I have changed my status....

[Kevin L]

Kevin,

Do you happen to still have the link to that E-bay auction? I couldn't find it.

Oh, and to dogpile on here, CONGRATS! :thumbsup:

Thanks!

Here you go:
1966 Superformance GT40 2dr Coupe WEST CHICAGO, Illinois | Chicago Motor Cars

It is not listed on eBay right now but just wait, I am sure it will be soon. I will tell you that the dealership employees and owner were not overly honest. Here were a few of the misinformed nuggets of information they attempted to tell me the day I went to look at the car:

"It is worth more because it is the only RHD car Superformance ever made"... Apparently they did not know that Superformance makes cars for the UK, that and we know there are many in the US with RHD
"It is the only Gulf colored car made by Superformance"...Sure, Ok
"Over 190K was put into the car"...Umm, where and how?
"You can buy it for full price today but nothing less since a guy from Norway, no, New Zealand is in route right now to O'Hare and is going to buy it for full price, he has been flying for three days"...Yes, he did correct himself about the Norway to NZ bit when I was standing there

I won't go into any more detail since it simply does not matter but I did correct him on the incorrect bits and then called BS on the story of the New Zealand buyer. Let's just say they would not call me back the following week when I wanted to find out why the New Zealand buyer did not buy the car. Otherwise, the car was nice but I never drove it or started it so no idea how it ran.

To contrast that experience, the individual I bought my car from also owned a car dealership, in fact multiple. He was as honest as they come and was kind enough to show me his garage of many beautiful Fords and his Father's garage. In his Father's garage, there were six real vintage Porsche race cars with racing heritage, most that had been raced in the 60's by his Father for Porsche. Included were:
904
905
906
907
908

I may have been off on one of those designations but I know the 904 was there and the numbers went up sequentially for a while. In addition there were two vintage SL Mercedes, a Ferrari, and an old 911; they were stunning and it was an incredibly fun day.

Just thought I would share more of the purchasing experience

Kevin

 

[Mike Drew]

Thanks for the link!

Between their asking price and their attitude, I suspect they will be holding onto this car for a good long time...:laugh:

 

[Charlie Farley]

I'm going to wind this bunch of hooligans up.
Now, when i call them up, should i be Jackie Oliver... maybe Derek Bell, hhmm
or Jackie Stewart. I can do the accent.
Along the lines of " tell me son, have you ever driven, let alone seen an original ? Do you know what it means to do 215 mph down the Mulsanne ? By the way, how many times did you win the 24 hr race ? Can you spell Le Mans ?

 

[Kevin L]

I'm going to wind this bunch of hooligans up.
Now, when i call them up, should i be Jackie Oliver... maybe Derek Bell, hhmm
or Jackie Stewart. I can do the accent.
Along the lines of " tell me son, have you ever driven, let alone seen an original ? Do you know what it means to do 215 mph down the Mulsanne ? By the way, how many times did you win the 24 hr race ? Can you spell Le Mans ?

I like it

 

[Kevin L]

Spent the entire day in/with the car and it is fantastic. Love the way it drives and pulls. Unfortunately, there was one small problem and the end result was a tow truck taking it home...

I had driven it about 200 miles today and stopped for a long dinner with family. Fired up the car and started to drive home. Outside temperature was around 55 degrees and I was driving about 60 mph in 5th when it started to pop, like a backfire. Oil and water temp was up to normal and I had gone about 12 miles when it started to happen. I pulled over and it would not idle well although it kept running. It sounded like it was missing on a cylinder; educated guess.

Oil pressure was fine but I shut it down and called a flatbed. It is now safe, albeit crippled, in the garage. Right now my guess is electrical but I don't have a great way to know what it is.

Thoughts on how to diagnose it?

Thanks!

Kevin

P.S. I had prepared myself that the car was going to break at some point so all is fine, with that said, I did think I would make it past the first day with it.

 

[Jack Houpe]

Check fuel pressure then plug wires. That is a bumber about the tow truck.

 

[Kevin L]

Fired it again this morning, not as much of a pop as a loud "click" on one of the cylinders... Going to call the engine builder

 

[Kevin L]

The trip home was the best gas mileage the car will ever achieve

 

[Rich E.]

"Click" can be from an exhaust leak or a valve train issue. Are you comfortable enough to pull a valve cover off yourself? I would do as Jack says. Check the plugs and wires to make sure they're not fouled or burned through. Also you can take a squirt bottle and spray some water on the header flange. If you've got a cylinder that's not firing the water won't sizzle off. That might narrow your search.

 

[Jack Houpe]

Dang Rich thats a good idea, better than the touch and ouch!

 

[Kevin L]

Great ideas, thanks

I was not in a position to pull the valve cover myself this morning although with a little additional confidence I am sure I could. I had to leave the car at the lake house and bolt back to Chicago today for a flight out. I am not going to be around the car until next Saturday at the earliest.

I did talk to the previous owner this morning and he diagnosed it as a broken rocker arm. Apparently he had the same issue about 1.5 years ago with the same type of noise on the passenger side bank, cylinder 1 or 2; same area it is making noise now.

