GT40 side impact protection

[Brisc P.]

Gents,

I was wondering if anybody has some nice photos of rollcages welded into GT40 replica frames? I think the original GT40 chassis as well as most of the replicas off the shelf would have fairly poor side impact characteristics - I have not noticed any intrusion bars built into the doors and since the doors extend over the roof into the centreline of the car, there is no roof member on the left-hand and the right-hand side that would give much protection if you were, for example, hitting a tree with the side of the vehicle.

Side-intrusion bars in the doors (shown in orange here) would certainly improve the situation.

Jason Ferraro's build has some nice, custom-made side-intrusion bars built into the doors. Are there any other examples for improved passive safety, in particular with respect to side impact protection?

 

[Rich McD]

I took one look at the RCR40 when I got it to realize there was nothing but fiberglass and a windshield to block a moose entering the cockpit with you. We have to worry about things like that around here. Ordered a full cage to add some steel up front shortly thereafter. As far as side protection is concerned, you sit pretty low, abeam the sponsons, so you have two fuel tanks to protect you. If you have to go, go in a spectacular fashion.

Upon further consideration, a '40 would only clip a moose's hooves, better a cow for the frontal threat.

 

[Randy V]

Here is my attempt at an Anti-Intrusion beam system. Is it Production Car quality? No. Is it better than anything offered by the manufacturers today? Don't know - but I can say that when I built it, you could not buy a system from any of the manufacturers as an add on...

http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-tec...-trim/28928-pardon-intrusion-gt40-safety.html

 

[Dimi Terleckyj]

Hi guys

Under the Australian Design Rules all our cars must have intrusion bars fitted into the doors.
DRB has them and they connect the hinges to the door locks both of which are fitted to the chassis.

Dimi

 

[Dave Hood]

We have no rules in South Carolina. The only thing protecting me from the oncoming vehicle is the 10 gallons of fuel located just to my left....

 

[Scott Calabro]

We have no rules in South Carolina. The only thing protecting me from the oncoming vehicle is the 10 gallons of fuel located just to my left....

Even better are the builders who install some triangulation on top of the tank sill, on space frame cars. Not only will they be roasting, they will be a human kabob when the sill top bars that face east/west impale their hips or torso.

:stunned:

 

[Pat]

A lot of these cars have fairly stout support within the sponson. The pictures below are of a CAV sponson interior looking front to back. I suspect other MONO cars are constructed similarly. If you take a hit there, the car will probably be pushed sideways before the sponson interior collapses.
For the doors, many racing organizations require Kevlar mat bonded to the interior of the bodywork. I club race a formula car and that's been a SCCA requirement for years. While it might do much for to stop a truck bumper collapsing the door, it would protect from spearing protrusions from poles, road signs etc.

 

[Brisc P.]

Thanks to everyone for their messages. I agree - the sponsons offer a fairly good support. My main concern are the missing roof-members on the left- and the right-hand side at the doors and the missing intrusion bars. The vertical center of gravity of the vehicle is most likely higher than the sponsons, which means that the car will roll itself into the tree (or traffic light beam, etc) until the tree hits the roof members that are unfortunately right in the center of the roof. There is literally no space left for the passenger in the cabin then, here some drawings to elaborate:<cite class="_Rm"><cite class="_Rm"><cite class="_Rm">

</cite></cite> </cite><cite class="_Rm"></cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite></cite><cite class="_Rm"></cite>

 

[Brisc P.]

Here is my attempt at an Anti-Intrusion beam system. Is it Production Car quality? No. Is it better than anything offered by the manufacturers today? Don't know - but I can say that when I built it, you could not buy a system from any of the manufacturers as an add on...

http://www.gt40s.com/forum/gt40-tec...-trim/28928-pardon-intrusion-gt40-safety.html

Thank you so much for this post. It may well be just as good as the designs used in production cars made from sheet metal. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Brisc P.]

Even better are the builders who install some triangulation on top of the tank sill, on space frame cars. Not only will they be roasting, they will be a human kabob when the sill top bars that face east/west impale their hips or torso.

:stunned:

Hi Scott - can you elaborate that point? I would like to learn more.

 

[Brisc P.]

Hi guys

Under the Australian Design Rules all our cars must have intrusion bars fitted into the doors.
DRB has them and they connect the hinges to the door locks both of which are fitted to the chassis.

Dimi

Hi Dimi, can you post some photos for us?

 

[Brisc P.]

We have no rules in South Carolina. The only thing protecting me from the oncoming vehicle is the 10 gallons of fuel located just to my left....

Are there any replica manufacturers that offer the option to install bladders in the sponsons? The sponsons are the most dangerous locations for storing the fuel. These bladders could potentially add a lot of safety.

There are a lot of standard, off-the-shelf sizes available from ATL and they are not too expensive.

