Ring and Pinion Strength

[hydra]

Hi all,
I'm a mechanical engineer/car nut, and I just finished scouring the entire drivetrain forum for transaxle info, and I must say, there's quite a bit of info out there!

What I didn't find was some sort of estimate for the strength of different ring and pinions (alone) for different gearboxes like the 016, 01E, UN1, etc...
I'm actually designing a custom gearbox on the cheap, and I'd like to see if I can use an Audi R&P, on account of price, availibility, and its adaptability to the "university special" torsen LSD. I'm looking to put out a max of 4300lb-ft AT THE RING&PINION in a 2200lb car.

Has anyone done any cryo/heat-treatment operations to strengthen the R&P? Any feedback? Thanks...

 

[Mark Worthington]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm actually designing a custom gearbox on the cheap, and I'd like to see if I can use an Audi R&P, on account of price, availibility, and its adaptability to the "university special" torsen LSD. I'm looking to put out a max of 4300lb-ft AT THE RING&PINION in a 2200lb car.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ummm...is that a typo? Is there an extra zero there? Do you mean 430 lb-ft or 4,300 lb-ft? And I'm unlear of the meaning of the "Universally Special" LSD.

 

[hydra]

No that wasn't a typo, I figured 420-430 at the engine, with just over a 10:1 overall gear ratio in first (which should go up to 60+mph!), and as for the university special LSD, check out torsen.com, its the one they provide for the FSAE programs (I'm looking at the stronger version of that)

 

[Mark Worthington]

OK, I get it...you're looking at torque multiplication. This might be a good question for the guys at Audiworld. There are a number of S4 biturbos that are running some pretty big numbers through the 01E which, as far as I can tell, has the same size R/P as the 016 (although the part numbers are different). If you figure some of these guys are running 500 lb-ft of rear-wheel torque through a Quattro system and if you assume that 50% of the torque goes through the front R/P gear, with a first gear ratio of 3.50 and a 4.11 R/P, that translates to 3,596 lb-ft of torque. As I understand it, the S4 guys are breaking the first gear sets before they blow out the R/P. The typical S4 weighs about 3,600 lb. The assumption of 50% of the torque going through the front R/P on is probably flawed since most of the weight will transfer to the rear wheels on launch. A more reasonable assumption would be that 25% of the torque of an S4 will go through the front R/P on launch, which results in it seeing a torque of 1,798 lb-ft.
Bottom line, I don't think anyone can really give you a definitive answer to your question. You will get anectotal feedback, such as "Porsche 944 turbos blow out R/P gear sets on their version of the 016." Go ahead and try it and let us know how it works out. Good luck.

 

Hi Mark just joined your forum,last week pulled a 016 from a 1985 quattro,i have another 2wd 016 also, the quattro has a rubber damper thing around the rear tailshaft,is this to stop harmonic vibrations, guys in NZ found some of the Audi boxes would destroy the syncro rings if you overreved in neutral, have you or anyone heard of this before, i am putting a lexus 1uzfe in front of this box with about 300hp, will it stay together, or should i collect more gearboxs as spares.
Regards Graeme

 

[Hershal Byrd]

I have an 016 3U transaxle in my GT for over three years. I couldn't be happier with it. If you plan to use the trans for dragrace style hole shots then I suspect it won't last long. But as a roadrace application it is superb. The RF GT weighs under 2400LBS and that trans axle came out of a car that wieghs well over 3500LBS. So unless you put tyres on the GT the size of steam rollers you shouldn't have any problems.
My GT has 400 HP at 370 FT LBS of torque. That's plenty of power for this car. If you think you need more power and a stronger trans then look no further than the 01E box for the 2WD Audi A8 and RS6. These cars have in excess of 400 HP and they are well built transaxles with six speeds. I believe that this transaxle is the one most replica builders will be using in the future.

Hersh /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[AdrianBurton]

Hershal,

Where can I find a 3U box in the US ???