Pilot bearing

Hi

I´m currently installing my gearbox and looking for all the parts needed.
One of it is the pilot bearing.
I measured the Crankshaft seat and it appears to be a 35 mm seat. The input shaft has a 15 mm diameter. So this would be a 6202 size ball bearing.
Is that what to be used in this application. I wonder a little about the metric dimension in the crankshaft ?

Porsche original part is a needle roller bearing 26 mm deep and 24 mm in diameter

Thanks for your help

TOM
 
Last edited:

flatchat(Chris)

Supporter
Like this Tom -- the bearing has to extend from the crank
Why jac ??
 

Attachments

  • Picture 198.jpg
    Picture 198.jpg
    36.9 KB · Views: 401
I went out in the shop and measured again. The original porsche pilot bearing will fit into a custom made bushing for the crankshaft and nicely support the inputshaft. It has not to extend as much as you show on your pic.
the input shaft hangs over the mounting surface by app 7 mm and the hole length of the 15 mm dia part is 9 mm. As the crankshaft hangs over the adapterplates mounting surface also by app. 1mm the bearing has to extend by app 6 mm over the crank leaving a 2mm gap to the dia increase of the inputshaft ( spline section). Thus the inputshaft is supported over a length of 13 mm.
Do you think this is suffcient?
The needles are directly running on the input shaft or is there an inner bearing ring inbetween?

Chris while you are on it. You remember that we discussed another clutch setup using Posche GT3 / GT2 parts. For the flywheel i measured the Ford bold pattern.
It seems to be a 3" bolt circle with the angle spread of the six holes ( clockwise) 60-60-60-60-55-65 degrees . Is this correct ?

Thanks
TOM
 
Last edited:

Randy V

Moderator-Admin
Staff member
Admin
Lifetime Supporter
Like this Tom -- the bearing has to extend from the crank
Why jac ??

Chris - This is what my (your design) pilot bearing looks like as installed in my crankshaft. It is driven all the way home inside the relief of the crank;

IMG_0421.jpg


IMG_0423.jpg


Tom - Email coming...
 
Why jac ??

I have seen the inner race of ball bearings 'try' to weld themselves on to the input shaft, making it virtually impossible to remove the trans, the ball race has a very tight limit for axial movement, the crank endfloat alone exceeds this limit, let alone any expansion/contraction in the bellhousing plus endfloat in gear shafts etc... when those happen your asking the inner race to move back and forward on the input shaft spigot...steel on steel & usually a very snug fit.
 
I've seen Pantera ZF input shafts ruined by needle (or roller) pilot bearings. That's a $1700 part, not counting the labor to R&R it!

For that reason I remain committed to the notion of a bronze (oillite) pilot bearing. Although nominally available at auto parts stores, not all bearings are created equally, and some of the cheap Chinese-made ones are magnetic!

I have a friend named Chris Difani who machines beautiful pilot bearings from a supreme grade of oillite for the Ford-to-ZF application. Here's the instructions he includes with each bearing he ships:

====

ZF-2 Pilot Shaft Bearing Installation Procedure:

Your new Oil-Lite Bearing is installed into the crankshaft pocket by FORCEFULLY using a block of HARD wood and a 2 pound (or 1 kilo), hand held sledge hammer! When obtaining the hardwood block, ensure that the block is large enough to provide both an area large enough to hold by hand, and an area that is large enough to strike with the 2 pound sledge hammer. These "areas" need to be large enough such that the chances of striking the hand holding the block are minimized. If the helper's hand is struck with the 2 pound sledge hammer, the friendship may suffer.

DO NOT STRIKE the bearing directly with the hammer!

NEVER HIT THE BEARING DIRECTLY!

ALWAYS HIT THE HARD WOOD BLOCK!

Securely HOLD THE HARD WOOD BLOCK AGAINST THE OUTSIDE FACE OF THE BEARING.

Be ABSOLUTELY SURE that the bearing STARTS SQUARE with the beveled end facing inwards.

Once the bearing is started into the pocket, drive it in with your hard wood block and hammer, until it seats fully. Before starting measure the depth of the pocket inside the crank, and write that measurement down. As you drive the bearing in, repeat the measurement against the exposed depth of the bearing, compare that measurement with the total depth of the pocket, and the depth of the bearing (0.7300 inches or 18.54MM). Proceed as necessary until the bearing is completely inserted. Confirm that the bearing is seated by comparing the original depth of the crankshaft pocket, with the total depth of the bearing, and the depth of exposed bearing surface (if any. All crankshaft pockets seem to be different.. With some being "more different" than others). Your original measurement, versus your "after" measurement, will tell you when you've inserted the bearing properly.

The bearing has a final finish Outside Diameter of 1.3800 inches. This dimension is 0.005 inches larger than the crankshaft pocket Inside Diameter. This is designed to create an "interference fit" of 0.005 inches, or 0.13MM. This is an absolute necessity to keep the bearing from coming loose from the crankshaft as the crank heats up during its service cycle.

Once the new ZF-2 Oil-Lite Pilot Shaft bearing is installed, you should have many miles of trouble free use. The Oil Lite bearing is 18% oil by weight, which is why it does not need to be lubricated. The bearing is made from sintered bronze, SAE 832, and is softer than the ZF-2 pilot shaft. If anything should happen to the shaft alignment, or anything else, the bearing will be destroyed instead of the Pilot Shaft (three years ago a ZF-2 Pilot Shaft cost approximately $1700. Much better to replace a $70 bearing than a $1700 shaft, plus the $800 of R&R labor).

If you have any questions, or comments, please contact Chris Difani, [email protected]
 
Just went to the Porsche Dealership nearby to buy an original 993 RS pilotbearing.

Guess what i got. It is ball bearing size 6202. I told them about our discussion and they said that is what porsche uses on all RS GT3 GT2 and turbos since the 90´s.

I try fitted offer the input shaft, It has a nice tolerated slip fit. mounted with grease there should be no issue with seizing. Plus it fits exactly the seat in the flywheel and crankshaft ( both are 35 mm seats)

TOM
 

flatchat(Chris)

Supporter
Oooops! you're right Randy, your pic of the installation is correct (my pic was for the photo shoot --apparently) .

Tom, the pilot brg. should hang out the same amount as the thickness of the adapter plate (approx 12mm )

The bolt pattern you desc. is correct, veiwing from the clutch face / looking at the crank --all on 3" pcd for 7/16"UNF bolts . A radial line from centre thru this offset bolt is where the counter weight / imbalance is --approx. (or metal off directly oppposite) ---- is it 50oz.,28oz.or neutral, PITA ???:stunned:

Needle roller brg., ball brg. or sinterlite ?? --failures seem to be about equal --the sintered bronze is probably the least damaging to the input shaft -- I prefer the ball race MO.

Tom --I'm waiting for you to tell me about the GT2/3 clutch bizzo :heart:
 
Tom --I'm waiting for you to tell me about the GT2/3 clutch bizzo :heart:

Let me work this thing out completely and you all will be informed. Just about to dial in the last missing piece- the starter. have found a great solution on that. Fit have to be confirmed yet, because i just have the drawings now.

TOM
 
Back
Top