ron doesn't need my support and did not ask for same. However as Mother to the forum he doesn't need to be bothered with such trivial matters which really are self explanatory.
I'm curious. Is the owner of said car aware of this thread? Is he/she unwilling or refusing to pay the paltry sum of $25.00 U.S. to advertise his car for sale? To me, $25.00 with the right to advertise my car for a year is more than a bargain.
Very true Frank. And I am sure there have been other arguments and then some which have started with less words. However, it was you who started this thread and then "fanned the flames" by challenging Ron and the policy of the forum. In my case, it was your replies to Ron, which in my opinion were disrespectful and disingenuous, which prompted my posts. Ron doesn't need my support and did not ask for same. However as Mother to the forum he doesn't need to be bothered with such trivial matters which really are self explanatory.
I'm curious. Is the owner of said car aware of this thread? Is he/she unwilling or refusing to pay the paltry sum of $25.00 U.S. to advertise his car for sale? To me, $25.00 with the right to advertise my car for a year is more than a bargain.
Paul Thompson 'Hooligan'
Admin
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
I'd tried to stay out of this, but slap me with a wet fish!! - what the hell is going on?...
I have been a member of the forum for quite a while, I am also bestowed with 'admin' classification as I help out when and where I can and generally visit several times a day. I also contribute to the running costs, but not as a vendor as yet. (before anyone asks)
As a member of the GTD40 Car Club, I too have posted the odd car for sale on here, (with Ron's blessing) but only where I considered the owner to be incapable of posting and as a club contribution had been made it seemed vaguely ok.
However, as I am well aware of the costs involved in running such a forum/website, my personal opinion is this.
1) The posting of items for sale should only be possible by supporting members. (i.e. those that contribute £/$)
2) The posting of a car's details for sale should be accompanied by a donation to the forum (eg. £25 / $50)
3) Bringing to the attention of the community the details of GT related or 'considered useful' items on sites such as Ebay etc should continue as norm.
I for one will never post a car's details again without securing a contribution for the forum. The likelyhood of selling a car via the forum is far better than traditional avenues such as trade magazines etc and you would have to pay for adverts in most (90%+) of them anyway too. If a person is genuinely interested in selling their vehicle, the advertising fee must surely be considered insignificant..
Some of the remarks in this thread beggar belief and I'm amazed that it is being debated at all.
I hope that common sense prevails and we can all get on with enjoying and supporting this great meeting place/social forum.
I'd tried to stay out of this, but slap me with a wet fish!! - what the hell is going on?...
I have been a member of the forum for quite a while, I am also bestowed with 'admin' classification as I help out when and where I can and generally visit several times a day. I also contribute to the running costs, but not as a vendor as yet. (before anyone asks)
As a member of the GTD40 Car Club, I too have posted the odd car for sale on here, (with Ron's blessing) but only where I considered the owner to be incapable of posting and as a club contribution had been made it seemed vaguely ok.
However, as I am well aware of the costs involved in running such a forum/website, my personal opinion is this.
1) The posting of items for sale should only be possible by supporting members. (i.e. those that contribute £/$)
2) The posting of a car's details for sale should be accompanied by a donation to the forum (eg. £25 / $50)
3) Bringing to the attention of the community the details of GT related or 'considered useful' items on sites such as Ebay etc should continue as norm.
I for one will never post a car's details again without securing a contribution for the forum. The likelyhood of selling a car via the forum is far better than traditional avenues such as trade magazines etc and you would have to pay for adverts in most (90%+) of them anyway too. If a person is genuinely interested in selling their vehicle, the advertising fee must surely be considered insignificant..
Some of the remarks in this thread beggar belief and I'm amazed that it is being debated at all.
I hope that common sense prevails and we can all get on with enjoying and supporting this great meeting place/social forum.
Ron Earp
Admin
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
There are a lot of interesting thoughts and opinions on this thread. Sure has stirred up some posts.
Maybe because the “advertising a car” policy isn’t clearly stated it has led to confusion?
Here are a couple of my thoughts on various comments:
In my way of thinking I sort of break the “Car for Sale” issue down like this:
I do concede the point that the second point there is/was not made clear with the supporter status. Probably the forum supporter status needs to be disentangled with selling cars.
There are some cool add-on Classified Ad programs for VB, our forum software, that I will investigate. They have the ability to present items for sale in a professional manner and handle fees, expiration times, and so on. Neat stuff, they also display rotating thumbnails of stuff for sale in selected areas of the forum.
PS-Sorry Paul, missed your post when I was writing mine, I think you covered it.
There are a lot of interesting thoughts and opinions on this thread. Sure has stirred up some posts.
Maybe because the “advertising a car” policy isn’t clearly stated it has led to confusion?
Here are a couple of my thoughts on various comments:
- The supporter status for GT40s.com was primarily designed for folks to contribute to the forum running costs. Maybe this needs to be made clear and a new designation needs to be provided for folks wanting to sell cars.
- Requiring folks to be a supporter to post in the “Cars for Sale” area DOES bring in additional funding and I get emails about the topic from time to time - “Why can’t I post my car for sale, what do I have to do?”. Probably brings in $250-$300 a year and that will pay for a month of fees for GT40s.com.
- Is $25 too much for an advertisement that doesn’t expire, allows the use of full color photos, all the text you want, linking to the site and so on? Cobra Country charges $150 for a basic web ad for 3 months, more for larger photos or more than four.
In my way of thinking I sort of break the “Car for Sale” issue down like this:
- You are an individual and forum supporter - it is fine to put YOUR car up for sale.
