Ok I am kind of pumped about this.

Well look who must be getting bored with making left turn only tracks.

The Nürburgring is arguably one of the most impressive tracks in the worlds. The famous German circuit located in the Eifel mountains, is known for its motorsports history, length and challenge it provides. Therefore the Nürburgring a major attraction for petrol heads from all over the world.

Besides being a driving enthusiasts’ Valhalla, the Ring serves nowadays as a demanding proving ground for car manufacturers and media. Many of them use the 22,8km long Nordschleife as a standard to publish their lap times achieved with their cars and sometimes even unveil a special Nürburgring Edition. This might upset Top Gear host James May, who has regularly expressed his dissatisfaction with the influence of the track when it’s used by car makers to develop new models. But the huge impact of the Nürburgring inspires other people.

Bruton Smith, the CEO of Speedway Motorsports, has proposed to build an exact replica of the German circuit in Nevada. In an interview with SiriusXM Sports he talked about possibly building a duplicate of the Nürburgring outside of Las Vegas. The 84-year-old Smith has been talking to the Governor and the Bureau of Land Management (BLM), which administers over 75% of the land in Nevada. Smith wants the BLM to donate 8,000 acres (32 km²) of land for the project.

If this project gets the green light from the authorities, Smith will ‒ with some help of engineers in Germany ‒ create an exact replica of the Nürburgring. He also said this track wouldn’t be used for racing, but for only testing. A major benefit of this proposed circuit is the fact is could be used 12 months a year, which according to Smith is not possible in Germany. The Nevada Ring could be used by car manufacturers as well as individuals.

This idea might seem a little bit far stretched, but let’s not forget this is Las Vegas ‒ a city filled with replicas of Paris, Venice, New York and more. But the myth of the Nürburgring in Germany is not only created by its history, but also by the regions sometimes challenging weather. While Las Vegas enjoys abundant sunshine year-round, this can’t be said about the original track in Germany.

source: gtspirit.com nogripracing.com

I like the idea I just don't want a turn for turn replica. If I had his money I would build me own little fun land. Not a public course.
The problem I see with this and as most have commented on (on other forums) is that it will be no where near the same thing. There is no way they are going to get all of the elevation changes, bumps etc. correct as it's not just the direction that makes that track what it is. This is going to be a huge failure in terms of replicating the track in any authentic way but it will be nice to have in general. I wonder if they are going to replicate the Disney castle (the castle there was the inspiration for the disney world castle). I would love it if they did it but I just don't think it's going to happen or be any where near the same.
It's already destined to fail since it will NOT be open to the public or used for racing and this is just a HORRIBLE attempt to have american car makers be able to say "look how fast out car goes around the ring" even though it's going to be flat as a pancake. It's a sad sad ruse if you ask me. Read my previous post for a major reason why.

Seymour Snerd

Lifetime Supporter
There is no way they are going to get all of the elevation changes, bumps etc. correct..

Unless you're a world-class civil engineer I don't see why I should believe your assertion that it's impossible. Conceptually it can be rather simple; it would be completely feasible to measure a precise mathematical model of the surface of the original track.​

Recreating that model physically is (conceptually) a matter of moving dirt around until the copy matches the original. A lot of dirt. And obviously the site chosen would have a strong effect on the amount of remaining work. But again, equipped with a model of the existing surface and existing geodatabases of the Nevada landscape the optimal location could be computed. This is all within the scope of exisitng and mature technology.​

Whether it makes economic sense is another matter entirely but if you have some proof that it's technically unachievable I'd like to see it.

And as for "let’s not forget this is Las Vegas ‒ a city filled with replicas of Paris, Venice, New York ..."

Yes, laughably bad small scale "tributes". Anyone who thinks those are replicas needs to travel a bit more. But hey, this is automotive journalism where the reader is assumed to have the IQ of a slug.
LoL, sorry ....every morning there exactly that one person that steps out of bed and makes me laugh ....

My house is is about 70-80km far away from "The Ring" and I have been there many times since I am allowed to drive things with an engine on board....

"The Ring" is more than just dirt, asphalt, curves and straight lines....this guy perhaps has never been in a race car driving around it...
I don't want to sound arrogant but Mr.Smith come back if you know what I am talking about ...

I'll be an even bigger a$$ than you and say that it is imposible to get it 100% correct because at any given point in time the asphalt expands and contracts not only affecting the angle (regardless of how miniscule) of some turns but also allows some of the oils that have seeped in to come up which changes the adhesion of the surface and that is something that has taken the tracks entire existence to mature to it's current state. Lets no even get into the cracks bumps etc that change yearly as the surface expands and contracts. See I can be just as much of a clown as you but you knew darn well the point that I was getting at so lets just leave the snobbery towards one another out of this O.K.

