Ease of Use?

[Graham]

Hi all,

Its brain picking time.....

in all of your esteamed opinion, which mark / specification of GT40 is the easiest to use for road use. And i really want to push the boat out here, i'm talking good road engine with plenty of useable (reliable) power, good brakes (does anyone know of an ABS setup out there??), decent 'box (are the Porsche transaxles the best bang per buck), decent aircon (not a flimsy 8x10" unit) etc etc...

I'm not suggesting a gin palace because that is NOT in the spirit of the GT40, just something that can get to the South of France and back, for example, without blistering my butt off, with a degree of safety and not making my wife want to kill me.....

I think you get the general idea...

I'm new to this forum, but have always put the '40 on a pedastal and i WILL get one, i just need all your advice to make sure i can spec the one that will work for me best.

Anyone who responds to this gets my heary thanks, and i'll buy them a pint (when we meet up )

Thanks

Graham

 

[Jack]

Although a bit biased, I believe the RCR-40 is the best "bang" for the buck. Lots of room in the cockpit, etc. With an engine bay that will fit almost any engine it's difficult to go wrong. A SBF with an inverted Porsche 930 gearbox is a wonderful combination for a road car. IMHO.

 

[Ian Anderson]

You are joking?

South of France in a GT40 - I'd say any of them will do it (even mine)

Some will be more comfortable than others with better aircon

Others will be less tiring because the cockpit is better sound insulated

But you're not going to get much / any luggage worth anything into the car - basically the doors are your luggage compartment. Or tow a trailer!
I Did Le Mans classic last year camping by myself and the passenger area was full to the window!

For road cruising any ot the boxes will survive UN1, Audi, Porsche ZFQ and RBT is the order I would put them for cost in the UK - the ZFQ is getting very goods results and could be worth shelling out the extra cash as it supposedly handles the higher torque levels better.

Ian

 

[40 Bud]

Graham, you can make most all of the replicas comfortable and a good cruiser. I have a 15 year old GTD. The seat area has been lowered 3/4". I am 6 feet tall and fit fine with a helmet on. I would not lower the floor any further because of the ground clearance. It is very east to raise the center section and everything to match, by about 3/4". If you still need more room you can always add the Bubble and remove the seat adjusting rails. I have done all of these things to different GTD's that I have had a hand in building. The A/C can be greatly improved from the standard GTD by simply plumbing a much larger condenser at the front of the radiator. When I moved mine, all but the return line and a short flexible line from the sill to the compressor are done in hard line stainless steel with "O" rings. I have taken this car on trips to Los Angeles (350mile) in summer and many times on shorter trips of about 150 miles in hot weather with comfort. The sills behind the gas tanks, the rear bulkhead and the area were the steering rack is located are all heavily insulated with a combination of hard foam,marine expandable foam and fiberglass matting to minimize noise and heat.

 

[Tim Kay]

http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-build-logs/11907-roaring-forties-gt40-43-a-2.html

Hershal Byrd was a regular here (miss ya Hershal) and he probably did more travels with his Roaring Forty than most of us do with our 40' coaches.

Any current manufactured 40 will do what your asking rightly sorted. mho

 

[Graham]

Thanks to all you guys. its nice to know that there is a wealth of experience out there. I feel like a bit of a leech, sucking out your information, but i hope that one day i can pay it back...

Again, many thanks,

Graham

 

[Cliff Beer]

Hi Graham, to put it bluntly, just about any GT40 is not a great road car for a drive to the south of france with your wife, unless you both have a very healthy sense of adventure.

For one, there's no luggage space. And, it's noisey, comes with a harsh ride, can be hot even with air con, weather protection is minimal, there are no safety bumpers, etc. If your wife is like most women, she won't be happy in a GT40 for very long.

If you don't mind me saying, asking which GT40 is most comfortable is kind of like asking what feels better, a hammer to the head, a brick dropped on your foot, or being run down by a motorbike. I love my GT40 more than any other car in my garage, but, if I'm driving to the south of france I'm taking either my ferrari or my porsche or my mercedes.....

 

[Simon]

Graham,
When you build an engine, don't be tempted to get one in too high a state of tune. Get it built for torque and tractability over outright power, you'll drive and enjoy the car FAR more.
Simon

 

[Dean Lampe]

I want to agree with the posts above and stress that this is a race car, even with street tires. It will leak, it will be loud, you will never find all the rattles, it is tight and there is no room for even a spare pair of your shoes! I would hate to see you go down this road and be disappointed. That being said, it is the most fun I have had on 4 wheels!

