Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
1966 GT40? Yeah Right!
- Thread starter Pete
- Start date
Pat Buckley
GT40s Supporter
Apparently at 188 mph it becomes unstable.
What if there is a stout headwind?
What if there is a stout headwind?
that one had a 302, this one an FE 427. big difference
hoppy
Lifetime Supporter
I realise the different engines from the description,what I am stating is that the pic second from the left in the second row of the above link is the same pic that was used for the Barrett-Jackson thread.
So obviously one of them is wrong or there is two identical cars with different engines and the owner(s) decided to do just one photo shoot.
Good catch, and they share more than one photo if you look at both listings. Must both be Holman Moody cars. Since the BJ one sold for 80 with no miles, it makes this one look way high at 50K more, even with its 427. Real money on this car today is low 90's at best.
An observation...
There's probably quite a few guys around that wish they were at B-J Palm Beach last weekend. The purchase price of the small block SPF GT40 was an outright steal, not an indication of either the market, true value or cost of these cars (or any high end GT40 replica for that matter). As already stated by Spyder Mike, it costs over 100k to build one, even at the early price.
80k was what a car could be bought for on that day, and that day only. What about the alumimum body Kirkham Cobra big block car going for 55k? Absolute insanity. Have all Kirkhams just tanked? of course not.
On the flip side, had there been a couple of guys at B-J hot to buy the SPF GT40 you could have seen over retail, given that it's a brand new, pro built car and available now. 120k would not have been unimaginable.
To the unitiated (you haven't built one or more yet) the real costs and degree of difficulty in building a GT40 replica is just not apparent or easily valued. Even the worlds' largest replica manufacturer had to apologize for substantial price increases, having under-estimated the exact same things.
So the point I'm getting to is that you should be prepared to pay a good chunk of change for a hand built GT that can give todays best "Supercars" a run for their money. These are not one peice bathtub style mould, dune buggy bodies on old VW pans. If you want a sorted out, pro built, ready to drive, quality GT40 reproduction, please don't expect it at home built kit car prices or less than the sum value of the parts alone.
Cheers
There's probably quite a few guys around that wish they were at B-J Palm Beach last weekend. The purchase price of the small block SPF GT40 was an outright steal, not an indication of either the market, true value or cost of these cars (or any high end GT40 replica for that matter). As already stated by Spyder Mike, it costs over 100k to build one, even at the early price.
80k was what a car could be bought for on that day, and that day only. What about the alumimum body Kirkham Cobra big block car going for 55k? Absolute insanity. Have all Kirkhams just tanked? of course not.
On the flip side, had there been a couple of guys at B-J hot to buy the SPF GT40 you could have seen over retail, given that it's a brand new, pro built car and available now. 120k would not have been unimaginable.
To the unitiated (you haven't built one or more yet) the real costs and degree of difficulty in building a GT40 replica is just not apparent or easily valued. Even the worlds' largest replica manufacturer had to apologize for substantial price increases, having under-estimated the exact same things.
So the point I'm getting to is that you should be prepared to pay a good chunk of change for a hand built GT that can give todays best "Supercars" a run for their money. These are not one peice bathtub style mould, dune buggy bodies on old VW pans. If you want a sorted out, pro built, ready to drive, quality GT40 reproduction, please don't expect it at home built kit car prices or less than the sum value of the parts alone.
Cheers
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
I totally agree Ian, but as always the marketplace will decide.
I agree with Canuk but even though it is a small block, does'nt mean it's less exspensive. For what I spent on my small block, I could have bought a big block. I did not see the B J car but any anycase, that was a steal of a price. when I was at the IL. Autobahn last summer, I battled the tour event with the SPF GT40 MII forum club member, and I have to say it is VERY impressive and alot of car for the money.
I remember 10 years ago, I was at Fremont Ford. They had 3 Superformance Cobras on display $69,999 without engine and trans. They offered Ford’s 460 crate motor and a 5speed tranny installed for a total sum of $85000.
