Synthetic, or is it SIN-thetic

[Doug Clark]

All the USA guys saying Mobil 1 is expensive need a reality check...

Mobil 1 in Walmart is roughly US$25 for a 5 quart jug. In Australia a 5 litre (near as dammit the same size) is A$85. You can get 20 litre cans for just over A$200 though.

 

[Jac Mac]

A J, I think I covered it all in post #22, In regard to your Valvoline 40 & 50 race oils my understanding is that Valvoline Race oils are just that and do have higher levels of ZDDP ( and probably a disclaimer for emmision/enviromental issues ). Its also interesting to note that many of the 'latest' --'new name' higher zddp % oils being introduced to the market in recent times have links to major name brand oil concerns, this is probably for marketing reasons. The thing with all of this is the goal posts keep getting shifted & I doubt anyone here has ever had a letter from their oil supplier to the effect of----- This is just to let you know that we have reduced the zddp % of your oil this month and you may experience some minor problems like excessive cam lobe wear in that old 289 in your GT40 or that 327 in your Lola T70. ------------ We can no longer take it for granted that the makeup of a certain grade is going to be the same or as good in the future.
My bitch at all this is I think the downstream effects of this '' enviromentally acceptable'' change in oil quality has no positive payback. When you consider the wider picture of premature engine failures due to lack of proper lubrication and the resultant pollution from cleaning/repairing etc I think that you would find that its a bigger mess created than if the zddp levels had been allowed to stand and a proactive program to 'really' educate people on which type of engines did not require these additives.

 

[wpeter]

Break in oil is for breaking in the cam and setting rings etc. The process case hardens the surface of a flat tappet cam and creates a durable surface. Basically you hammer the cam for 15 or 20 minutes at 2000RPMs. This is where the ZDDP is so important. Another good reason to dyno the engine, in my opinion. After this pick your oil based on the service you plan on putting the engine through. I like synthetic. I use it due to its better high temp lubrication ability since my oil runs around 280 degrees.
If you really want to know what is going on with your engine, HAVE THE OIL TESTED. It is cheap.You can buy them 10 at a time for 150 bucks. It is not so much an absolute indicator of dramantic failure as it is a record of how your engine is wearing. For instance, if all of a sudden you see a high copper number you can monitor or tear down depending on how you run your engine. I currently have a strange knock in my Evo. The engine builder say's it is not a bearing and the dyno shows no indication of reduced HP. I am curently waiting to see what the oil tells me.
For you fuel injected guys. If you are using a FI cleaner remember that a lot of that crap ends up in your oil so change it after you go through that tank of gas.

 

[Jack]

Good advice here..

 

[Sandy]

LN Engineering has a ton of good stuff, I think I posted that a long while ago when they actually had content (Zn/P) of many different brands of motor oils but I have not seen it on their site the last time I looked. I think they want you to send in your oil to have it analized now for a small fee. Might have just missed it. Great site. (I still like the Air cooled oil Motorcycle oil, but afraid to try it in something)

Also I agree with Mr. Mac, my cat cons will live a couple of years longer BFD, but when I have to rebuild my motor and all the waste that comes with that, I'll bet that it is a wash if not worse for the environment. When all said and done I think Cat cons are already highly controlled and recycled so seems like another dumb over the top 'green' thing, but don't know all the details besides longer life for the cats.

As it has been said may times "change it often" is the best thing I think. I just did a diesel oil change in my Excursion and got the last of the Rotella at the autoparts store that did not have the new formulation sticker, and even the diesel oils are getting the additive shaft too it seems. Same for Mobil 1 Delvac Diesel (or HD Turbo Consumer) stuff too. Wait until the big rig diesel truck guys find out they only get 300 k miles instead of 600 on a motor (not sure what they really get)

Looks like when I purchse the next batch of racing oil I'll have to clearly state that the motor oil I'm purchasing will be for "Off Road Use Only" and I would never use it in an automobile that is used on public highways as that might be wrong.

I will say this that the Royal Purple has been OK in the Mustang until the pump shaft broke, and it ran about 20 seconds at almost full till until it siezed...

Sandy

 

[Al Jones]

Sandy - What style sm blk was it that lost the pump drive? I toasted my 302 in the same manner.It was a distributorless F.I. model and I'm curious to see if there is a common problem with these.I was told that they are subject to breakage (or damage soon to result in breakage) on cold starts with thicker oil A.J.

 

[Sandy]

It was in my 331 SBF Mustang. It was a cold day too, and oil pressure did not come down even after a good warm up until very far along on the track. The pump shaft was a Ford Racing Products version from what it looked like. Twisted off at the point where the hex meets the cylinder portion in the pump. That being said I can't be sure that the shaft twisted due to pressure, when I opened the valve covers up it had 2 broken springs and I suspect shrapnel may have been ingested in the pump, but not sure as I have not yanked the motor yet. The motor with steel valves likely bounced off the 8k mark on the tach and thus the state of the couple broken valve springs. Odd how good it ran unitl it the bearings became super glued to the crank...

So either cold weather and inadequit warm up or siezed up pump twisted the shaft.

Video here scroll around to the 16 Minute mark, you will see how long it lasts...

Motorator Video - The Ripper at Willow Springs, Jan 2008, Wide View

Sandy

 

[Al Jones]

Sounded ugly at the end.Parts/schrapnel ingestion not likely unless you have no screen over the pump pickup.Could be lots of things(pump casting breaking at block mounting point,pickup dropping off,etc with shaft failure following,maybe just simple shaft failure from slight misalignment as covered in another thread) but you will only know for sure when you get it apart. Hopefully fixable if piston/bore not compromised.Don't know if you ran motor before start of video but a bit of initial running at lower revs(2000 or less) for a few minutes might help.Was this a gear or rotor pump?Possible that you are using a pump designed for more volume and pressure than you require and shaft loading higher than optimal.Just my 2c. Keep us posted. A.J.

 

[Sandy]

The bits that could have got into the screen might have been small, but will need to tear it down. The motor was warmed for a bit before it went out, but still high oil pressure. Not sure if a bigger bypass would help (or if possible). Standard HV Melling pump. So will have to take it apart to really find out. I did find almost no metal in the oil (since it was not pumping) except for a few chunks of what looks like some aluminum. Might be piston, might be block. I'm going to guess crank is nicely heat treated blue with a potential rod twisted up. But it was odd that it did not sound like it self destructed, but rather just siezed up. Guessing a Piston has a valve in it somewhere too. Just have not had a breather to yank the motor. Been a while too

The pump shaft is down at the bottom of the page along with some previous engine issues from a few years back.

Photo Links

As this is the oil thread, yes I'll continue to run Synthetic Royal Purple Racing 41 as seems to last a long time without oil pressure.

I should have been running Dura-Lube, you can run your car without oil, spray it with a fire hose, dump sand in the engine and it will save your motor... hehehe

Sandy