 

[Mike Pass]

Hi Graham,
Given that this is basically a race car I find it fairly comfortable on a long journey(eg Manchester - Le Mans). I have the 15" wheels with high profile tyres so the ride is OK especially with the adjustable shocks at a soft setting. The seats in replicas are very variable. I have tried most of them and it is well worth spending a lot of time getting comfortable. I have a bad back so need a good lumbar support so I use an extra cushion. I find the GTD seats are the most comfy as the base is quite deep and soft and squashes when you press the pedals. Sound insulation is well worth doing as this can get wearing after 10 hours! Most of the noise comes through the front footwell area (tyre roar) and through the rear bulkhead (engine roar). The engine is not too bad but the road roar is "tyring". Both these areas will benefit from a good dose of the usual sound proofing methods of anti vibration pads and padding. They make a big difference to sound transmission and panel boom. Test by tapping a plain ally panel and and one which has pads and padding - huge difference.
I have the standard gtd aircon and it struggles in very hot weather but is still a godsend. I would suggest that you have a really effective engine cooling system as in really very hot weather I have to turn off the aircon as the heat from the aircon rad causes the engine to overheat in traffic. This is when you really need aircon. If you hit a big roadblock on a very hot day then after 3 hours of stop start you can still get fried. I also have helocopter vents in the side windows which work well if still moving as they can scoop in a good flow of cooler air.
There is not much you can do about the non existent luggage space. You can get some stuff down behind the seats and in the doors. The area at the back of the sill next to your shoulder will take a soft bag. On my car which has a deep double nostril there is a small luggage compartment in the vee shaped bit in the centre. If you are solo then the passenger seat will take a decent sized bag etc.
I would echo Simon's advice re the tractability issue. Cammy engines are fun and sound great but are a royal pain in traffic as any fluffing and spluttering will soon drive you nuts.
It will also do severe damage to your fuel consumption. Use a road based cam and if you want more power go for bigger capacity. A road tractable 347 will give 400+ hp and be an easy driver. A 427ci (stroked 351) will give 500hp and be a reasonable drive in traffic. Get the engine set up so it runs smoothy and well at tickover and small throttle openings and this will make everyday driving a breeze.
Most gearboxes are OK but spend time on the gear linkage to get and accurate smooth change to make driving a pleasure and not a pain.
Pay attention to little things like washers and wipers as a greasy screen is a nightmare.
Spend a lot of time tracking down leaks. This is a tedious process but the right rubber mouldings and their fit pays dividends. Drive the car in heavy rain and hunt down and eliminate the leaks. I have ridden in a forty which leaked a lot and a day spent with a wet arse is not very funny.
Basically anything which makes life comfortable, effective and easy is a good thing in my view and will add to the fun of driving one of these cars. I can definitely say that I have had more fun driving one than anything else I have ever tried.
Hope this helps.
Cheers
Mike

 

[40 Bud]

Cliff, about the only thing you said that I can agree with, is that there isn't any luggage room. Every other issue can be addressed an solved. Granted it will never be a limo ride but it can certainly be made into a great sports tourer. My Bilstein shock/spring package works well on the track and rides better than a lot of street cars on the road. It is dry in the rain-however you do have to be careful when you open the doors after being in the wet. The water behind the rubber tends to get "vacuumed" out on your head if you open the door quickly. You have to make up your mind on street or track use. The more you tend toward the track the less hospitable it will be on the street. Since I glued in the side windows and elimenated the vent windows and hardware, the rattles are almost non existant. When you do this the helicopter vents are mandatory!

 

[Cliff Beer]

Cliff, about the only thing you said that I can agree with, is that there isn't any luggage room. Every other issue can be addressed an solved. Granted it will never be a limo ride but it can certainly be made into a great sports tourer. My Bilstein shock/spring package works well on the track and rides better than a lot of street cars on the road. It is dry in the rain-however you do have to be careful when you open the doors after being in the wet. The water behind the rubber tends to get "vacuumed" out on your head if you open the door quickly. You have to make up your mind on street or track use. The more you tend toward the track the less hospitable it will be on the street. Since I glued in the side windows and elimenated the vent windows and hardware, the rattles are almost non existant. When you do this the helicopter vents are mandatory!

Hi, I'm sure you're right - with some attention and care many of these shortcomings can be moderated to the point of being livable, even on a long ride. My sense is that it takes quite some time and energy to address all the issues, and in the end you only get 80% there. In other words, it's still relatively noisy, somewhat poorly ventilated/heat/cooling, somewhat rough riding, no roll up/down windows, etc. These aren't problems that most high end production sports cars have to a significant degrees ie. porsche, ferrari, etc. It just doesn't seem a valid comparison to me to compare a GT40, even the best and most well-sorted one, with a production car. The lack of any safety features (airbags, abs, bumpers, crumple zones, etc.) is just one more glaring difference.

That's not to say that the experience isn't unique and a whole lot more thrilling - it is!