Today you can pick up a used one (with 3-5000 mile) for $45000. There are more Cobras in my area than Mini Coopers. No one even takes a second glance. You can pickup a none Superformance for $25000. That was one of the reasons why I sold mine, the BLING FACTOR was dead
IMHO, the same thing will happen to all of our PLASTIC none 60s vintage GTs. Eventually there will be so many of them around that you can pick up any of them between $30-50K.
I think the lucky guys are the ones who have bought Plastic T70s, the ever so UGLY MK4s and the ever so beautiful 917. “Uniqueness” (not seeing the damn thing at every coffee shop) is what makes them hold there value not the,,,,,
”mine is not a kit,,but a continuation BS”,,,If not built and raced in 60s, don’t fool yourself.
Francis, one of these days, I will sell my Plastic GTD and come to your RCR facility and pick up one of your kits. The only thing I ask is a “copy” of it can (or ANYTHING similar) NOT be sold to anyone else
Today you can pick up a used one (with 3-5000 mile) for $45000. There are more Cobras in my area than Mini Coopers. No one even takes a second glance. You can pickup a none Superformance for $25000. That was one of the reasons why I sold mine, the BLING FACTOR was dead
IMHO, the same thing will happen to all of our PLASTIC none 60s vintage GTs. Eventually there will be so many of them around that you can pick up any of them between $30-50K.
I think the lucky guys are the ones who have bought Plastic T70s, the ever so UGLY MK4s and the ever so beautiful 917. “Uniqueness” (not seeing the damn thing at every coffee shop) is what makes them hold there value not the,,,,,
”mine is not a kit,,but a continuation BS”,,,If not built and raced in 60s, don’t fool yourself.
Francis, one of these days, I will sell my Plastic GTD and come to your RCR facility and pick up one of your kits. The only thing I ask is a “copy” of it can (or ANYTHING similar) NOT be sold to anyone else
Thanks for the feedback, it's important to keep in mind that manufacturing GT40 replicas is a business not a hobby.
As material, energy, labour and regulatory costs keep rising the only price break comes from economy of scale and, as these will never be high volume cars, that won't amount to much.
I doubt that, because of the tooling commitment, cost of major componentry (ZFs, Pin Drive hubs, $400 headilghts, etc) plus the high expectations of the todays' consumer, you will ever see GT40s in the volume of Cobras.
Sure it won't be as rare as say an XJ13 Jaguar, but man, just look at the car! Nothing compares to a GT40.
Cheers
As material, energy, labour and regulatory costs keep rising the only price break comes from economy of scale and, as these will never be high volume cars, that won't amount to much.
I doubt that, because of the tooling commitment, cost of major componentry (ZFs, Pin Drive hubs, $400 headilghts, etc) plus the high expectations of the todays' consumer, you will ever see GT40s in the volume of Cobras.
Sure it won't be as rare as say an XJ13 Jaguar, but man, just look at the car! Nothing compares to a GT40.
Cheers
I would say anything over 50K is a good chunk of change, but so what?
Basically you have done a sales pitch but not really quantified anything. Yes these are great cars, and yes they are worth more than dune buggy bodies on old VW pans. That is why they don't sell for $2,500.
I just realized that the subject of this thread is car #224. It is the same car the current owner tried to sell on Ebay in January. It only bid to a little over 90K, but the buyer didn't perform even at that price and the deal fell through.
The fact is these cars, once built, are not worth the price of the components alone. That is why I probably will not build one, but will buy a completed car. I just don't really want to build one enough to justify actually paying more just for the privilege of doing so.
I know a lot of guys here love the building process and I understand that, in fact a friend of mine just spent more money outfitting his garage in anticipation of building his Ultima than the car itself will cost. (Sorry Fran, I really tried to get him to order an SLC).
My point is that people need to be realistic about these cars and their values: They will not go up in value, and they are worth less than than the sum of their parts.
More importantly, to me anyway: They are very close to the originals, but better in almost every way, they look fantastic and are an experience that to people like me is priceless. In that regard they are a bargain.
Pat Buckley
GT40s Supporter
Gee, thanks for telling us all exactly how it is.
What would we all do with out you?
What would we all do with out you?
Like they say: D' Nile ain't only a river. You're obviously a CAV guy getting pissy about my response to Ian. If you've something constructive to say......please do.
