Is the right to bear arms outdated.

marc.madmax

marc

Lifetime Supporter
Come on Veek, you haven't been called a phallic, power thing! My wife doesn't even do that. But don't worry, In Poland they rounded up the jews and took them away, then they came and rounded up the christians and took them too. What are you going to do when they come for you??

I'm in the first batch so I would recommend a different door than mine if you know what I mean. I would have a family double in size with more aunts and cousins. When you find a way to stop the hate and the nut cases, I will more keen to leave my guns behind. But if you think that a few children dead are going to change me when I lost millions, think again. your Big Thick Phallic friend.
 
D

Doug

Jumping in rather late and not the most well read so please bear with me...

You're telling me per household gun ownership is down? Where are all of these guns from the previously counted households? Are you saying there's one guy on every block in the country that is collecting all the guns and skewing the stats! How about all of the new homes being built (we're in an up market here in Texas); no guns in those new houses? Are all of these factors taken into account. Someone mentioned ...there's not new gun owners by and large..., I don't buy that. What I see is people without a single firearm making their first purchase, and yes people with one/more/many/several/etc buying more - SO WHAT, who cares!

I think the conversations are misguided and should focus more on personal responsibiity and raising humans correctly to respect one another - yeah, right!

Who gives a poop if the Communist News Network calls it an assault rifle when it technically is not? Focus on the big picture. Guns as a culture and way of life are what this country and this world is based on and I find it hard to believe they'll be gone any time soon.

The really sad thing is that there are sooooo manyyyyyy folks out there that jump on the bandwagon when there is a tragic incident which allows their political leaders to capitalize and furthers their agenda - yeah, capitalize on the deaths of children; good job Obama that'll get you a thumbs up from Hollywood and the rest of your constituents. Fact is, he's been waiting for this moment for 4 years. Sad.

Idiots (politicians).
 
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Steve

Supporter
Obama=self-righteous arrogant elitism.

1. I'm smarter than you.
2. I'm morally superior than you.
3. I know what's best for you.
4. I'm going to force my will on you for your own good.

This mindset allows him and the liberal congress to feel justified in infringing upon American's rights to push legislation/executive orders that allow the govt to have more control in our lives (whether that be gun control or representation without taxation which occurs when people are allowed to vote but don't pay any taxes). Ultimately, this is tyranny. Tyranny is what our founding fathers warned us of and one of the conservative ideals is to decrease the federal govt interference in these areas.

I'm not a gun owner. I do think background checks and other safety measures to ensure that guns don't fall in a felons hands are reasonable. I don't feel outlawing handguns (or any gun) is consistent with the 2nd amendment. Those who feel differently should move to a country that has different laws rather than attempting to change the bill of rights/constitution of the US.
 
J

Jeff Young

GT40s Supporter
Larry L. said:
Larry Pratt carved Morgan ham from bacon, didn't he.
Click to expand...

Pratt's position is a very polite "nothing needs to change" despite the overwhelming number of gun deaths we have in the US. Bizarre.

Pratt and the NRA's position goes something like this:

1. Massacre happens.

NRA response: We don't need more regulation, we need more guns!

2. Massacre happens again.

NRA response: We don't need more regulation, we need more guns!

And so on. And so on.

That is the definition of insanity. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting the same result.
 
A

craig

In a nutshell all this talk about banning guns is such a simpleton thought,
as if a whole new wave of illegal firearms coming across the border fulfilling an endless supplying of guns for the bad guy wouldn't happen???
And then what......we infringed upon the rights of the law abiding and did absolutely NOTHING.. again I say, these clowns can't think beyond their nose.
 
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Danimal W

automan said:
In a nutshell all this talk about banning guns is such a simpleton thought,
as if a whole new wave of illegal firearms coming across the border fulfilling an endless supplying of guns for the bad guy wouldn't happen???
And then what......we infringed upon the rights of the law abiding and did absolutely NOTHING.. again I say, these clowns can't think beyond their nose.
Click to expand...

Beyond their noses.???? You give them too much credit to think past their nerve synapses...

Here is what most politicians think of... Me, myself and I. And that is the root of most problems.
 
Pete

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
danimal said:
Beyond their noses.???? You give them too much credit to think past their nerve synapses...

Here is what most politicians think of... Me, myself and I. And that is the root of most problems.
Click to expand...

I think so too. However Although I believe in the right to bear arms and am cynical enough to think that most polititions have a hidden agenda when they pass laws. I don't think a normal household needs an assault weapon, a bazooka or a 50 cal machine gun for self defence.
I owned several weapons before guns were banned in OZ , a 12 gauge shot gun,
A .22 rifle and an ex military .303 rifle that I re-stocked and mounted a scope to
Hunt Feral pigs with. I also owned at one stage some target pistols for competition purposes.
My problem was not the removal of fully automatic assault type weapons,
But the knee jerk reaction of disarming the good guys and letting the criminals continue to have their weapons. By definition they don't give a shit about the law. So didn't hand their guns in.(they wouldn't have handed their assault rifles in either).
As you can see in both our countries banning stuff doesn't work. Prohibition didn't work, drugs are illegal but you can buy them just about anywhere.
When you ban anything all that happens is you make criminals out of good guys and the problem goes underground and criminals get rich and a black market is set up that is even more hard to control.
BTW these most recent terrible events have taken place in areas that guns are banned in have they not?

