Porsche GT3 vs GT40

[Ross Nicol]

Hi Tim
Yes Race 1 DNF.Well I got taken out on the 2nd lap.Coming over the top of the hill on the back straight and the Cobra Daytona making a desperate late braking move thought he saw a hole.I didn't feel the hit, car just swapped ends from what I thought was a wheel or tyre failure.Of course the story from his side ran the fallacy he was right up alongside me and I argued if I had seen him in my peripheral vision it would have been his corner.Broke my wheel and wrecked another $500 slick.He had a large circular gauging on his drivers door from the damaged wheel.Will have to fit a camera for rear view, may have saved the situation if I had seen him.Very Hot in the car with air temp over 30 degrees.Was a good idea to have a spare wheel made after the last shunt would have been out of it after the prang otherwise.
Ross

 

[flatchat(Chris)]

Time to invest in Porsche calipers and a G50 trans/ viscous diff,stiffen up the chassis a bit and you should be on the money with the porcupines then /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Ross Nicol]

Here's what is planned for next year Chris-
1/Replacement ZF with correct ratios (better suited to racing)
2/ 2 piece floating brake rotors
3/ Cockpit adjustable roll bars front and rear
4/ 8 throttle body cross ram manifold with tuned length trumpets.
5/ Replacement motor 302 with all good bits (500 hp predicted torque maximised)
6/ Rear view camera

I did predict I would be working on the handling for a season but it's turned into 2.My intention was to go bigger HP after handling was sorted.I don't suppose I've done too bad I've got 1 piece front rotors with no slots(AP six spot though), hydraulic lifters and gearing problems.I want to take weight out of the fibreglass clips too.Next year will be a whole new ball game as long as I can
avoid people tearing my wheels and tyres apart.
Ross

 

[Gregg]

JP, you never told us how Goodwood was on November 14th. Did you go? If so, what are your comments regarding the comparison of both cars? Thanks

 

[Malcolm]

Weather was not ideal as wet most of the day but 3 GT3's and 3 GTD's were there. One GT3 blew all away but a very competent driver at the wheel. Average all cars in each camp and I guess about equal (but only because of that one ace GT3 driver of course!!!). Whilst it was cold and damp a good day was had by all. And Charles didn't even spin!

 

[Nathan]

I am surprised by the responses. I know the GT3 is pretty tough. But if you sort out any problems your GT40 has I can't imagine you couldn't beat one or at least be equal.

I have a 914-6 and with a good driver(i.e. not me) it can stay right there with a GT3. Granted it's had alot of changes but it is still street legal and it is still a 914.

A GT40 with 500hp and well tuned suspension combined with aero dynamic aids, your saying it couldn't stay with or beat a GT3???

I'm just curious if you are comparing the GT40 of 40 years ago with a state of the art 2006 porsche? Or a modern take on a GT40.


But they are all really good cars!

 

[roaldin]

GT3s are remarkable cars with some very sophisticated electronics helping you along. One example is their "state of the art" ABS. It is so good that it means that all you have to do is hit your braking mark, the car will do the rest. You know the car will slow and turn in without having to be concerned about any normal issues such as "pinching" a brake etc.
This sort of thing makes it much easier to drive fast.

I am happy to be able to match (and beat ) a track prepped GT3, driven by a well known Australian race-driver, in my club car, without electronic aids. Unfortunately (for this forum's area of interest) my club car car is not my GT40. So far the GT is about 3 seconds behind at my local track. That is a pretty big gulf (pardon the pun).
I am however confident that I could get the car there with some fairly minor development. Whether I continue to pursue that is another thing altogether.
Certainly I think the GT40 (my RF at least) has plenty of potential to be faster.
Some of the time difference I would put down to my being braver in my club car than I am in the GT (I don't drive the GT all that much due to it aggravating a shoulder injury), but not all of it.
Power is not an issue, My GT (now) has plenty enough to pass a GT3 in a straight line.

As for aero aids, people are playing with splitters, diffusers and the like but I don't think many have gone to the extent of wings. A bit of an ugly appendage to what is otherwise the most beautiful car in the world (IMO).
In a racers world that last sentence doesn't make any sense, but most here have a GT40, at least in part, because of it's looks.

Tim.

 

[Johan]

Not sure if this helps any or not, but here is an article for a fog shortened parctice session for the June 2006 Grand Am Rolex race at the Glen.

quote
"WATKINS GLEN, N.Y. (June 1, 2006) -- Rolex 24 At Daytona GT class winner Ian Baas posted the fastest time in Thursday evening's fog-shortened practice session at Watkins Glen International, a lap time of 2:24.480 (84.718 mph) in the No. 36 Turbo Performance Center Porsche GT3.
Baas will co-drive in this weekend's Sahlen's Six Hours of The Glen with fellow Rolex 24 winner Randy Pobst. The duo was joined by Spencer Pumpelly and Michael Levitas in January's twice-around-the-clock classic. Baas is making his fourth Rolex Series start of the season this weekend, having finished third in the GT class in the VIR 400 and eighth last weekend at Lime Rock Park.
Andrew Davis posted the second-quickest time of the session, a lap at 2:25.369 (84.200 mph) in the No. 73 NEC Porsche GT3. Davis and co-driver Jim Tafel currently sit tied for 14th in the GT driver standings.
Third-quickest Thursday evening was Jean-Francois Dumoulin in the No. 22 FX DD Hazardus Sport/Denon Porsche GT3 for Fiorano Racing. The No. 22 machine hasn't competed since Round 3--the Linder Industrial Komatsu Grand Prix of Miami at Homestead-Miami Speedway."




