Abbey Panels chassis plate

[Mark knight]

Morning All. I purchased a car that we think was 60% completed around the 90’s. It has Girling brake calipers, a 1972 302 however built using Edlebrock heads/ carbs and inlet manifold developing 400bhp. Also the tyres are def 30 years old at least.

My question is this, the build chassis plate states Abbey Panels Coventry, and the date of manufacture reads May 1965. The car came with number plates however DVLA says they don’t exist.

This car was owned by a Russian millionaire back in the day who lived in London in a 3 storey property with a garage full of cars like Sierra Cosworth 2 x Lotus, and others.

After researching Abbey Panels, my chassis is Red in colour and isn’t monocoque in design however extremely well engineered.

I googled Motorsport rocker heads and they are not available anymore as far as I can see.

I also don’t want to reach out to the DVLA for more info just yet.

Apologies I do need to add a few more pics

Thanks

Mark

 

[Brian Magee]

Hi Mark,
What you have there is a GTD built in the 80's. the chassis plate is a fake. They have used a chassis number after the last original ones.
There should be a GTD chassis number on the top of the front 40mm chassis rail where the anti-roll bar is. There are people on here that can then identify the year of build.
Brian.

 

[Malcolm]

looks GTD to me too.

 

[Mark knight]

Gents, that’s amazing thank you. Ok, I’ll have dig and up load some pictures.

I really appreciate the support

Keep you posted

Mark

 

[Steve Dean]

Hi Mark,
Did the car come with a V5C ? It would be interesting to know if it ever passed an SVA test back in the day. As you may be aware the SVA is now called an IVA (Individual Vehicle Assessment) Test. A GTD from the 1980's would not pass an IVA. It could be brought up to date but will take a lot of work and parts changing/modifying.
The more information you can provide, then the more we can all help give input and guidance.
Best regards
Steve.

 

[Mark knight]

Hi all, just a quick update and not getting to concerned at the moment however, no sign of the chassis tag on the front bar. I have started removing the alloy panels covering the front area. I am convinced your comments are correct it’s GTD. Let’s see what tomorrow unveils.

Regards

Mark

 

[Mark knight]

Thanks Steve. This car I believe has been sat for 30 years and moth balled. The engine was bench tested at 400bhp according to the ladies daughter as the late ladies husband passed away some time ago which is why 2 of the cars in the family’s possession were sold to the gent I purchased the car from. No paperwork was provided during the previous purchase. Just to help join the dots up, I posted a box of bits to establish the authenticity of the fuel caps last week and a bunch of other parts including a set of Shelby heads, rad, ancillary parts. I believe a car enthusiast at this level wouldn’t have purchased something 30 odd years ago without it being authentic at the time if he was as wealthy as I was told. The Russian family are moving back to Russia at the end of this month which is why they found this box of bits. Appreciating your comments on an IVA I do support your comments on the workload ahead. If I can establish it’s history I’ll feel more comfortable regarding the game plan.

Thanks

Mark

 

[Lee Patterson]

One picture of the chassis will confirm what it most likely is. If it is a space frame (i.e. square tubes welded together) with aluminum paneling riveted to it, then it is some replica. A true Abbey Panels chassis is a pressed steel monocoque which by the one picture you have posted it isn't. It could be a GTD or Tornado based on the dates you state.

 

[Steve Dean]

Hi again Mark,
I can assure that this is not a genuine GT40. Post some more photo's and we will be able to identify which replica kit it was created from. The most likely candidates are GTD, KVA or possibly Tornado. It will be easy to tell.
It sounds like you don't have a V5C or any supporting paperwork, therefore the car will need a total rebuild to meet the current IVA standards.
You state that the Ford 302 engine is a 1972 block number ..... please confirm how you have ascertained this. If you give us the cylinder block number we can confirm its age. If it is 1972, then that is good news from an IVA point of view. However for IVA it will require an engine dating certificate. As the car has been built up from various donor vehicles it will be issued with a Q registration (assuming you have the time and can afford the large cost of rebuilding the car as many parts in an old GTD or KVA will fail the current IVA requirements).
Steve.

 

[Neil]

It is difficult for me to understand why people put up with regulations like this.

 

[Randy V]

Thanks Steve. This car I believe has been sat for 30 years and moth balled. The engine was bench tested at 400bhp according to the ladies daughter as the late ladies husband passed away some time ago which is why 2 of the cars in the family’s possession were sold to the gent I purchased the car from. No paperwork was provided during the previous purchase. Just to help join the dots up, I posted a box of bits to establish the authenticity of the fuel caps last week and a bunch of other parts including a set of Shelby heads, rad, ancillary parts. I believe a car enthusiast at this level wouldn’t have purchased something 30 odd years ago without it being authentic at the time if he was as wealthy as I was told. The Russian family are moving back to Russia at the end of this month which is why they found this box of bits. Appreciating your comments on an IVA I do support your comments on the workload ahead. If I can establish it’s history I’ll feel more comfortable regarding the game plan.

Thanks

Mark

Hi Mark…
The wealthy person that purchased this car would be far from the first person to have bought a replica car that was being sold as an original. Shelby Cobras and various GT40 marks seem to be the favorites of the cloning Shisters. Same for early Z28 Camaros, Hemi ‘Cudas and Boss Mustangs here in the USA.
You have come to the right place to get this car properly identified, but it will take more good photos.