Aero Tec Laboratories - Aero Tec Labs - Aerotech - ATL - Aerotec - AeroTech Labs, Fuel Cells_Cell, Bladders_Bladder, Bladder Tanks_Tank, Potable Water Bladders, Pillow Tanks_Tank_Containment, Portable Tanks_Tank, Liquid Storage, Collapsible Tanks_Tan

I would rather add a few months of my savings to my potential future build than driving without such a bladder in the sponsons.

 

[Brisc P.]

I took one look at the RCR40 when I got it to realize there was nothing but fiberglass and a windshield to block a moose entering the cockpit with you. We have to worry about things like that around here. Ordered a full cage to add some steel up front shortly thereafter. As far as side protection is concerned, you sit pretty low, abeam the sponsons, so you have two fuel tanks to protect you. If you have to go, go in a spectacular fashion.

Upon further consideration, a '40 would only clip a moose's hooves, better a cow for the frontal threat.

Do you have some images of the roll cage? They are typically made from Chrome Moly Steel which can be TIG welded relatively easily.

 

[Pat]

Are there any replica manufacturers that offer the option to install bladders in the sponsons? The sponsons are the most dangerous locations for storing the fuel. These bladders could potentially add a lot of safety.

These are very common and most of the replica manufactures offer the bladder cell. Here is the vacant CAV sponson pictured earlier with a cell from Fuel Safe going in it.

 

[Rich McD]

Take a look at the SPF GT40R's cage system, presumably race sanctioned. Looks quite robust but not very user friendly for parking at the mall.

 

[Randy V]

Thanks to everyone for their messages. I agree - the sponsons offer a fairly good support. My main concern are the missing roof-members on the left- and the right-hand side at the doors and the missing intrusion bars. The vertical center of gravity of the vehicle is most likely higher than the sponsons, which means that the car will roll itself into the tree (or traffic light beam, etc) until the tree hits the roof members that are unfortunately right in the center of the roof. There is literally no space left for the passenger in the cabin then, here some drawings to elaborate:<cite class="_Rm"><cite class="_Rm"><cite class="_Rm">

</cite></cite> </cite><cite class="_Rm"></cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite class="_Rm"> </cite><cite></cite><cite class="_Rm"></cite>

The reason that the roof members you call out are missing is - because unless you are barely 5' tall, ingress/egress is a contorsionist exercise to say the least... These cars are not very "scrutineer" friendly as you need to be able to exit the car via window. Not something I even want to consider. Also necessary would be the door bars to meet GT Spec. That would force you to crawl through a very small space..

RCR offers a bladder fuel system but you have to specify it at order time in order for them to leave out the baffles in the fuel sponsons. A couple of people here have taken on the task of cutting out the front of the sponsons and reaching in to cut the baffles out.. Not a fun job I am certain..

 

[Brisc P.]

The reason that the roof members you call out are missing is - because unless you are barely 5' tall, ingress/egress is a contorsionist exercise to say the least... These cars are not very "scrutineer" friendly as you need to be able to exit the car via window. Not something I even want to consider. Also necessary would be the door bars to meet GT Spec. That would force you to crawl through a very small space..

RCR offers a bladder fuel system but you have to specify it at order time in order for them to leave out the baffles in the fuel sponsons. A couple of people here have taken on the task of cutting out the front of the sponsons and reaching in to cut the baffles out.. Not a fun job I am certain..

I am over 6 foot and have decided not to build a GT40 at this stage, but properly restore another car because of that fact (GT40 interior way, way too small for me). I have asked a few manufacturers if they could build a larger GT40 - stretched in length, width and height by at least 10%. That would be really nice.

 

[Randy V]

I am over 6 foot and have decided not to build a GT40 at this stage, but properly restore another car because of that fact (GT40 interior way, way too small for me). I have asked a few manufacturers if they could build a larger GT40 - stretched in length, width and height by at least 10%. That would be really nice.

I am 6'-3" and fit in my RCR pretty well.. I have also built my own roll cage in the car to give me and my passenger some degree of rollover protection. The anti-intrusion beam is right at normal bumper height for most cars and should help (some) in a normal traffic accident. In a scenario like what you proposed, The cabin area will certainly be exposed, however, I feel the safeguards I've taken should be sufficient for my basic needs...

RCR is in the process of rolling out a new car that fits your requirements and then some...

 

[Brisc P.]

I am 6'-3" and fit in my RCR pretty well.. I have also built my own roll cage in the car to give me and my passenger some degree of rollover protection. The anti-intrusion beam is right at normal bumper height for most cars and should help (some) in a normal traffic accident. In a scenario like what you proposed, The cabin area will certainly be exposed, however, I feel the safeguards I've taken should be sufficient for my basic needs...

RCR is in the process of rolling out a new car that fits your requirements and then some...

The new Ford GT is about 15% larger in all dimensions than the GT40 and is a much better size. I somewhat do not like the shape as much though. I wish there would be a GT40 kit that is simply 15-20% larger, with all proportions kept the same, tires scaled properly, etc.

 

[Fran Hall RCR]

Thanks Randy
you mean this one fresh from the moulds.(unpolished gelcoat).?