- You are an individual and forum supporter - it is not fine to put someone else's car up for sale.
I do concede the point that the second point there is/was not made clear with the supporter status. Probably the forum supporter status needs to be disentangled with selling cars.
There are some cool add-on Classified Ad programs for VB, our forum software, that I will investigate. They have the ability to present items for sale in a professional manner and handle fees, expiration times, and so on. Neat stuff, they also display rotating thumbnails of stuff for sale in selected areas of the forum.
PS-Sorry Paul, missed your post when I was writing mine, I think you covered it.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
WTF? :stunned:
That is way out of line. Wind your neck in bloke.... :speechless: It's an interesting discussion, no need to get personal.
WTF? :stunned:
That is way out of line. Wind your neck in bloke.... :speechless: It's an interesting discussion, no need to get personal.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Sorry to upset you Keith, but I respectfully disagree with you. This is not the first time this issue has been presented. If memory serves me correct, the others were crucified for their infraction. Frank has been around a long time and he knows the score. Ron politely reminded Frank in post number four that you should be a forum supporter to advertise. He also correctly stated that without donations, the forum wouldn't exist. Without Ron and this forum, you and I wouldn't be having this exchange or even had the chance to share a common interest. In my opinion, Frank gave several smart a$$ replies. I particularly liked: "We do not see your supposed concerns, perhaps you can elaborate ?" Elaborate. Elaborate on what? It is a simple concept. You want to advertise your car, make a small donation. Ron doesn't have to justify anything to anyone. He created this forum. Or how about this one: "We will let you know the conclusion !" Talk about slapping someone in the face. Yea Ron, thanks for the comments but I'm still going to do whatever I like. Then you have the issue of being greedy over $25.00 bucks. Ron is donating his time at no charge. Why he has to get overly involved in a simple matter is waste of his time and bandwidth.
Now you have my take on things.
Sorry to upset you Keith, but I respectfully disagree with you. This is not the first time this issue has been presented. If memory serves me correct, the others were crucified for their infraction. Frank has been around a long time and he knows the score. Ron politely reminded Frank in post number four that you should be a forum supporter to advertise. He also correctly stated that without donations, the forum wouldn't exist. Without Ron and this forum, you and I wouldn't be having this exchange or even had the chance to share a common interest. In my opinion, Frank gave several smart a$$ replies. I particularly liked: "We do not see your supposed concerns, perhaps you can elaborate ?" Elaborate. Elaborate on what? It is a simple concept. You want to advertise your car, make a small donation. Ron doesn't have to justify anything to anyone. He created this forum. Or how about this one: "We will let you know the conclusion !" Talk about slapping someone in the face. Yea Ron, thanks for the comments but I'm still going to do whatever I like. Then you have the issue of being greedy over $25.00 bucks. Ron is donating his time at no charge. Why he has to get overly involved in a simple matter is waste of his time and bandwidth.
Now you have my take on things.
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
Dear constipated English Lasses and the “semi constipated” moderator,,,
My dear friend Chris K is trying to sell his GT, and he is not a freeloader. However the repeated posts on this “BLOODY” thread has pushed his for sale sign ("GTD for sale $,,,,,") out of the forefront. Would you please take this lurid discussion to “MY SECTION” the paddock, so that I can insult all of you properly?
And Yes, Chris did contact me, and did curse all of you for pushing his post to the back ground.
And finally,,, NO, I am not a paying member. Ron, should Pay me $25 a year for my input to this forum.
Dear constipated English Lasses and the “semi constipated” moderator,,,
My dear friend Chris K is trying to sell his GT, and he is not a freeloader. However the repeated posts on this “BLOODY” thread has pushed his for sale sign ("GTD for sale $,,,,,") out of the forefront. Would you please take this lurid discussion to “MY SECTION” the paddock, so that I can insult all of you properly?
And Yes, Chris did contact me, and did curse all of you for pushing his post to the back ground.
And finally,,, NO, I am not a paying member. Ron, should Pay me $25 a year for my input to this forum.
Ron Earp
Admin
Done, as it should have been done earlier. Damn, is it time for me to send $25 again?
The original thread that started this discussion is here:
http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-cars-sale/25419-road-race-gtd-sale-uk.html
Fellows, I'm not bent out of shape about any of this at all. Sure, it uses time, that isn't so good for any of us. But if it settles a policy for now and the future then it is ground that we don't have to rehash again. I thought it was clear from the beginning, but I reckon I was wrong and it needs to be further defined.
The original thread that started this discussion is here:
http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-cars-sale/25419-road-race-gtd-sale-uk.html
Fellows, I'm not bent out of shape about any of this at all. Sure, it uses time, that isn't so good for any of us. But if it settles a policy for now and the future then it is ground that we don't have to rehash again. I thought it was clear from the beginning, but I reckon I was wrong and it needs to be further defined.
Pay the $25 and register with the forum. What's the %$@ problem?
Good lord.
Chris
Good lord.
Chris
Re: Road/Race GTD for sale UK
GREAT
There goes 50% of the reason I support the Forum in the first place!
GREAT
There goes 50% of the reason I support the Forum in the first place!
Why not if you know someone with a car for sale inform them of an excellent place to advertise their car for a very small price. Explain how it is probably one of the best places to advertise their car for a quick sale.
Then the seller gets the benefit of potential sale, site gets support and potential buyers see car for sale.
Great forum Ron
Jim
Then the seller gets the benefit of potential sale, site gets support and potential buyers see car for sale.
Great forum Ron
Jim