 

[Mark knight]

Afternoon all. I’ve now given up today in the chassis number search to no avail!. So the manufacturer is definitely GTD I have looked at a car on line and even the radiator matches down to the stickers. The chsssis also matches along with the gel coat colour. ( that’s not conclusive but a start). I’m not bothered about an IVA I’ve already built a lotus 7 rep years ago managing an SVA and the rigmarole. I’m also building a 1947 belly tank racer from age related parts sourced in the US so I’m not worried about taking this one on. ( another tell tail sign, the pedal assembly on a GTD on line has them top mounted and not floor mounted as other manufacturers use).

I’ve taken some pics of where I believe the number should have been also a GTD on line , you can see the resemblance in the very nice red show car to my poorly looking example.

Anymore ideas on where to look next, I’ve almost stripped the front of rivets and panels.

The first pics are of mine and the remaining are vehicles on line.

I really appreciate your help in advance as this is becoming an obsession now .

 

[Mark knight]

Sorry I forgot to say where I have checked, in the photos you can see I’ve checked the master cylinder location and the door hinge area and both sides along with the top roll bar suspension struts and around the engine bay. You would think it’s sensible to stamp it where it can be inspected and not hunted for.

A few more pics of which matched a car on the website GTD40 which really wasn’t what I thought when I logged into it

Regards

Mark

 

[Steve Dean]

Hi Neil (in Tucson, Ariz).
The regulations here are now complex. It is still possible to build a GT40 and get it through our complex IVA regulations. Both AK Sportscars and Tornado are well versed in the requirements and the parts they supply in their kits are compliant. However the builder still needs to follow the IVA regs with a very close eye on the detail. The best way to go is to build the car with virtually all new parts with exceptions being the engine and transmission (although I would recommend people to use a new ZF gearbox).
In mainland Europe it's now getting close to being impossible and registering an old kit built car is extremely difficult.
Also here in the UK, you will NOT be able to register a new petrol (or diesel) car as from 2030.
By the way I'm in northern Arizona mid-late April (Williams, Kingman and Lake Havasu). Pity you're not closer .... we could have a beer.
Cheers
Steve.

 

[Steve Dean]

Mark ...... if this car has never been SVA tested and therefore NOT registered it very likely that a chassis number (VIN) has never been stamped into it. Back in the 80's you could make up your own letter/number sequence.
No doubt you will get lots of comments from other forum members but I have to say that looking at the photo's you've posted so far, you have a huge amount of work to do. I highly recommend that you talk to Andy at Tornado and Jon at AK Sportscars and tell them what you are thinking of undertaking and discussing the viability of using some of their IVA compliant parts.
Steve.

 

[Neil]

Hi Neil (in Tucson, Ariz).
The regulations here are now complex. It is still possible to build a GT40 and get it through our complex IVA regulations. Both AK Sportscars and Tornado are well versed in the requirements and the parts they supply in their kits are compliant. However the builder still needs to follow the IVA regs with a very close eye on the detail. The best way to go is to build the car with virtually all new parts with exceptions being the engine and transmission (although I would recommend people to use a new ZF gearbox).
In mainland Europe it's now getting close to being impossible and registering an old kit built car is extremely difficult.
Also here in the UK, you will NOT be able to register a new petrol (or diesel) car as from 2030.
By the way I'm in northern Arizona mid-late April (Williams, Kingman and Lake Havasu). Pity you're not closer .... we could have a beer.
Cheers
Steve.

Steve, It would be nice to get together. If you ever get to Southern Arizona, let me know.

I still don't know why folks put up with such restrictive regulations. Doesn't anyone vote? Draconian regulations are not inevitable; vote the SOBs out of office!

 

[Malcolm]

In this image i beleive from my conversations with Ray Christopher in times past that a chassis number could well be stamped discretely in the void where the vertical red chassis member is. You may have to poke around and look on undersides of chassis rails etc as it was not meant to be easily visible. Never verified this information though!

In records I have both GTD prototypes have assigned chassis numbers from 1985. The first GTDs. Some chassis numbers are marked as not assigned. If this pratice was policy it therefore could be concluded that all chassis were given chassis numbers from day one. Not guaranteed though!

If the car has been given a V5 historically then IVA or whatever is irrelevant as registered. If never registered then thats another matter! It is possible to know a vague time frame of GTDs from the positioning of the rear ARB. Some went over the gearbox and some went under the rear clam hinge bar. Mine is the latter and was a 1990 chassis. Also how the hand brake cable was dealt with was another item that changed during the production run.

 

[Mark knight]

Thanks all, and Malcolm, I’ll check around the voids and underneath, I was also given a set of number plates made by Jepsons and using old lettering techniques. I’ve attached the engine number which is D20E-6015 AB ( which upon checking should be D for 1970’s and 2 for 1972. The 6015 is an engine (ford 302).

Let’s see what tomorrow brings.

Thanks All.

 

[Steve Dean]

Attention Brian Magee ....... I've sent you a PM.
Regards,
Steve Dean

 

[Lee Patterson]

2E2 = May 2, 1972 actual casting date. Ford 302 Windsor block