And, as far as female passengers go, I don't know of one woman who would want to spend more than an hour in a GT40 under just about any conditions. If you want to keep your female companion happy on a long trip to the south of France then drive a mercedes and be sure to stop for three square a day...

 

[Ian Anderson]

What is possible?

Last year over our summer??????
Wife and I went from home (near Heathrow) to Liverpool (About 220 miles each way) for a weekend to visit the "in laws".


It was predicted to be a wet weekend and the weather did it's best to wash the paint off my car on Saturday and then again Sunday morning. But it was dry for the drive up on Friday and again dry for the trip back on Sunday evening.

We packed in zip plastic bags (To waterproof for just in case!) and stashed our clothes in the door pockets. I had also sourced a desktop computer for the nephew and "bungee corded" it into the side of the footwell on the passenger side.

After 30 minutes of slow haul (25mph stuff) on M25 on Friday evening I shouted over if she wanted to get the "normal car" No way - keep going.

On the trip back she had borrowed a travel neck pillow and slept!

Much more than this distance and I think the complaints would have been never ending!

Ian

 

[JohnMcL]

Nobody mentions fitting insulated luggage boxes either side of the gearbox. Is there some reason? I have been planning on using them but if they don't work that may be the end of the fantasy.
John Mcloughlin

 

[Ian Anderson]

John

Frank Catt makes and fits these to GTD's

I must say I am looking at these too but wonder about the heat, fumes getting into the clothes, and also potential water penetration

Ian

 

[Graham]

Hi guys,

WOW. What fantastic feedback from you all. In my original question i asked the questions to get "the most comfortable". in this, i made an error. I should have said "The least uncomfortable"

I agree, a trip to the South of France would always be taken in my Porker, but the question asked has produced all the right answers.

I agree with all your thoughts re engine: Not too cammy, plenty of useable power, but one question: is Fuel injection better that Carbs from a useability / reliability point of view? i would guess so, but your thoughts are invited please.

Also in respect to Aircon, i see there are ways to fit a larger condensor which is good news.

One other question that no one has managed to help me with as yet... Is there an ABS braking option for the '40?

I don't really care personally, but it IS a way to persuade my missus that its safe to get into (if she can)

Also the issue of sound deadening is a good one. I have been a part time musician and have come across some very good sound squelching products over the years. You guys might try googling "Studio sound deadening material" and see what yuo get. you never know, it might help for those of you who want to take some of the road noise out of your travels.

As i said earlier, i don't want a gin palace, but something that i can use relatively frequently for short breaks with friends and the wife...

Haev any of you guys got the removeable door top option, for sunny open top days? If so, can you let me know if its a reliable and easy to use system and what (if any) the downsides are.

Once again, many thanks to all you guys for your input. It has been lodged in my brain and is starting to form a mental picture of which way i should go.

Cheers!

Graham

 

[Malcolm]

To make any make of 40 easy to drive on the road, simply avoid going for switch like on/off power with engine, be sensible about choice of gearbox set up so the clutch is not too heavy, get a your gear shift system light, get comfy seats, don't run too hard suspension (rising rate springs work well here), get air con that works ie choose a decent compressor and place the rad sensibly for cool air, and wear earplugs for once the novelty of the engine noise wears off.

These often being self build cars, it is your choice how comfy you want your car to be. This applies to all makes of 40. If you buy one ready built, it isn't too difficult to soften a car up.

 

[DaveM]

The rear luggage boxes are a nice addition. I fabricated my own (SPF with RBT). They are watertight and fairly heat resistant if you use both aluminized exterior heat shield and felt interior insulation. You couldn't fit a suitcase in them, but mine are approximately 15"x10"x23"h. Is the GT40 a long distance touring car? Obviously not, but how many other true race cars can be this much fun on the highway?

 

[Mike Christian]

get a Ford GT

 

[Mike Pass]

Fuel injection will be very good and reliable but...
It is costly. You have to buy either a four barrell setup to replace the holley or a set of 8 single throttle bodies/ 4 IDA style throttle bodies + manifold. Then a setup to feed fuel and return from twin tanks to a swirl pot, then a high pressure system to the injectors, regulator and return. You then need an ecu to run the system Weber Alpha, Motec, DTA etc.. Then you need to factor in a setup session on the rolling road which will take 3-4 hours which will not be cheap. You will end up with a setup which is similar to a modern car for drivability etc. but cost it up and the total will be considerable. I reckon £5,000.
A Holley costs about £300. Guess what I have.
On the lady passenger bit - we have two ladies from up here in the North who did the trip to Le Mans in 2008 and who loved every minute of it. If the ladies want some attention then just sit in a parked 40 with the door open in France! Also park your 40 anywhere and you get mobbed - this doesn't happen in "ordinary" cars.
I don't know anything about removable door tops but I would guess that fitting it accurately and making it waterproof will be a nightmare.
Cheers
Mike