4th of July
- Thread starter MHNCO
- Start date
Eh? I dunno, I really dunno.... :shifty:
I think I'd prefer it Kid Rock's way :rockonsmile:
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvTHtxxZ9r0]Kid Rock - If I Were President Live in Cleveland Ohio - YouTube[/ame]
Cheers!
Doug
I'm just so relieved that the US finally came and saved our butts from the nazi's. Perhaps if the US had of joined in sooner, things would have been even better for all of us?. Any 'see you next tuesday' can join a fight when everyone else with actual balls has beaten each other to death, and say they saved us.
Perhaps if the Japs had hit Pearl sooner, and you guys got off the fence in the early days of WWII, thousand of lives may have been saved by the addition of your might.
Still, at least the rest of the free world softened them up enough for you to feel capable of joining in with the odds already stacked in your favour
Thanks America.
We appreciate it. You guys rock. Although I personally prefer those of you that don't bang that 'we saved the world' drum quite so hard.
Perhaps if the Japs had hit Pearl sooner, and you guys got off the fence in the early days of WWII, thousand of lives may have been saved by the addition of your might.
Still, at least the rest of the free world softened them up enough for you to feel capable of joining in with the odds already stacked in your favour
Thanks America.
We appreciate it. You guys rock. Although I personally prefer those of you that don't bang that 'we saved the world' drum quite so hard.Plus 1.I'm just so relieved that the US finally came and saved our butts from the nazi's. Perhaps if the US had of joined in sooner, things would have been even better for all of us?. Any 'see you next tuesday' can join a fight when everyone else with actual balls has beaten each other to death, and say they saved us.
Perhaps if the Japs had hit Pearl sooner, and you guys got off the fence in the early days of WWII, thousand of lives may have been saved by the addition of your might.
Still, at least the rest of the free world softened them up enough for you to feel capable of joining in with the odds already stacked in your favour
Thanks America.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
Military deaths WW2:
In 6 years of fighting:
Australia.........................39,800
United Kingdom...............383,800
In 3.5 years of fighting
United States..................416,800
Military deaths on D-Day:
Australia.............................14
United Kingdom................2,543
Military deaths on D-Day:
United States..................4,696
Canada's contributions, in terms of importance and sacrifice since WWI should not be forgotten.
July 1 ,2013 - Happy 146 Birthday Canada!
July 1 ,2013 - Happy 146 Birthday Canada!
And Germany - 9,000
Ah yes, I had completely forgotten that in Military terms, America counts it's mission success/failure in body bags.
Still, a casualty count is always a sobering and distressing thought. We should also thank God that Russia was involved in both WW1 and WWII as without their tragic and huge sacrifice, none of us would be posting here.
As it's approaching 4th July (see what I did there?) it's worth repeating a favourite story of mine from 1982. I had just opened a wine bar in Brighton and had been approached by some Americans to apply for a later licence in order to help celebrate 4th July with a party. As was the legal requirement of the time, I duly submitted a letter from the party organiser and applied for a 1 hour extension.
In court, the case was called and I entered the witness box, took the oath and answered the Magistrates questions concerning the application.
There were no objections from Police or residents.
The Bench retired to consider (which was odd) and when they came back, the Chairman looked over his glasses at me and said (I shit you not) -
"Mr Hardy, your application is denied. We see no reason why the loss of one of our former colonies should be celebrated"
The sound of 50 or so jaws dropping in the court was thunderous to say the least!
Proving once again that how clearly any law or government 'regulation/process' is written actually means nothing. What matters is the agenda of the individual(s) who may be applying/enforcing it (or not!) at any given time.
'Seems to be the case 'round the world.
JIm, can you drill into your data and see what percentage of American deaths in WWII relates to the European Vs Pacific Theaters? That may prove interesting considering the current deabte relates to the US having 'saved' the rest of us.
I mean no disrespect whatsoever, but suspect that a greater effort was extended from the US toward defending itself from the Japs, rather than defending 'us' from the Germans?
I mean no disrespect whatsoever, but suspect that a greater effort was extended from the US toward defending itself from the Japs, rather than defending 'us' from the Germans?
Indeed it does Larry.
It was agreed by Roosevelt and Churchill that Europe should be dealt with with the majority of resources as a priority over the Pacific. This of course leads one to believe that should America have treated the Pacific war as a priority, which would have been entirely logical, then perhaps they could have defeated Japan or at least isolated them using the best of their resources whilst minimising casualties.
When one looks at this era it quickly became apparent that many political and military decisions were made in both theatres because of mistrust/paranoia of the Russians. Once the Americans had destroyed much of Japan's Navy and Airforce and the only undefeated Japanese force in the field was a million or so in Manchuria, there was no need to invade the Japanese Homeland or even drop the atom bomb on it. This act was simply to both impress and deny the Russians at the same time as they were about to invade and the US and Britain certainly didn't want that.
Japan never intended to go to war with America anyway, in a war they knew they couldn't win. The fact they actually did was a royal cock-up of diplomacy and Machiavellian manoeuvrings of both the right wing Japanese military and Winston Churchill who knew of the coming attack and simply "forgot" to tell the Americans.
I wouldn't debate about casualties. I higher body count does not necessarily mean a higher commitment or moral purpose or even enemy superiority- it could just as likely signal incompetence.
Talking of which, the only significant casualty count that matters when discussing the merits (or otherwise) of war is the 50,000 British & Commonwealth casualties in the initial 10 minutes of the First Battle of the Somme July 1st 1916, 97 years ago TODAY.
You see? You've forgotten already.....:sad:
Jim's figures omit 67,000 UK & Commonwealth CIVILIAN casualties due to enemy action and crimes against humanity - which takes the total to 500,000 give or take a leg or two.
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A well made explanation Keith. I understand a little more now as a result. I certainly wouldn't have gone down the body count/statistical route by my own choosing. I will leave my previous post up, if only to serve to demonstarte that I shouldn't really have posted it. I do not know enough about the subject to have a comment worth making.
Apologies to anyone who reads it. And apologies for not knowing it was the anniversary of the Somme.
Apologies to anyone who reads it. And apologies for not knowing it was the anniversary of the Somme.
You should never rule out the sleight of hand and mind exercised by Winston Churchill. He was desperate to get the USA in the war and Pearl Harbour gave him the opportunity. Interestingly, America immediately declared war on Germany when they didn't have to. Ironically, Germany never "declared" war on anyone!
There was no obligation for the Americans to step into WWII until they were attacked. They cleverly exchanged real estate for hardware and were co-combatants in all but name only and I'm quite sure that "perfidious Albion" would have done exactly the same if the roles were reversed.
Britain was well fucked anyway and had no stomach or resources for a fight anywhere on the globe and Hitler's (and Tojo's) strategy was very much based on this apparent weakness. It still galls me that 30,000 UK and Commonwealth troops surrendered Singapore to the Japanese with hardly a shot being fired though.
This kind of behaviour gave much strength to our enemies and tainted us with a deserved reputation for being 'weak' - a reputation we still suffer today, but in truth, if you take the one million + WWI British & Commonwealth war dead a mere 20 years previously, is it any wonder the fight had gone out of us?
Shocking figures than cannot be imagined today - but should be remembered.
Jim Craik
Lifetime Supporter
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