Scotts build thread

[Fran Hall RCR]

The wheels are huge pumps...they create turbulence and pressure is built up around them....
Scott, the guy that did the aero studies and works for me as a sub contract engineer is ex McLaren...P1, 12c and F1 are all projects he was heavily involved in...no rookie playing with wool tufts.

Look at any aero traces and you will see the wheels and wheel houses as being the most problematic...especially the front

 

[Justin]

Wheels within wheel wells are like turbines without an outlet.

 

[Scott Rowland]

Here is a design that I think fits the new front better and smooth with body that I was looking for.

 

[Scott Rowland]

Wheels within wheel wells are like turbines without an outlet.

I think I just made the connection of the force being applied (which is what I was looking for) to create the pressure. Centrifugal force in my best guess.
A turbine with no inlet, or outlet, should not be able to create a force until it reached a certain speed, then the weight of the air itself would be forced to the outside (in this case the fender acting as the enclosure) in turn creating a higher pressure towards the outside. I'm just trying to figure out the exact forces applied to help create solutions.
In this situation, not fuck all you can do except vent fenders. Haha. :thumbsup:

Edit, mag-lev could cure it though! I also keep waiting for a guy to run electro magnets to attract to the concrete patches on track from the rebar in it. Lol.

 

[Rebeca Lynn]

I think those would look great for the street with your headlight design. Possible find a way to make them removable and just a trim ring set-up for track use, if you plan on using the car much on the track.

 

[Tom]

LMP's used to use louver style vents (see Audi R8) and then went to the big openings. It was part of the effort to control flipping and whatnot, but also because the louvers were always getting chopped off by debris coming from the tires and then leaving sharp carbon fiber shards to cut other cars tires.

I find the big openings not very attractive (like the Big Honkin Fin), but they are functional.

 

[Henry]

I had the privilege of stopping in and checking out Scotts car. Being the first SLC I've seen in person it was amazing to finally be able to size it up. The modifications being done are very well thought out and look killer in person. Scott was generous enough to show me around for over two hours and we brainstormed a bit about the brake ducts and front end. Thanks again Scott, can't wait to check back in in a few months.

Hank

 

[Larry L.]

I have the g50/01 transaxle with lsd. I am going to upgrade to the graziano at some point before it is called done.

Thanks! :thumbsup:

 

[Larry L.]

Deleted this post!

'Pretty much duplicated what others have already mentioned (about the f.f. vents).

(I should really read everything that follows the post to which I intend to reply BEFORE doing so. :shifty

 

[Scott Rowland]

I had the privilege of stopping in and checking out Scotts car. Being the first SLC I've seen in person it was amazing to finally be able to size it up. The modifications being done are very well thought out and look killer in person. Scott was generous enough to show me around for over two hours and we brainstormed a bit about the brake ducts and front end. Thanks again Scott, can't wait to check back in in a few months.

Hank

Thanks Hank. Be safe until you get back. :thumbsup:

 

[Larry L.]

Hmmm, maybe it will grow on me. Little early to tell if it ultimately will look better. Will continue refining.

Scott. I like the idea a lot and have been pondering something similar myself, but I was thinking of following the body line more and not be as high. I like the look of this.

'Serious question:

If these vertical stabilizers provide a distinct aero/handling advantage over a 'stock' SL-C (and ASSUMING they're legal in the NASA super unlimited class or in whatever class the SL-C was designed to compete), why didn't Fran's aero man recommend/insist they be a "stock" feature on the SL-C?

Personally, I L-I-K-E the looks of 'em and would retrofit my SL-C with one in a heartbeat regardless if I owned one, but, I'm curious as to why they're not on the car 'as delivered' if they in fact provide a big advantage on a road course or whatever? :shrug:

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

They don't improve lap times at the grip levels we run....we do not have the downforce of an LMP1 or the corner speeds.....no other full body cars do actually...they are in place to stop cars flipping over sideways...its a rule within the ACO regulations.

The large fins make the car very difficult to drive in crosswinds too...so says an LMP1 Peugeot guy we know.

 

[Larry L.]

Thanks, Fran.

I knew there had to be a reason(s)...

 

[Tom]

The large fins make the car very difficult to drive in crosswinds too...so says an LMP1 Peugeot guy we know.

That makes a lot of sense, it's like a 2'X6' sail on the back of the car.