Going to put a call into the engine builder tomorrow and get a few references of where to take the car in Southern WI or Northern IL. I should hopefully get some answers once we yank the valve cover.

Hopefully the rocker broke in such a way that it enabled the valve to stay closed... we shall see.

Kevin

 

[Rich E.]

Any updates Kevin? The spring keeps the valve closed. If you had a broken spring that allowed piston to valve contact you'd know it.

BTW, what kind of parts were used for the valvetrain? I seem to remember T&S having a problem with their rocker setups awhile back.

 

[Kevin L]

Yes, I finally pulled off the head (today) and found the problem. Looks like the roller bearing in the rocker arm exploded. I found roller bearing parts in under the valve cover and half of the rocker arm. One thing I also noted was the wear on the roller arm (whatever it is called), it does not look like the rest of the arms. Could be due to the failure or might this indicate a different issue?

In the picture, it is the roller arm fourth from the right. Also note the break in the last picture, if you look just right and down from the valve cover bolt hole (where there is a bit of oil) you will see the outline of the broken metal.

The concerning thing is that apparently this occurred before as noted by the previous owner. He also mentioned the 1st or 2nd cylinder. I have an ALMS race car mechanic coming over this afternoon, I am hoping he has more insight. Here are some pictures of the damage.

Other questions:
- Would you replace all the rocker arms?
- Before putting it back together one would obviously remove all the roller bearing parts and change the oil. Anything else?
- Why might this happen?

Thanks!

 

[Jac Mac]

Kevin, they look like Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers, if so the main body is cast from 8650 chrome moly steel & guaranteed for life against breakage.

Now for that to break you would have to be concerned that there might be another reason. I would check that particular valve stem for possible seizure in the guide, either from lack of lubrication or a bent valve from a possible over-rev with previous owner, I also wonder if these rockers were part of the repair from the early problem if the motor was originally built with lower quality items initially.

Whatever you find it would pay to have a competent man go thru the entire valve train system & check its all compatible.... an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure....

 

[Kevin L]

Kevin, they look like Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers, if so the main body is cast from 8650 chrome moly steel & guaranteed for life against breakage.

Now for that to break you would have to be concerned that there might be another reason. I would check that particular valve stem for possible seizure in the guide, either from lack of lubrication or a bent valve from a possible over-rev with previous owner, I also wonder if these rockers were part of the repair from the early problem if the motor was originally built with lower quality items initially.

Whatever you find it would pay to have a competent man go through the entire valve train system & check its all compatible.... an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure....

Thanks, I had a competent guy over today. He went through the motor and had similar concerns you voiced. A couple of things:

1) The roller bearing had enough heat to wear through the heat treatment
2) The lash appeared to be off on at least one other cylinder; it was at .030 and actually wiggled a bit. The other rocker arms has lash between .019 and .025

At this point I am attempting to track down the cam profile and understand what happened prior to my ownership. Best case is that the lubrication was bad at first start up and there was premature wear.

Once I have some background we are going to decide if we load up with a full new set of rockers or pull the motor and do more.

Kevin

 

[Kevin L]

Talked to the builder. He said this is the third rocker to go out of the same batch. The last one that went on this motor was on the first cylinder. At this point I am thinking it was a bad batch of rocker arms since all three broke the same way, blowing the bottom of the cage out.

Cam card should come tomorrow but the builder said it was not that aggressive of a cam and had some duration on it; he said it should not be hard on parts.

Therefore I think the plan is going to be to replace the all lifters, replace all rockers, and put a stabilizer bar on top. We will also take a look through each of the valves and springs per your suggestion Jac to see if anything is out of tolerance.

Looks like we are on the way home; at least I hope.

Kevin

 

[Rich E.]

I seem to remember one of the cam companies having problems with a batch of rocker arms due to poor bearing choice. I can't remember if it was Comp or not though. Did you catch all the metal from the failure? Personally I wouldn't be able to sleep until I pulled the pan, filter, and maybe a cap or two to see if the oiling system migrated some of it.

.02
Rich.

 

[Neal]

Had the same issue with those. Comp replaced the full set at no charge.

 

[Jimmy P]

Kevin, I had the same problem with mine. The first rocker arm that broke was a "Scorpion" "blue" rocker. After the break I went with Crane rockers and one of those broke. I was told by the mechanic the Crane rockers he was putting on the car were "top quality" and would "last forever" only to have one of them go after less than 100 miles. I took the Crane to a local mechanic who advised the rockers I was using were nothing special and that the "scorpion" were a much better quality. To his credit the mechanic who put on the Crane rockers stood by his work and replaced the rockers back to Scorpions and paid for the labor too. I've had no problems since. Touch wood! The company that built my engine initially was T&L out of NC. They are now out of business after many, many issues. Who built your engine? T&L had rocker problems too with a bad batch being used. Some say they were using Chinese knock-off parts. Who knows. One thing I've learned...everyones got an opinion and feel their opinion is the only one thats right. Its been one of the most difficult parts of owning this car. Who to listen to and who to trust. Good Luck in your fix.

 

[Kevin L]

Had the same issue with those. Comp replaced the full set at no charge.

Oddly.. that makes me feel much better. Sorry to hear your problem but good to hear I am not the only one.

Thanks