Seymour Snerd

Lifetime Supporter
Damian -- what's with the name-calling? I don't see how that helps your case.

It is kind of sad that in this culture whenever someone proposes to do something gutsy or difficult there's a Greek chorus on the side lines ready to explain how it can't be done or is a terrible idea. Same mentality that sneered when Ford said they were going to win at Le Mans. But hey, the guys over on the Crown Vic forum agree with you that it can't be done.

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
Making an exact copy, in theory should be possible, highly unlikely but in theory........

But something that might be more possable. I have thought for a long time that someone should build a circuit made up of racings greatest corners.

You could have (in any order) La Source, leading down to Eau Rouge, through Raidillom, the Karussell, then leading into the Lesmos, followed by Tarzan, through the Masta Kink, the R130, Pouhon, the Corkscrew and Finish with the Parabolic.

You would be much more likely to find a suitable site, if you were allowed to change the order and location of the turns.
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Jim Rosenthal

I think it's a stupid idea. And I think he's stupid for having it. Has anyone proposed building a golf course composed of copies of the "greatest holes of each golf course"? I didn't think so. And a replica NurburgRing is equally foolish.

A race course out in the desert? Fine. Great idea. A copy of a race course in Germany? Totally idiotic. The whole point of the original course is that it was built in that place to conform with the local topography. If he wants to build a race course in the desert, at least he ought to build something that takes into account the local topography in that area.

Further the affiant sayeth not, in order to avoid any more name-calling.

Seymour Snerd

Lifetime Supporter
Further the affiant sayeth not, in order to avoid any more name-calling.

Jimbo -- I think you just called Jim Craik stupid. So you perhaps should have sayeth'ed not a little earlier.

Actually I like that golf course idea, so that "logic" doesn't work either.

"Greatest Hits" have been economic successes in record albums, chocolates, tasting menus, art museums, symphony programs, college survey courses, car shows, magazines, etc., for years. What's wrong with doing the same thing with holes in the ground and turns in the road?

"The whole point of the original course is that it was built in that place to conform with the local topography".

That's the whole point? I don't think so. The whole point was to create a safe place to race cars because doing so on public roads was dangerous. Following the local topography is a rather obvious way to do that unless you're a total idiot or you own the grading company that contracts for the work.

Also, BTW, according to wikipedia the original course was designed to resemble Targa Florio. So all this puritan angst about "copying" is a little incestuous.

And you're a poopy-head. So there. :laugh:

Jim Craik

Lifetime Supporter
I have been called many things, I can take it......but nobody calls Jack Nicklaus "stupid":)

Bear’s Best Las Vegas is a unique golf course made up of 18 holes hand selected by Jack Nicklaus from his 270 designs worldwide. This high-end daily fee course includes manicured bent grass greens, challenging designs, and immaculate fairway/tee complexes.
More power to anyone wishing to do this! As long as I can drive it, I'm in favor..
Is it possible to duplicate the topo, yes it is. Is it possible to emulate the ambiance, history and actual conditions, no way! Would I like to see it done, yes.
The Nurburgring is an iconic track, currently unique and available to all comers as lomg as you have a licence and can get there and pay the "toll" To replicate it an any form in the US would allow Americans to experience what us Europeans have been able to do relatively easily for some time. if I was an American and would be allowed to drive it would I want it? absolutley yes. Would it be the same 100% to the original? Absolutly no. The original has very little in the way of run offs and many trees to run into if you are not careful, I would expect that in these days of health and safety they would want to include safe run offs and more open areas. It would still be a great track to drive and might make these Americans able to make a car capable of going round bends ;-). Come on you nay sayers - you know if it is built you would want to try it.
I live in Vegas - and all I have to say is if they go about 55 minutes outside town you can be in the mountains and have some serious fun if the guys with the gigantic budgets show up to move all the dirt.

We're talking tons of trees, cold weather in the winter - outside Vegas isn't just dirt. Not sure about an exact copy, but they should make a North American version with a ton of corners, tricky layout and huge elevation changes. I'd vote for something original though - truly pick the brains of the greatest drivers/crews and come up with something that equates to what the 'Ring was when it was first designed.
What should we call the proposed Nevada course?...

The "Brown Hell"?

BTW, I was at "the ring" about a month ago (closed for winter). I just can't see making anything even remotely resembling that track in Nevada. It's not just the topography, much of the beauty and challenge of "the ring" is in the surrounding forrest and the fact that it can be raining on one side of the track, sunny on the other.

That said, I'd love to drive either.