I must say, and the risk of sounding showy which is not my intention, that Tom Mabey in his Gt40 and I in my T70 did consistent 2: 07's in the 40th Can Am reunion race there at the beginning of this month. We could have gone faster I'm sure as well. Ask any race driver. There were a million reasons we did not go faster.
Considering weather to be a factor might even things up a bit, but who knows. I'd rather think the old girls are still pretty fast. We have no traction control or vario cams or carbon rotors. We do however, have low end torque
to pull that hill.

 

[roaldin]

Using the extremely scientific "that sounds like about twice as long as a lap at my track" method, If I was that much faster than a GT3 it would have me down near the open wheel outright lap record at my local track!
Not bad considering both the GT3 and my car were on road legal tarmac race tyres and the open wheeler record is held on slicks!

Tyres, track plan, weather?
Just noticed your edit, that's cheating. Weather can make a tad of a difference.
(How far is a tad? In space terms, about half a million miles... - one of the Flying High movies. )

Tim.

 

[Nathan]

Yeah that's the hard part with aerodynamics. What will work best and what looks ok.

I'm in the middle of doing some aero work on the 914. I should have the finished airdam and splitter done in a few weeks. The rear I removed the valance and made an exhaust that mounts up and behind the tranny out of the air flow. Now I have to think about wether I want to put a wing or a duck bill on it. Wing is better, Hell wing with vortex on the roof is even better. But thats just ugly.

 

[Johan]

It must have been the WEATHER, but since this is the GT40 site, I did not want to ruin it ! The Audi R10 diesel cars are in the 1:40's and The Big block McLarens with 950hp were in the low 1:50s or high 1: 140s and there we were with headlights on and with room for a passenger. At Sebring for the 12 hour race, there are not hills and the lap times were very close. What can I say, I read it on the internet.
At Road Atlanta the GT3 cup cars can get to the high 1:20's and so can the T70's, which are 40 years old !

 

[roaldin]

It must have been the WEATHER, but since this is the GT40 site, I did not want to ruin it ! !

... What can I say, I read it on the internet. !

At Road Atlanta the GT3 cup cars can get to the high 1:20's and so can the T70's, which are 40 years old !

Tim.

 

[roaldin]

To be fair, the track I use for comparison isn't exactly GT40 heaven. One of these days I'll take it to another local track that's a bit more like home to a GT. I suspect it'll be a good deal more competitive there. The track is a comparative bore though (IMO).

Tim.

 

[Paolo-LoveGT40 Modelworks]

Ferrari

Cnnot really reply on this thread..cause u mention gt3 and my gt40 ....but also "Dirty red ones".
For any pasta pizza eating italiano, living near mamma and devoted to the Lord...the reds remain as your holy wife, even at home waiting for u,so nice and so expensive and ready to make u pay really expensive any little pleasure she can give u.
Ferrari are exactly that way...but when in Monza u hear theme running ...the heart goes always away with theme, even more if u can see originals GTOs or formula one cars(that damned fu***** engine.....damn...).
Almost always the bad point is about the ferrari owners, nearly never pilots, but just people that wants to show up something expensive.

In my opinion is anyway a little mistake try compare one of the last porsches to a living legend as the gt40 is.
Will be maybe better compare that with 911 rsr or Carrera 2.7rs cars (or as in real..to 906s).
In my little experience I have to admit porsches are always a good way between real race cars and everyday vehicles,too well finished and able to give great motion to anybody drives theme (including wifes..)
Surely a different thing than the legend of the 40, even more if we try consider track prototypes as Ross car (I adore try understand the specs of your car Ross, really...think that red is probably better and really faster than many many originals gt40s..and still going on in improvments)

Also in Le mans...I tryied not to say anything..buy to see the red (think France plated ) Enzo was really something special.
Ferrari is something u just can own...but remains property of the people around u, for the pelasure that always gives (and with all the problems involved..).

Between gt3 and gt40 I will have no doubts at all,and will decide in a while...for the legend.

Paolo (sorry guys..but never forget I am italiano inside..ehehe)

 

[OhioMark]

At last years SCCA "Runoff's" at Mid-Ohio, Freddy Baker, who's no slouch
behind the wheel, couldn't run with the C5's, C6's & new Vipers with his
GT2 or GT3 Porsche. I believe he qualified 10th out of 24(?) and may have
finished 8th(?) etc...Thanks!

Mark

 

[JackW]

Paolo you are a poet. So passionate. then again, you are Italian! Keep up the great posts.

Regards

Jack