They are great sponsor billboards for sure!

 

[Scott Rowland]

When I first saw them, I thought it was there to clean up the air going to the wing. Seems that to aid in preventing car from flipping over, it could work for ya or against ya depending on situation.

 

[Mark Bajus]

I havent seen it photoshopped or anything, but I think the

Ferrari FXX K style rear wing, with the uprights moulded into the rear fenders, and with a full width wing, would look great.​

 

[Scott Rowland]

So many ideas I have going around for the back. Hopefully start on it in a few weeks.

 

[Les]

Dear Scott:

What is happening here?

If you do not have experience in this field, simply posting a picture of a flipping race car . . . to possibly discredit the design, is along the lines of scare tactics.

Me? Scare YOU? Hahahahahaha! Nah!!

Me? Discredit your design? No way!

What is happening here?

What is happening here is the normal, messy human-to-human process of communication, aided and hindered by the electronic medium through which you and I communicate: the forum board.

When you started your build thread and I started reading it, both you and I did not know a lot of things (be patient! Just follow along a bit longer).

Here is an example you gave of something you did not know of before you encountered it:

Got to admit, I was not very pleased with my work on the e-brake set up, nor the room it was going to take up in the center where i had run the cables. . . . In comes American Shifter Co. with what appears to be the answer for me.

You did not know something, you found out, you learned, and you changed it.

Here is what I did NOT know about you before the aerodynamic question of your SLC came up: your aims and your methodology.

What DID I know before the aeronose question arose?

Granted, it has not been wind tunnel tested, but from my knowledge, neither has any other kit or component car that is used as a track mule or race car.

On the contrary . . . this kitcar company does do real Aero development. . . . I have full surface scan data for the SLC and we were sponsored by a CFD company while racing the factory car.
The guy running the CFD is ex McLaren and he did the MP4 12 C and P1 aero studies So as I said we did many hundreds of connotations of Aero and it's amazing how small of a change makes a big difference.

18th December 2012, 02:00 PM #2

Re: Aero tweaks?
We spent months last winter doing CFD work on the whole car ...

No one thing made the difference ...a whole laundry list of small tweeks added upto 390kg more front downforce with an overall drag reduction of 15%.

The front splitter is now a true wing profile and we pull air over the top of the car from the high pressure area under the splitter.
The rad is now moved forward and laid down more too....

Canards are no longer needed ...the car ran the original race tail in 2012 as opposed to the street tail in 2011...

Old 26th June 2014, 08:35 AM

. . . The stock SLC is a very slippery package as designed, our full race aero package gives us well over 1000lbs of downforce at 100mph , this is obviously significant and the feedback I have had from every driver pro and semi pro that has driven the 01 car is that "this is how an aero car should feel"...not bad for a car you can buy in pieces and assemble in your garage...

So, Scott, because I knew what Fran and team had done, and I did not know that you would pull back a design that is unsafe, I posted the cautionary photo of the Porsche. As you yourself noted, even Porsche, with all their computers and history and knowledge, did not account for a car that

. . . crested a hill under acceleration while following a car generating dirty air in the rain . . .

So, who is afraid?

Me.

For whom am I afraid?

You.

What am I afraid of?

Your safety.

BUT, NOW I know that you are:

. . . Just trying to explain abit of why I did what I did and the theories behind it.

and that you have

. . . have really spent months in the background designing the body to be as functional as possible, with looks falling to the second consideration.

and

. . . if I had one smidgen of an idea that my design would have negative effects or generate lift at speed, I would not have gone through with it.

to the extent that

I have zero problem with having a competitive driver test the nose on the west coast, so I could drive it to them and be there for the testing at my expense . . .

because

. . . I also encourage any people that have experience in testing aero dynamics to speak up if they see a problem with the design. . . . I do love a good technical debate. Keep it technical with good examples, and i have no problem listening and going into further detail.

The time lag of the forum introduced the misunderstanding.

Fortunately, you told me (and all of us) more about yourself and your design goals, and Fran is telling you more about the SLC's aerodynamics.

Whew!

You are in good hands.

Les

 

[Keith]

The flipping car was a Mercedes, not a Porsche.

 

[Ken Roberts]

The flipping car was a Mercedes, not a Porsche.

The other famous "flipping car" was a Porsche at Road Atlanta.