Halibrand wheels question

[Mike Drew]

Hi guys,

I originally posed this question on the Superformance corner of the website, but it didn't gain much traction there, so I am re-addressing it here (hopefully to a wider audience).

I have noticed that while Superformance is offering the Mk II with Halibrand-style wheels, they seem to offer the Mk 1 only with the later BRM wheels. Those wheels didn't come into play until the 1968 season, and even then seemingly only on cars that were relatively new at the time (i.e. older cars continued to run with older wheels).

Used to be that Cobra Restorers carried "Cobra" Halibrands and also "GT40" Halibrands in their catalog; that isn't the case anymore. I wasn't paying much attention back then, but I recall not really being able to tell the difference (the photographs were quite small).

So, in thinking about this, my question has multiple parts:

1) Did the Mk 1 GT40s circa 1965-1966 use the same wheels as the 1966 Mk II cars, i.e. the wheels offered by Superformance?

2) Were the GT40 wheels (either flavor, if they are not the same as one another) the same as those used on Cobras, or were there subtle differences?

3) If neither the Cobra wheels nor the Superformance Mk II Halibrand wheels are 'correct' for a Mk 1, does anybody know a source of 'correct' Mk 1 Halibrands?

I went to the Halibrand website and it was beyond useless--they didn't have a single photo of ANY of their wheels????

Thanks for any thoughts/reflections on the matter....

 

[Tim Kay]

Mike,​

I can shed a little light here.​

#1) Not sure​

#2) Definitely a difference. The first photo below is a "Cobra" style
Halibrand and the second picture is a "GT40" Halibrand (original). The
easiest way to spot the difference is in the curved shape
"champagne glass" configuration you get with the "GT40" style.​

​

#3) I believe the following company makes the "GT40" wheels:
PS ENGINEERING - 310-534-4477
Torrance, California​

 

[Dutton]

Hi Mike,

Tim sure nailed items 2 and 3 on your list; let me take a whack at #1.

Racing versions of the GT used Borrani wire wheels in 1964. Halibrands became available over the winter and the change was made before the 1965 race season. Reportedly Halibrands offered better performance than did the wire wheels from only one season before.

As for the 'road' versions of the Mk. 1 and all Mk. 3's, they were all, to my knowledge, equipped with the Borrani wires.

Happy Holidays,

T.

 

[DON SILAWSKY]

"BRM" pattern wheels were in use on Mk I GT40s at least by June 1966, as my car #P1040 used them in the 1966 Le Mans race. Just two months earlier at the Monza race, I think my GT40 ran on Halibrands but am not sure, so perhaps BRM rims became available some time after April 1966. At 1966 Le Mans trials (also April, I believe), my car used Borrani wire wheels for at least part of the test sessions. The big block Mk II GT40s appeared to have used Halibrand rims exclusively, even after BRM rims were available, but this is just IMO and could be incorrect.

I have a number of original Halibrand GT40 rims if anyone is seriously interested.

 

[Chris Martino]

My Halibrand's were ordered from IMAGE Wheels who do an excellent replica (even though they named it 'Cobra') in 5 or 6 pin knock-on.

Cast Wheels


Chris

 

[Bill Hara]

Borrani's were used on race cars until early 1965, when the switch to Halibrands as shown above happened. MkII cars stayed with Halibrand wheels but the MkI's changed to BRM's in 66 due to short supply of Halibrand wheels. The road cars (MkI and III) retained Borrani wheels unless specifically ordered with Halibrand or BRM until 1967 when the BRM's became standard for all MkI's, but the MkIV used a totally diffrent rim as seen in the photo below - don't know what it is called or if the are replicated by anyone anymore...

 

[Rick Muck- Mark IV]

the MkIV used a totally diffrent rim as seen in the photo below - don't know what it is called or if the are replicated by anyone anymore...

"Turbo Flipster" as per the boxes of MPC and IMC MK IV models of the day. Vanes were pitched to pump air out of the brake area, they are left and right handed. I don't know what Ford called them. I think Halibrand did the castings, but I am not certain. J6, what say you?
Rick

 

[frank beuker]

i've got original cobra hallibrands

 

[DON SILAWSKY]

It occurred to me that there are were at least two different styles of rims made by Halibrand for GT40s, "small window" and "big window." I think the "small window" looks pretty much like the Cobra rim in Tim Kay's earlier message. The "big window" is, I think, the rim in the second photo. I am pretty sure that I have both types of rims in the parts stash for #1040. I will dig them out and post photos when I get the chance.

 

[PF]

Another difference between the "cobra" halibrands and the "GT40" halibrands is that the GT40 version have a 4" wide hub for clamping and the Cobra version has only a 3" wide clamping hub. We run 8" and 10" wide rims on 1005 which is a 1965 car. We produce these rims if any one is interested in sets.

 

[Dean Lampe]

How much is a set of these wheels? Can you dill the pin holes to fit the RCR pattern?

 

[John W]

mkII rims were wider than mkI rims, according to most books I've read. Not sure if the later Gulf flared cars ran the same width wheels as mkIIs though.

 

[frank beuker]

here's a better picture of a cobra halibrand

 

[Lew]

Another difference between the "cobra" halibrands and the "GT40" halibrands is that the GT40 version have a 4" wide hub for clamping and the Cobra version has only a 3" wide clamping hub. We run 8" and 10" wide rims on 1005 which is a 1965 car. We produce these rims if any one is interested in sets.

Do you still make these?

Lew

 

[Cliff Beer]

As far as the modern "Cobra" version/copy of the Halibrands (such as what is sold by Vintage Wheels), I believe these are mostly five pin wheels, correct? The original GT40 Halibrands of the day were six pin, yes?

PS Engineering supposedly makes the original GT40 (wine glass) style of Halibrands, but holy cow, they're hard to get in touch with....

Does anybody know where Superformance gets the original GT40 style wheels from??

 

PS Engineering no longer makes the wine glass style Halibrand - at least that was what Phil Schmidt told me when I contacted him about a year ago. Neither do M&A castings who also made them some years back.

 

[Rick Muck- Mark IV]

Does anybody know where Superformance gets the original GT40 style wheels from??

They are made for Superformance by WheelCraft (WaW) in aluminum with the six-pin drive pattern, both the BRMs and the Halibrand design.

We have them available but only in the six-pin knock-off setup, no five pins or bolt-ons.

 

[Kelly]

As far as the modern "Cobra" version/copy of the Halibrands (such as what is sold by Vintage Wheels), I believe these are mostly five pin wheels, correct? The original GT40 Halibrands of the day were six pin, yes?

Vintage does offer the 17" Cobra Halibrands in 6-pin and in GT40 offset as direct replacements for the SPF 15s. See below for pic of the from the set presently on P2174.

Best,
Kelly

 

[Cliff Beer]

They are made for Superformance by WheelCraft (WaW) in aluminum with the six-pin drive pattern, both the BRMs and the Halibrand design.

We have them available but only in the six-pin knock-off setup, no five pins or bolt-ons.

Hi Rick,

Thank you. The Superformance/WheelCraft wheels look a whole load better than the "Cobra" Halibrand copies on my CAV. Love to have a set of those, just have to figure out how to conveniently go from 5 pin to 6 pin on my hubs.....

 

[Geert-Jan]

Where to order?
I can't find them on the www. I just keep getting bicycle wheels!