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“Uniqueness” (not seeing the damn thing at every coffee shop) is what makes them hold there value not the,,,,,
Francis, one of these days, I will sell my Plastic GTD and come to your RCR facility and pick up one of your kits. The only thing I ask is a “copy” of it can (or ANYTHING similar) NOT be sold to anyone else
But Fali, with your plastic GTD now out of production, you should therefore hang on to it as it will become rarer whereas RCRs will become common place.
Was thinking, to help with your bling fetish, when you come to a resrpay, why not go for a plastic film skin instead of paint and have one done in chrome finish!!!!!
I agree with Pete's original comment that the marketplace will decide.
The marketplace consists of buyers and sellers of a commodity. In this case the commodity is a GT40 recreation available in a broad range of completion, accuracy and performance.
The buyers are enthusiasts first and foremost as owning a GT40 is pure indulgance.
The right product for one person may be a 1/12 GMP model of 1075 whereas another will settle for nothing less than a spot on recreation, accurate to the last detail even if it takes 10 years to find all the right parts. Everything else is in between.
The sellers have to respect the buyers opinions and purchasing power to succeed. This applies to manufacturers as well as car or parts owners looking to sell.
The buyers have the power to drive a marketplace up or down according to his own standards.
There will inevitably be blips in any marketplace, particularily noticable in niche markets where a large deviation in price gets attention.
Like I said, the SPF GT40 could have gone at or over retail but the right guys weren't there (at B-J Palm Beach), same goes for the Kirkam. These cars are built by dedicated guys who've probably spit blood to see the product come to life. It's a shame but only a blip in the market. AND a couple of guys must be pretty happy with thier purchases!
It seems to me that for the most part, the GT40 replica marketplace is supported by manufacturers of excellent products and customers who appreciate what quality costs. Sellers offering junk suffer the consequenes and buyers expecting fire sale prices will be disapointed as no one caters to that buyer.
The current choices in GT40s replicas represents a higher quality, more complete and accurate product than has ever existed before so now is the time to buy. But what's right for you and don't get your knickers in a twist over future values or depreciation ( in which quality GT40s do better than most heavy metal anyways).
That's my opinion as someone heavily committed to this marketplace, not a sales pitch for my company or any other.
Cheers
The marketplace consists of buyers and sellers of a commodity. In this case the commodity is a GT40 recreation available in a broad range of completion, accuracy and performance.
The buyers are enthusiasts first and foremost as owning a GT40 is pure indulgance.
The right product for one person may be a 1/12 GMP model of 1075 whereas another will settle for nothing less than a spot on recreation, accurate to the last detail even if it takes 10 years to find all the right parts. Everything else is in between.
The sellers have to respect the buyers opinions and purchasing power to succeed. This applies to manufacturers as well as car or parts owners looking to sell.
The buyers have the power to drive a marketplace up or down according to his own standards.
There will inevitably be blips in any marketplace, particularily noticable in niche markets where a large deviation in price gets attention.
Like I said, the SPF GT40 could have gone at or over retail but the right guys weren't there (at B-J Palm Beach), same goes for the Kirkam. These cars are built by dedicated guys who've probably spit blood to see the product come to life. It's a shame but only a blip in the market. AND a couple of guys must be pretty happy with thier purchases!
It seems to me that for the most part, the GT40 replica marketplace is supported by manufacturers of excellent products and customers who appreciate what quality costs. Sellers offering junk suffer the consequenes and buyers expecting fire sale prices will be disapointed as no one caters to that buyer.
The current choices in GT40s replicas represents a higher quality, more complete and accurate product than has ever existed before so now is the time to buy. But what's right for you and don't get your knickers in a twist over future values or depreciation ( in which quality GT40s do better than most heavy metal anyways).
That's my opinion as someone heavily committed to this marketplace, not a sales pitch for my company or any other.
Cheers
Sheik Ur Boody..
I will gladly let you into my shop but whether we let you out would be another matter....
Malcolm,
thanks for the vote of confidence ..I hope you are right.
I will gladly let you into my shop but whether we let you out would be another matter....
Malcolm,
thanks for the vote of confidence ..I hope you are right.