A couple of thing s that worry me about not being armed, home invasions have increased dramatically and I am older and not as able to defend myself physically as well as I could. Armed hold ups have increased despite what Jim shows in his charts and I now have no defence against an armed criminal.

Don't let it happen to you.
 
M

Jack

"Don't let it happen to you." AMEN brother!

We should know more details about the proposed assault weapons/hi-capacity magazines, forbidden list, etc. by tomorrow. I'm concerned about national registration. It is always the first step in confiscation.

There is a threat of "Executive Order" by the pres. Attempting to bypass the Congress and our Constitution and Bill of Rights. I don't think that would go over very well!
 
Jim Craik

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
Jack,

We keep hearing that its folks with mental and or anger issues who keep commiting these mass murders. If you are really serious about keeping guns out of the hands of those folks, wouldn't a National database of gun owners be necessary?

If someone starts acting dangerously irrational, we would need to know if there were guns in their house, woudn't we?
 
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Danimal W

Well, I'm trying to be diplomatic here,.....SEMI AUTO RIFLES ---ARE NOT--- ASSAULT RIFLES.

Everyone that continues to call semiautomatic rifles "assault rifles" is perpetuating wrong vernacular and is helping to feed the misinformation.

I have an AR-15, it operates no differently than my Browning 2000 shotgun, the are both gas actuated semiautomatic firearms... That's it.

As to full auto firearms, they are legal to own AFTER a long 6-9 month wait, after spending $10,000+ for tge firearm AND submitting fingerprints and necesary paperwork to the ATF for approval. Anyone who has forked over the buttload of money and jumped through all of these hoops to own a full auto legally is not committing crimes with said firearm, so these are not people that we have to worry about. The reason legal full autos are so expensive is simple supply and demand. To be a legal full auto, it had to have been privately registered prior to 1986. Any full auto, not registered for private ownership by 1986 can not be owned by a private individual.

This is a better investment than gold. I saw an H&K MP5 for sale in 1984-5 for $1300, I saw a transferable one for sale two years ago for $13,000. Three weeks ago, I saw a transferable M-16 for sale for $20,000.

The brainless Feinstein is proposing that all firearms purchases go through this type of process. One major flaw, it will only affect law abiding citizens, not criminals. Therefore, it will do nothing to reduce crime.

The anitgun members of Congress are so full of sh*t in this regard. They don't give a rat's a$$ about reducing crime, they only want to disarm the public in an effort to protect their power position and to make a name for themselves. It is disgusting that they only think of themselves and are happy and way to willing, to lie to and mislead their bosses (us, the public).
 
L

Larry L.

Lifetime Supporter
danimal said:
The brainless Feinstein is proposing that all firearms purchases go through this type of process. One major flaw, it will only affect law abiding citizens, not criminals (and may I add 'loons'?). Therefore, it will do nothing to reduce crime.
Click to expand...

...the latter 2 stmts being absolute, indisputable, history supported facts that so many of us have pointed out over & over & over & over & over ad nauseam. But, facts and the reality they reflect mean absolutely n-o-t-h-i-n-g to the agenda driven anti-gun crowd in D.C. and around the country.

It's nothing short of disgusting really...
 
M

Jack

Jim Craik said:
Jack,

We keep hearing that its folks with mental and or anger issues who keep commiting these mass murders. If you are really serious about keeping guns out of the hands of those folks, wouldn't a National database of gun owners be necessary?

If someone starts acting dangerously irrational, we would need to know if there were guns in their house, woudn't we?
Click to expand...

A national database for mental patients and pyschotic drug patients would be more beneficial. Eliminating firearm sales to these individuals will go far to solve the issue. The criminals don't care about gun the laws. I really feel that national registration is the first step to confiscation, as do only about another 100 million or so firearm owners.

I do respect your personal opinion Jim, although mine differs.
 
Pete

Pete McCluskey.

Lifetime Supporter
molleur said:
A national database for mental patients and pyschotic drug patients would be more beneficial. Eliminating firearm sales to these individuals will go far to solve the issue. The criminals don't care about gun the laws. I really feel that national registration is the first step to confiscation, as do only about another 100 million or so firearm owners.

I do respect your personal opinion Jim, although mine differs.
Click to expand...

Agree, a national register of mental patients and those using psychotic drugs would go a long way, but would still not stop criminals getting guns.
I'm not sure there is an answer, what I am sure of is banning law abiding people from having guns isn't an answer.
The was a call yesterday in the local press for another Government funded gun buy back and armistice, because allegedly there are more guns circulating in Australian than before the ban.
 
Jim Craik

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
molleur said:
A national database for mental patients and pyschotic drug patients would be more beneficial. Eliminating firearm sales to these individuals will go far to solve the issue. The criminals don't care about gun the laws. I really feel that national registration is the first step to confiscation, as do only about another 100 million or so firearm owners.

I do respect your personal opinion Jim, although mine differs.
Click to expand...

But Jack, that would leave all the current gun owners out of the loop, if they were recently placed on the no buy gun list, but already had guns, they would not be disarmed.

Kind of like this most recent school attack, the kid could not buy guns, but his Mom had lots of guns.
 
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